Age 71 Proposed Changes Suggestions

orc: change +20% enemy military casulties
undead: change elite nw value to 12NW(same as offspec 0.8 per point)
human: add fanaticism
cleric: add townwatch, +40% birth rate, change -40% military casulties
warhero: remove fanaticism, pitfalls and +10% attack gains, add +33% training time
tactician: add +10% attack gains
warrior: add 1 mercenary per 4 troops

mechanics: gain penalties for attacking or opping into smaller or bigger kingdom out of war

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DarkenRahl

I think Hyrids need to be more viable. I suggest something along the lines of Patriotism also makes draft free and/or training of elites 50% cheaper for Elves DURING WAR. Or make it for Heretics but then make Patriotism harder to cast or call it another spell. Bottom line we need something to reward higher skill players for executing with a hybrid setup and improving sustainability potential during war is a great way to make that happen.

---

Faery hybrid this age was awesome.

Elf hybrid last few ages have also been awesome.

Halfer is only race that has sucked at being hybrid

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bart of Sparta

Human: Fine


Mechanics change:
-Elites slay at average value: (off + def)/2

---

This would make elites worse to send then elf dspecs and ud or halfling ospecs.

Instead of War Hero starting with elites, why not have them start out at Lord/Noble Lady honor instead? It's a small leg up on everyone else but it doesn't unbalance as heavily with some of the elite values out there. Then they can generate honor from a higher point when they attack and still probably won't lose enough to drop back down to Knight/Lady that quickly, unless everyone decides to attack them, which honestly is a player choice not a game mechanic.

Because then war hero KDs will get raped by SKs out of protection

Also to the poster who posted the long post at the end of page 18 gains should be more based on KD size rather than province size based on what you are saying.

And I still stand by my position that hybrids should be given a greater tactical sustain advantage in war.

I'm talking true hybrid attackers btw not OOR turtles

human: merchant/prisoner 6 off points

Avian should swap that ospec +1 to a dspec +1. As it is that spec seems kind of redundant when it's becoming an elite anyway.

Orc should not have such high losses, it's a big nerf but makes Orc weak in the sustain department if warring (and let's face it warring is the game now for 90% of us).

UD is going to be harder than most people make it out to be, not for anyone who can play the game but definitely for newer or less skilled players.

I have no thoughts on TM's at this point until the final changes - nothing there is attractive at all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by joeblogs

Avian should swap that ospec +1 to a dspec +1. As it is that spec seems kind of redundant when it's becoming an elite anyway.

Orc should not have such high losses, it's a big nerf but makes Orc weak in the sustain department if warring (and let's face it warring is the game now for 90% of us).

UD is going to be harder than most people make it out to be, not for anyone who can play the game but definitely for newer or less skilled players.

I have no thoughts on TM's at this point until the final changes - nothing there is attractive at all.

---

Yea I agree to all those points.

Regarding T/M's though, I think halfer and elf are currently in a good spot.. I think fae is in an awkward place though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Berner...

You want to grow the game? Restructure it for fair competition. New players quickly get dissuaded when faced with a predicament where they cant fight back. Example. A 4k acre faery SHOULD NOT be able to take 300 acres from a 2k faery. Those numbers may not be exact as far as gains and im aware that nw is relative, just a quick example. With everyone having different goals for this game, the 'top' shouldnt be allowed to fsu for smaller kd without penalties. If u want to chart, compete against like minded kds. Not these non compete clauses that has multiple 25 prov kd all age cf with each other and ransack at will bulls***. Gains for out of range provinces should get HIGHLY nerfed to put an end to this once and for all. New owners are in a unique predicament to set a new precedence in utopia. Get to it. U will have a few kd upset about it but im sure the rest of the server would appreciate the game not being catered to the few who choose to chart age after age. Hell id bet a pretty penny MOST of the server isnt out to chart. You should take a poll as to what aspects of the game people like and what their goals are. With that data, you can make a executive decision as to what direction to take this game in. As to what the haters may say, using diplo is at the discretion of whos attacking you. If they dnt choose to let up, sitting around gettin hit for a week quickly turns new players off. Getting good is out of the question if you are gettin outplayed by a kd with more provinces.

---

I agree with most of this. The bottom feeding i much worse than the top feeding. In fact, MOST kingdoms in the warring tier have KD policy to NOT hit anyone much bigger than themselves. I also agree that the majority of the game doesnt give a crap about the charts, and as most of this game in the warring tier, the game should be catered to them - not the chart seekers. I also agree that a simple survey could do a lot to make the player base at least feel like their opinion matters.

Oh, and outside the warring tier, as in when dealing with "top" kingdoms, diplo almost never works. They're almost always either entitled or complete jerks. I have NEVER had a good experience doing diplo with a top kingdom, but almost ALWAYS have great and down to earth diplo with warring tier kingdoms. That doesnt mean my Diplo skills suck, that just means that what the warring tier actually diplo's and the "top" kingdoms always seem to just bicker over details. "You cant break the CF without giving us a weeks notice, in writing, to both me and my RS, and in our IRC channel." "You offered a CF, but never sent a comprehensive list of terms, so we rejected it because you're clearly wasting our time." In the warring tier, you CF someone, you just never talk to or see them again. It's that simple. In the top of the game, they treat CF's like they're life and death. And the crap the top 10 kingdoms in this game do is what ruins this game. They talk about **** play like it is rampant, when in all reality, it only happens at their level, and usually they're all the ones doing it.

Make the game more playable for the middle tier warring kingdoms - which is 75% of the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MaximII

I agree with most of this. The bottom feeding i much worse than the top feeding. In fact, MOST kingdoms in the warring tier have KD policy to NOT hit anyone much bigger than themselves. I also agree that the majority of the game doesnt give a crap about the charts, and as most of this game in the warring tier, the game should be catered to them - not the chart seekers. I also agree that a simple survey could do a lot to make the player base at least feel like their opinion matters.

Oh, and outside the warring tier, as in when dealing with "top" kingdoms, diplo almost never works. They're almost always either entitled or complete jerks. I have NEVER had a good experience doing diplo with a top kingdom, but almost ALWAYS have great and down to earth diplo with warring tier kingdoms. That doesnt mean my Diplo skills suck, that just means that what the warring tier actually diplo's and the "top" kingdoms always seem to just bicker over details. "You cant break the CF without giving us a weeks notice, in writing, to both me and my RS, and in our IRC channel." "You offered a CF, but never sent a comprehensive list of terms, so we rejected it because you're clearly wasting our time." In the warring tier, you CF someone, you just never talk to or see them again. It's that simple. In the top of the game, they treat CF's like they're life and death. And the crap the top 10 kingdoms in this game do is what ruins this game. They talk about **** play like it is rampant, when in all reality, it only happens at their level, and usually they're all the ones doing it.

Make the game more playable for the middle tier warring kingdoms - which is 75% of the game.

---

Also a problem with a lot of top tier players (not all) is that they're massive jerks. The community here has some fantastic people, and some of the worst. I guess it's magnified by how small of a world utopia is, and how intensive a game it can be, but if the game is to grow it can't cater to the top 1%, nor allow it to be a one sided affair. Any actual business model that employed that thinking would fail to turn a profit, and if utopia doesn't supply what the majority want it will bleed and bleed no matter who is in charge. I like the new changes, but it needs to remembered that the vast majority aren't charting.

I mean obviously there cannot be a jerk police, but I think the community as a whole should be more forgiving of new players, or just people's lack of knowledge and should help them up-skill. Half the dam threads here turn into slinging matches between 1 or 2 kds from some perceived deal break or past war that no one has any idea what the hell they are talking about. Just leave that **** at home and help rebuild this game.

+1 dspec strength will make Avian ridiculously OP. Avian warrior unhorsed elite is already 11*1.05*1.1*1.1 = 13.7 off. Dorf by comparison is only 9 off.

Really feel Dwarf and halfer need some buff at least to remain competitive, because atm dwarf with 9 off elite isnt even best tank (human has 11 off and QF for turtling purposes).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bart of Sparta

+1 dspec strength will make Avian ridiculously OP. Avian warrior unhorsed elite is already 11*1.05*1.1*1.1 = 13.7 off. Dorf by comparison is only 9 off.

Really feel Dwarf and halfer need some buff at least to remain competitive, because atm dwarf with 9 off elite isnt even best tank (human has 11 off and QF for turtling purposes).

---

Agree with Dwarf. At the moment it's bordering on being very playable. Re halfer, not sure how to buff it - cheaper leets maybe and more pop space? Or give them cheaper draft or something - get them spammy again.

Just let birds fly - give them the dspec but maybe drop gains neg 10℅, or remove access to mercs. Lower OPA overall but keep the speed.

Also agree with Joeblogs. Having played both against and briefly in the "insider group" of people who crown or crowned long ago, its very much notable their sense of entitlement. For the last 3 ages Sparta has conbatted this by:

1. Giving these KDs a piece of their own medicine.
2. Being brutally honest about it.
3. Exposing their constant lies and scheming (at least partially).

However, in the process I do believe at times we (well actually just me, my KD is still all warring tier mentality nubs) crossed a line and started to look more like them.

The cause of this is that many KDs in warring tier dont just have dumb/ignorant monarchs, but they also refuse to learn from experience. Hence the abuse is a rinse-repeat each age in which invariably they end up donating large chunks of their recourses to said topKDs. They always take a stand one at a time then get policed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by joeblogs

Agree with Dwarf. At the moment it's bordering on being very playable. Re halfer, not sure how to buff it - cheaper leets maybe and more pop space? Or give them cheaper draft or something - get them spammy again.

Just let birds fly - give them the dspec but maybe drop gains neg 10℅, or remove access to mercs. Lower OPA overall but keep the speed.

---

Perhaps remove BL from them. IMO an avian/cleric should not be breaking same-sized TMs

Tone down elite values