Spartans Vs Nonpandas

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12-09-2016, 06:37
StratOcastle

I know. I got stuck on YouTube for an hour because top players don't get along.

Don't tell me it's the competition speaking. It's not the meta either. There's a funny attraction some people have to being Star Bellied Sneetches(look it up).

I recall at work some guy asking my ethnic origin and I explained I was a mutt. He proudly countered he was Serbian, and I thought "I hadn't even heard about you till 1991" and welcome to America.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRTHdC7k4uY
12-09-2016, 06:51
MyNameIsMatija

Quote:

Originally Posted by StratOcastle

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRTHdC7k4uY

Fitting: the video is not available in your country
12-09-2016, 07:51
Elit

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judge

15? And I thought the only other competent player apart from Dorje and Zauper is you.

Go home Flogger, You are Drunk!

Drink or not his post still make sense so lets him post!

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

No love for Elit? :((

I don't know his feelings but still i think he is one from my fans! :)
12-09-2016, 08:34
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by StratOcastle

I think a lot of tops take pump sessions as routine. When I was with Pyro the pump was fairly well controlled, but I'm an active with a mentality toward overview. Nesta was a well ordered mind and pump strategy is something I think came to him easily. Sparta is fairly new up top and while the knowledge may be there the experience isn't. They may not project "medians" as Zauper, for instance, explains like turning the light off in a closet.

Additionally, Sparta is on uneasy ground. I'm neutral as to the reasons, but I'm fully aware of the danger. I'd imagine Sparta must keep more defensive troops and approach this war with conservative reasoning. They couldn't hope to pump with abandon because the opposition also has their Jesters or Remote1 out there. Nobody is coming to save Sparta.

I thought I had laid the basis of that routine last age. We pretty much outpumped everyone and with a little coordination we easily pumped to -2/-3 ppa for each conflict (remember, Pyro was even OOR and couldn't declare). Yes, most in the KD are on uneasy ground but the fact is we don't lack the knowledge really, it's more something called "deep craft". Me and a few others know how to pull it off, have communicated this to the players but the knowing - doing gap is always there. Doing something after having it explained to you isn't the same as doing something for the 300th time in your 40th whoring age.

Explained it to my KD last age. A leader has ~ these tasks:

1. Play your own prov
2. Check other provs in your KD to see what they're doing
3. Communicate with people on individual builds
4. Diplo
5. Meta movement
6. War strategy
7. War coordination
8. Controlling emotions and making sure everyone gets along + motivating peeps

I used to do all of them, now I only do 4 (top diplo), 5, 6, 8. 1-3 and 7 are most time-consuming for a leader but does give you that extra 10%.

It's probably most realistic that us and Pandas are just going to destroy each other with no winners (even the winner would be a loser). Then it is between Emeriti and BB to decide the age.
12-09-2016, 09:11
MyNameIsMatija

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bart of Sparta

Me and a few others know how to pull it off, have communicated this to the players but the knowing - doing gap is always there. Doing something after having it explained to you isn't the same as doing for the 300th time in your 40th whoring age.

I don't see it that way. What's so special about pumping in whoring tier against pumping in warring tier? If anything while I was playing in FS I pumped way deeper because when an even war is arranged the only edge over your opponent you can personally achieve is pumping out the most out of the piece of land you have. Whoring is more about oow play as in finding the right targets and things like that while the LS has to monitor the intricate CF deals - their terms and expiration dates. Sure a bit more strategy is involved in whoring conflicts simply because the competition is stiffer but that changes nothing for the regular grunt. My point is a good active warring tier grunt, after learning the basics of what constitutes a good whoring target, will outperform a "pro slacker" any day. Reasons for failure should be found in the competence of the LS, KD structure, overall discipline and similar. That is not to say that someone is incompetent but that there will always be someone who holds a slight edge.
12-09-2016, 09:20
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

I don't see it that way. What's so special about pumping in whoring tier against pumping in warring tier? If anything while I was playing in FS I pumped way deeper because when an even war is arranged the only edge over your opponent you can personally achieve is pumping out the most out of the piece of land you have. Whoring is more about oow play as in finding the right targets and things like that while the LS has to monitor the intricate CF deals - their terms and expiration dates. Sure a bit more strategy is involved in whoring conflicts simply because the competition is stiffer but that changes nothing for the regular grunt. My point is a good active warring tier grunt, after learning the basics of what constitutes a good whoring target, will outperform a "pro slacker" any day. Reasons for failure should be found in the competence of the LS, KD structure, overall discipline and similar. That is not to say that someone is incompetent but that there will always be someone who holds a slight edge.

So how long has FS been playing at the top end of the game? Not just talking whoring, but winning crowns and performing at a high level. Now ask yourself where Sparta was 3-4 ages ago. This is exactly the difference I'm referring to.
12-09-2016, 09:38
MyNameIsMatija

You've said it yourself you used to outpump everyone; what's different this time?
12-09-2016, 09:42
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

You've said it yourself you used to outpump everyone; what's different this time?

Me not being online 24/7
12-09-2016, 09:50
MyNameIsMatija

You think an absence of the other KD's "strategical mind" or whatever wouldn't have an impact on their overall performance?
12-09-2016, 09:59
JohnnyReid

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bart of Sparta

Me not being online 24/7

He's being legit, here.. xD
12-09-2016, 10:03
MyNameIsMatija

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyReid

He's being legit, here.. xD

Of course he's talking to me after all xD
12-09-2016, 10:19
Folle

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

You've said it yourself you used to outpump everyone; what's different this time?

lulz, he is cute isnt he?

#soyouthinkyoucanpump
12-09-2016, 11:28
Zauper

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

I don't see it that way. What's so special about pumping in whoring tier against pumping in warring tier? If anything while I was playing in FS I pumped way deeper because when an even war is arranged the only edge over your opponent you can personally achieve is pumping out the most out of the piece of land you have. Whoring is more about oow play as in finding the right targets and things like that while the LS has to monitor the intricate CF deals - their terms and expiration dates. Sure a bit more strategy is involved in whoring conflicts simply because the competition is stiffer but that changes nothing for the regular grunt. My point is a good active warring tier grunt, after learning the basics of what constitutes a good whoring target, will outperform a "pro slacker" any day. Reasons for failure should be found in the competence of the LS, KD structure, overall discipline and similar. That is not to say that someone is incompetent but that there will always be someone who holds a slight edge.

For what it's worth, you have not yet experienced a true whoring tier war. I don't think BB has had one since before the GB age. (maybe the Emeriti fight the age after would qualify? but that didn't escalate and you weren't there)

It's possible that FS is the exception to the trend of how war tier kds play -- I can certainly tell you that ED, which stomped over the majority of war tier kds -- certainly never homes pumped. And in our giraffes age, with similar results, we may have used homes but never went deeper than maybe 3-5 PPA.

A good active warring tier grunt is great -- but I'd still take a "pro slacker" like mango, godly, myself, flogger, etc -- over them. Many of our best recruits have come from warring kds. However, it has often taken 1-2 ages before they were really performing well, because there are significant adjustments to make. And one of those is learning how to micro your prov through a pump/prep phase.
12-09-2016, 11:30
Judge

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elit

Drink or not his post still make sense so lets him post!

I don't know his feelings but still i think he is one from my fans! :)

Eh, no. That post by flogger was legit, just that the number of ages is much more than 15 is what I meant!

Secondly I am not your fan. The forums are much more lively with the old timers around!
12-09-2016, 11:34
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zauper

For what it's worth, you have not yet experienced a true whoring tier war. I don't think BB has had one since before the GB age.

It's possible that FS is the exception to the trend of how war tier kds play -- I can certainly tell you that ED, which stomped over the majority of war tier kds -- certainly never homes pumped. And in our giraffes age, with similar results, we may have used homes but never went deeper than maybe 3-5 PPA.

A good active warring tier grunt is great -- but I'd still take a "pro slacker" like mango, godly, myself, flogger, etc -- over them. Many of our best recruits have come from warring kds. However, it has often taken 1-2 ages before they were really performing well, because there are significant adjustments to make. And one of those is learning how to micro your prov through a pump/prep phase.

100% true. Actually Sparta's good performance in war-tier was for a large part due to the fact we DID use deep homespumps for most of our conflicts while our opposition did not (strategy courtesy of CR - Zauper/Mango). This time our pump was rather slack due to lack of micro whereas pandas pulled it off perfectly. However, war is far from over, I'd say we have a 60-70% shot at winning it.

Edit: FWIW, I was just trolling you guys y'day about the external gc. I hadn't even checked any intel. Annoying huh, someone accusing you of stuff without providing any kind of evidence :) ?

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