WTF Mickster

guys, vines is pretending to be n00b, you have all bee fooled. he is now more well known in this forum than CW and VT2 put together, that was his plan all along

Was that my plan? I didn't know I had a plan. . . I didn't get the memo.

so going back to the original thread (if anyone remembers it!) If a dwarf runs 30% MORE thief science then a human/orc/d.elf/elf, am i right that his mod tpa will be the same as theirs? (assuming same raw tpa/ building efficency/ wt & td %age)

You're wrong, because the game works on multipliers.
If the dwarf has the same exact bonuses from science and thieves' dens as a human, it will still have 30% less mod TPA.

Here's an example caracal:

Dwarf with 80% thievery sci vs lets say an Elf with 50% thievery sci. Raw tpa 3:

Dwarf 3*.7*1.8 = 3.78 mod tpa

Elf 3*1.5 = 4.5 mod tpa

The -30% is a multiplier, so 30% science will not just offset the penalty.

0.7 x 1.429 = 1

You need 42.9% thievery science to cancel the dwarf race penalty

Math doesn't work that way.

What do you mean VT2? That statement was accurate.

I was talking to the poster above me - not you.

I know, his statement was correct tho. 42.9% science will offset the dwarf penalty.

It won't 'offset' the penalty, because it's still a multiplier.
An orc with 42.9% science will still have better TPA than a dwarf with 42.9% science.

That's what people need to understand.
You can't cancel the penalty, and no matter how much you add to your science, you'll still have less TPA than someone else, running the same science and raw as you.

I wasn't comparing it to an enemy tpa with equal numbers VT2. I was only pointing out that he was right that 1 raw tpa modded with 30% penalty and 42.9% bonus is 1 tpa. But yes of course running equal numbers the dwarf will always behind.

He meant 42.9% MORE science. Read his original question VT2, he did specify "more" than the other races.

Even better - if the dwarf could run a 20% larger bonus from TDs, he would only need 20% more crime science.

*Sorry, he would need 20% more crime science BONUS.

It only works at 42.9%, you can't just add 42.9% to existing sci to make your tpa mod offset the -30%.

Ex: Dwarf with 92.9% Thievery Sci vs Elf with 50% Thievery Sci (notice the Dwarf has 42.9% more) running 3 raw tpa and 0 TDs.

rawtpa*sci*race(dw) = mod tpa
Dw: 3*1.929*.7 = 4.05 mod tpa
Elf: 3*1.5 = 4.5 mod tpa

The 42.9% only works assuming exactly 42.9% sci on Dw and 0% sci on the opposing non-gnome race. In that case the mod tpa would be even for both provs. As enemy sci increases, the dwarf will have to increase his sci even more, since the -30% is multiplicative.

thanks guys, didn't realise it was such a big disadvantage, i better build some more watchtowers. lucky they work 30% better for dwarf