Simians Vs Sanc, HoH or Rage

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Originally Posted by I_am_Spartacus

I am on the planet Earth, where the predominant species is Human. It seems like some people in this thread are off in different realities.

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Planet of the Apes?

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Originally Posted by citadela01

well at least for once Anri got to decide who crowns this age^^

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rofl.

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Originally Posted by Drixx

My understanding of the order of events:

1: Sanc sends dragon
2: Sanc makes bank hit
3: Sanc sends Anri/Simians message saying "We will wave when you drop fort"
4: Simians drops fort and makes 7 hits against hoh
5: Sanc's 2nd hit comes in (prior to button being given to hoh)
6: Sanc continues waving and at some point after Sanc's 2nd hit, Simians gives the button to HoH
7: Sanc finishes their wave against Simians, at this point HoH has not retaliated (and so by some definitions, including the one Prot used against me some ages ago, it wasn't a real hostile yet.)
8: HoH presses button and war commences
9: Simians decides to roll over and farm out to spite Sanc (and also harms Rage as collateral damage)

Is this accurate for order of events? Personally, I view a hostile as being opened when one side has clearly committed to the fight and clearly communicated to the other side that they are committed. The other party at that point has three choices generally: try to do some diplomacy to avoid the fight, engage in the fight, or eat the wave for a CF. This situation was simply compounded because you chose a 4th option which was to open a second hostile with a third party after you knew for sure that Sanc was opening a hostile with you. You can argue semantics all day long, but Sanc clearly demonstrated hostile intent by word and by deed. Saying they didn't hostile you because you didn't have a button yet is just trying to 'lawyer' what a hostile is, and I think all of us can agree that everyone has had enough of the whole "lawyer" thing with hostiles. Common sense should suffice to demonstrate when a kd is hostile to you, and Sanc had clearly demonstrated hostility.

That said, the only rules we have in this game concerning hostiles and fighting 1v1 are what we all agree upon. It is your right to say that you did not consider Sanc to have demonstrated hostility toward you. Just the same, they did tell you what they were going to do and you did choose to try and open a different hostile up to avoid that. All of that is really kind of down to viewpoint and really nobody can make a final "call" on it. Most of the forum community seems to think that Sanc had clearly shown hostile intent and that you were trying to run from them, and you have admitted that you intentionally farmed out to hoh to spite abs. That's all your choice, and really I have no comment other than to thank you for being honest about what you did, and to express my regret that you did so. A hard fought war would have been more entertaining and would have given HoH a chance at what they want most, which is respect. People often call them farms and say they hide behind abs, and they would have liked a real fight that was hard fought so if they won and won the age, they would earn respect. Now everyone will just go to your post where you said you farmed out on purpose and hoh will not get the respect they were after.

The only other comment I have, Anri, is just a bit of advice from one old friend to another. Don't speculate on what "would" have happened. None of us can know what would have happened if different moves had been made and things had played out differently. I suggested earlier that you could have sent notice to hoh and not to Sanc and Rage to buy yourself at least an hour if not many hours to initiate hostility with hoh before either Sanc or Rage could step in. If you had noticed hoh first and waited to see if sanc or rage noticed, you would have had time to set up the long hostile you wanted. It's even possible that neither sanc or rage would have even given you notice at all. We just can't know, because you gave notice to everyone at the same time. Speculation serves no purpose. You speculate that Sanctuary would have hit you no matter what, and you are therefore angry with them ... but what if you had given notice to only hoh and Sanc had not given you notice and you ended up with a 1v1 fight with hoh? That's just as much a possibility as what you claim "would have happened".

It's not worth being angry about something that "would have happened" because we simply can't know how things would have gone differently. I'm sad to see a fun age end this way, and would have enjoyed a hard fought war from both sides a whole lot more than what happened instead.

When I was 11, I was crossing the street after getting off a bus on the way to school and was hit by a car. As a result I've been confined to a wheelchair for the decades since. If only I had waved the bus to go before I walked across the street, or if only the person who hit me had been a minute earlier leaving for work that day, I could have lived my life without being crippled. Of course, maybe I would have ended up in the US Military and gotten killed in Iraq or Afghanistan and wouldn't even be alive right now. I simply cannot know how my life would have gone if events were different by a few seconds and I hadn't been crippled for life. But it is folly for me to think that things would automatically be better. For all I know, I would have died a week later if I hadn't been in a hospital bed recovering from my brush with death. Or maybe I would be perfectly fine and still alive and in perfect health. I don't know what might have been, but I know what is. I'm alive and that is better than not, so I've learned not to dwell too much upon "what if". Have fun on your vacation and don't let the "what if"s bother you Anri. It's a game, and games are supposed to be fun. Have a great visit with your family and see you next age mate.

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Where do u play in drixx? ex-fury or sanc/rage?

Openly admitting to farming out to prevent another kingdom from winning is no different (in my opinion) than farming out to a friendly kingdom, which is against the rules. I will be interested to see Bishop's opinion on this.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Openly admitting to farming out to prevent another kingdom from winning is no different (in my opinion) than farming out to a friendly kingdom, which is against the rules. I will be interested to see Bishop's opinion on this.

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Seriously +1.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Openly admitting to farming out to prevent another kingdom from winning is no different (in my opinion) than farming out to a friendly kingdom, which is against the rules. I will be interested to see Bishop's opinion on this.

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He can admit what he want but from what i know simians still doing attack. So its not FWr for sure and not against game rules.
Serious if you want to improve game punish Sanctuary. I don't care what "good reason they have". Wave kd after they already wave another kd is lame and when they cant retal is farming. You just told farming is against game rules? So punish sanctuary too.

Fake and Farm isn't the same thing. And Simians could have retalled, they chose not to and waved HoH instead. That is not Sanc's fault, as discussed in excess in this thread.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Openly admitting to farming out to prevent another kingdom from winning is no different (in my opinion) than farming out to a friendly kingdom, which is against the rules. I will be interested to see Bishop's opinion on this.

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Bishop is welcome to check our war activity. If we want to do learns and play without any people leading the war or if we choose to keep the war going til we been totaly crushed is up to us.
Its a fact HoH is crushing us cause they are flawless in activity and our dwarfs suck. No gameplan except for a very long hostile with intact banks could have outplayed them. My KD decide when we WD from war. Get over yourself. Is Bishop gonna mass-delete Simians cause we choose to make learn hits? Is he gonna delete Simians cause our bank abandoned us and dropped out? Is he gonna delete us because dwafs suck compared to orcs? Is he gonna delete us cause we gave them button?

I am not following you here DHaran.

Take your moderations and your entire persona up to pair with your job here and your ingame play.
You are being more then silly.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Openly admitting to farming out to prevent another kingdom from winning is no different (in my opinion) than farming out to a friendly kingdom, which is against the rules. I will be interested to see Bishop's opinion on this.

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Simians hardly intended to get farmed out as they entered war. Staying in war letting the farse continue to stop sanc for crowning may be easier then admitting defeat and opting out.

All of that was fine until you stated you were intentionally farming out.

Once again i like your post Drixxx.

I will just say one thing in respons. We rolled the dice when we noticed all three of them. We knew we could never EVER have a chance if we let two of them stay in full pump mode while going at HoH. We are gamblers. It backfired. I think your post was decently accurate but you missed a few things. Rage and Sanc started dragon on us before notice was up we then responded by starting dragon on HoH. Wich would make us dibbs HoH while Sanc dibbs us. I will also say again we could have hit them or dragoned them right away. My own beleif is that Sanc would still have dragoned us and hit us.

Dip took place. I warned Dorje. He said he do it anyway. It happend. ****s over. We will do the same thing to Sanctuary. Its just how it goes. I am not sure what people are still talking about. Trying to make Simians not hunt Sanctuary?

Trying to get us deleted cause HoH whopps our ass in war and we farmout to a much stronger KD.

lol

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Fake and Farm isn't the same thing. And Simians could have retalled, they chose not to and waved HoH instead. That is not Sanc's fault, as discussed in excess in this thread.

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There is so many real wars when one kd end farmed. How you going to police all them? Mods should stay out from all game politic and craps.
How i told you already its hell rude from a lot people in forum/irc to still keep push Simians. Don't you think they got already so many craps? Do you think they will have any motivation after it to keep his army in/out? What they can get from it? Make ppl who killed simians age to win age? Are you serious expect any one to be hipper active in this situation? Or they will go inactive/drunk.
I really dont like how harsh is so many ppl around.
Yes Simians made mistakes but its not reason rest to act insane and cros all lines too.

It's not against the rules to farm out to a friendly...

Originally Posted by Anri
This is a KD wide decission to give HoH button and let ourselfs get farmed out.

That is what i said. We are getting ourselfs farmed out cause we have nothing to play for, nothing to fight for.
People are active, people are attacking, doing their own **** and we are continue the war. It is up to us. It is not up to any moderator to police what my KD does or what any other KD does. HoH is pwning our asses in war. So if a KD does not WD should Bishop go in and mass delete them for it?

Should i start to send sms to get people online, should i call people? Will Bishop delete me if i dont make a plan and get my people active?

We now await next age and no one cares about this age. Its over. There is no more fun this age. Comprende DHaran?

I also beleive there is no rules against farming out. Not sure where DHaran read it. I think this discussion we had before.
If we could beat HoH we would try our fullest but we cant. Now we just grind the war out.

I dont care what DHaran or anyone else thinks about that.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Fake and Farm isn't the same thing. And Simians could have retalled, they chose not to and waved HoH instead. That is not Sanc's fault, as discussed in excess in this thread.

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You should've grabbed a snatch news and figure out the timeline of the hits.

I can post it for him. LoL

Getting kinda ridiculous how people are so bad at comprehending what happened and/or spinning it a certain way.

That's gonna be a big post Anri.

Simians put up a good fight but were outmatched by orcs. THe dwarves were simply not strong enough without a prolonged hostile. I am sure they had no intentions of farming out going into this. Their setup was just outmatched compared to ours. They couldn't keep up with our gains and their LL was no where near as successfull as expected.

Total Attacks Made: 231 (68992 acres)
-- Traditional March: 199 (66256 acres)
-- Ambush: 9 (2736 acres)
-- Raze: 1 (210 acres)
-- Learns: 14
-- Failed Attacks: 8 (3.5% failure)
Total Attacks Suffered: 363 (114006 acres)
-- Traditional March: 349 (110871 acres)
-- Ambush: 11 (3135 acres)
-- Failed Attacks: 3 (0.8% failure)


The Kingdom of (xx:xx)

Total acres exchanged: -45014 acres (231/363)

We probably done 15K LL gain or so. I am not sure. I know i have done like 5k LL myself.
Happy DHaran?

Sample:

Your wizards gather 29,619 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 214 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 30,128 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 195 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 30,592 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 170 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 30,997 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 83 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 31,194 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 16 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 31,232 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 28 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 31,299 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 135 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 31,620 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 125 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 31,918 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 121 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 32,206 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 71 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 32,375 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 133 acres of land!
Your wizards gather 32,691 runes and begin casting, and the spell succeeds. Our Land Lust over We say you are wrong () has given us another 203 acres of land!

This was the province i intended to grow to support our bank. Grow from this war. But we never organized and our bank left us and died etc etc.

There is just nothing to play for. We will not surrender til we are half their size and totaly farmed out.

There there DHaran. Nothing to sob about.

Orcs offense is totaly overpowering us. We would have needed them on constant MS for a week maybe with FB/chasity and keep NSing them etc etc.
The only thing we can be accused of is keeping the war going and not caring about it and not leading it. Even if we tried our very hardest then HoH would still have taken 20k acres from us in min time. Just like we took 20k from them last age. Nothing weird about it.

I am waiting for DHaran to explain to me

In one thread noticing is or is not a hostile and then in this thread something called dibs is or is not a hostile. And it depends on which thread as to which party believes what. So confuzzling.

It should just be the better kingdom puts the worse kingdom at a strategic disadvantage no? If the worse kingdom takes issue to how its done then allies are called in and it is settled on a larger scale. Other wise its just whine and cheese and uber threads.

Grats to HoH on the win and shame shame shame on anri and simains, your rep or whatever your grandstanders like to puff out their chest about is back to 0.

Who thinks anti abs are gonna use simians like a battering ram for a few ages lol.

*puts hand up*

jstr we have a dreamteam over in Simians and all players is staying. Dont misstake us for a ghetto just cause we farm out to HoH like this. We could have done damage control.
We farmed 35k from HoH in total last age. This is just how it goes. We be back at full force next age with a nice setup. Its not the first war we lost and not the last war we will lose. It is most certainly not the end of the world. lol

We will take many scalps in future ages. Next age maybe we farm HoH. No one knows. We are rather unpredictable so is HoH :P

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Originally Posted by Anri

I am waiting for DHaran to explain to me

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Explain what? None of the rubbish you've posted since admitting to farming out intentionally is relevant to anything I said, lol.

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Originally Posted by Palem

It's not against the rules to farm out to a friendly...

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Intentionally? Uhhh, yea it is.....

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Originally Posted by jstr

Who thinks anti abs are gonna use simians like a battering ram for a few ages lol.
*puts hand up*

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Simians got his place in top fair. So far they make me laugh so many times this age. Hope to see them around next age again.
This age for non abs kds was totaly shame age. Only more shamed need to feel PRO-nub! Hi did his very best and still failed !

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Intentionally? Uhhh, yea it is.....

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Guess already Proteus asked HoH for few free hits to "fix" this unfair situation. Are you going to delete him if rage hit HoH and they don't retal? Because its going to be farming to friends/ally.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Intentionally? Uhhh, yea it is.....

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No it isn't...

Arranging a fake war to feed up one kd is against the rules, but by no means is this a fake war.

There is nothing that says two kds can't help each other, whether that be gangbanging a target, sharing intel, or feeding each other up.

DHaran needs a fix.

I posted summary to him. KD is fighting as we want to fight and he wants us deleted.

Its laughable. I dont know why he even bothers about Simians at all. He should be happy that i did not notice his KD and farm it when he had it up in t10. Was a sweet farm.
Then maybe he could have asked to delete himself, i dont know. Makes most sense if we are in DHarans world.

Since i got this topic flowing like never before and possible can beat Cats i also like to say that our phone activity dropped by half cause before this conflict we got this new chatt system that give most our phone users white screen. This happens to me as well and when i ask in channel now at least half of my players experience this problem. Some more then others.

And here is another one for mr DHaran.

TFC <3. They lost a lot of acres to Simians in a "farm out" situation.

Will you ask Bishop to delete Palem also?

Just trying to make you understand how bad your comments been lately. If you change your mind you have the right to do so.

EDIT: Trollfags lost two wars to Simians and "farmed out". They also gave us free hits after the two wars and then we CFed.
I want them deleted also. You can spare TFC and you go get Trollfags instead.

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Originally Posted by Palem

No it isn't...

Arranging a fake war to feed up one kd is against the rules, but by no means is this a fake war.

There is nothing that says two kds can't help each other, whether that be gangbanging a target, sharing intel, or feeding each other up.

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Fake war has nothing to do with anything, not sure why you guys keep bringing that up. What Anri basically said is "Hey HoH, we're going to give you as many acres as you can take so Sanc can't win, but it still looks like a war *wink wink*". Farming is against the rules when it's intentionally arranged, even if it's halfway through a war. That's why Ryan got deleted, for arranging a farm war, so not sure what you're smoking Palem.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Fake war has nothing to do with anything, not sure why you guys keep bringing that up. What Anri basically said is "Hey HoH, we're going to give you as many acres as you can take so Sanc can't win, but it still looks like a war *wink wink*". Farming is against the rules when it's intentionally arranged, even if it's halfway through a war. That's why Ryan got deleted, for arranging a farm war, so not sure what you're smoking Palem.

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...because Ryan got deleted for arranging a fake war lol

Arranged farming is only against the rules when it's in a war. It makes the war fake. But this isn't a fake war. There are no restrictions on who they can hit or what they can do. Simians is just tanking it.

There's nothing against the rules for being bad and untactical. If there was the game would have like 7 kds left lol

Yes, DHaran, we arranged this war. For the last month everyone in Simians grown their hardest to catch up to the very top just to give all acres to HoH in an intentionally arranged war. What have you been smoking!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you not read? I said when it becomes arranged is irrelevant, only if it does. At this point you've arranged, admittedly, a farmout to HoH. These are facts.

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Originally Posted by Palem

...because Ryan got deleted for arranging a fake war lol

Arranged farming is only against the rules when it's in a war. It makes the war fake. But this isn't a fake war. There are no restrictions on who they can hit or what they can do. Simians is just tanking it.

There's nothing against the rules for being bad and untactical. If there was the game would have like 7 kds left lol

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FYI, Ryan was deleted for arranging a farm war just as much as a fake one.

the funny part about this all - TFC could finish above Simians in the old charts now after all that crap posted about how TFC was a ghetto and didnt deserve to be top 10.

Palem last laugh and all that?

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Farming is against the rules when it's intentionally arranged, even if it's halfway through a war. That's why Ryan got deleted, for arranging a farm war, so not sure what you're smoking Palem.

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Ryan was deleted for arrange to farm land not to gave land. Simians/HoH war was supposed to be fair 1vs1 war but Sanctuary interfere drooped simians chances and its turned to farm war. How its Simians fail? (if we not cont all 3 notices:D)
And there is difference to farm to friends and farm to enemy. HoH and Simians is not ally or friends. So there is no way to be arrange farming...its include 2 sides to agree from begin.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Can you not read? I said when it becomes arranged is irrelevant, only if it does. At this point you've arranged, admittedly, a farmout to HoH. These are facts.

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yeah if it can be proven that some1 ordered "no more hits / ops - we farming out to HoH so they win the land crown" then that should be punished. A real war then becomes a 'fake' war. But hey if theres skull duggery going down between Simians and HoH why not just raze into their war? Thal'll stop it ;)

p.s - not saying or accusing Simians and HoH of anything but Anri always gives his 2 cents when things dont concern him so hey ho i wanna play to!

Giving land or taking it is also irrelevant, farming and farming out would be equally against the rules, depending on the circumstances. This case would be a judgement call, and it's Bishop's, not mine. I don't think he'd do anything about it, but in my opinion this is blatant farming to damage another kingdom, which is no different to me than farming out to benefit another kingdom.

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Originally Posted by fuzzy|

yeah if it can be proven that some1 ordered "no more hits / ops - we farming out to HoH so they win the land crown" then that should be punished. A real war then becomes a 'fake' war. But hey if theres skull duggery going down between Simians and HoH why not just raze into their war? Thal'll stop it ;)

p.s - not saying or accusing Simians and HoH of anything but Anri always gives his 2 cents when things dont concern him so hey ho i wanna play to!

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I'm absolutely not accusing HoH of anything, only Anri made an admission of what he's doing and it's clearly only to get back at Sanc, not to benefit HoH.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

Giving land or taking it is also irrelevant, farming and farming out would be equally against the rules, depending on the circumstances. This case would be a judgement call, and it's Bishop's, not mine. I don't think he'd do anything about it, but in my opinion this is blatant farming to damage another kingdom, which is no different to me than farming out to benefit another kingdom.

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in the end ghettos use ghetto tactics!

btw who are these ghettos?