And more libel and character defamation... when did i declare that, "I wont say who or what the lie is"? Also your insult on Runefire was rather unnecessary and mean spirited.Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ed
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And more libel and character defamation... when did i declare that, "I wont say who or what the lie is"? Also your insult on Runefire was rather unnecessary and mean spirited.Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ed
so what does The U get out of razing spartans? i mean if we are just some big bully why are we razing them? for ****s and giggles? everyone thats taking spartas side really needs to do some investigating. we did not act on anything until we had looked at all angles of this mess. do we owe divinity? is divinity our allies? the answer to all of that is a no. Divinity and The U walk in complete different circles. we have no reason to help them except it was a very clear deal break.
Like the ads say, I'm a big boy now. I can take it :)Quote:
Originally Posted by khronosschoty
well if the subject was dying provinces, I would agree with you, but it wasn't so u need to read again. the subject was GHETTO BASHING which Spartans were accused of trying to do to us. I simply pointed out what my interpretation of ghetto bashing is. All caught up now Runefire?
And hey Judge, what kingdom are you in? Personally I do not think a war win is worth ruining the age for someone. People work hard building their WPA, Honor, and Sciences and to have to reset all of that because someone PK'ed you while you were sleeping is pretty ****ty. Like I said, I have been back for 2 years and we have NEVER PK'ed anyone and up until our war with Ascension we have never had anyone PK'ed. I think it is a lame tactic to use and causes people to quit the game, but I suppose you don't care about that.
If I have my way all of Sparta will be reset. Don't do dirty and you won't get got.
Bring it on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrystal Palace
Uncle Ed, ignore Khronos.. he's trolling ;)
... is that libel?
Spartans to win honor crown after farming out Fakespartans for the next 1.5 weeks
I play in EmeritiQuote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ed
The white knights wouldn't let it dude, even if we did go 1.5 weeks. All high honor tms (I'm one of them) are gonna get razeredddd to ash :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Duke_
Don't dealbreak and nothing would happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by jo.t.reid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Persain
If I chain a Mystic, I'd rather it not have 15rwpa and +300% channeling and be fireballing tms, so I will take both of those things away from them.
Likewise, if a KD draws out a losing war and will not withdraw in a timely manner, they are effectively costing me 50bpa/day, so I will diligently collect that from them
Sets you up for better diploma in the future with these involved kds. By doing this you can establish the "yeah but we helped you" stance for next age. You can also gain "as you see it " favor of the community of being the knights in shining armor for the community. Policing and protecting the poor weaker kds. So yeah there is something to be gained from it. A utopia where policing doesn't "gain" anything doesn't exist my friend. Stop living in a dream world as I was told to do many times throughout this thread and accept it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chrystal Palace
But all that aside. This 50 pager has talked everyone in circles eh? What a funny little discussion
The Issue i have with learns (doing rough estates) 20 massacres takes that 15 raw+300% science (1100 magic bpa) to <1 raw and 300% science. Casting ability basically gone, tpa gone, economy gone...20 oor learns take you from 15 raw +300% science (1100 magic bpa) to 15 raw wpa+140% magic science (550bpa). That guy isnt remotly knocked outa the war just severly damaged in science post war.Quote:
Originally Posted by Meep
For me then you arent really trying to disable and win your simply trying to strip the enemy of science when they are at their weakest point and unable to defend themselfs due the power of chaining. Which as i said is fine if thats how they wanted to play, but if you lose, that 50 bpa/day your "collecting" you better be prepared to pay back because you were never really winning just draging out your own loss to take my science. Which again is why waring FS early for us would be questionable due to the science we'd lose win or lose war and the unlikelihood that i'd really want to wave them post war to recoup losses. The POINT is that Uncle Ed was *****ing about being pk'd/bullied by stronger kd in war and my suggestion then learn who/when u want to war someone or how you want to deal with them if you win. Its hardly morally wrong for the winning kd to try to convince a kd they are losing in pk's, learns, or... but if u dont have fun fighting a kd dont war them.
and during those lots of back and forths pre war is where they talked more than just what date would you like to war, i.e. "we'd prefer and instant declare becausae our setup is strong with that" probubly wasn't spelled out for you. They inherently felt you out pre war talked though "issues" you had to seem friendly and gain advantages over you through diplomacy. If u are unsure or unaware of it i'll point back to bart is very smart (well in most things he was stupid enough to dealbreak us) he knows what hes doing when he talks to kds and how to try to manipulate them. Or did you not see his 100% fake war offer to us. It was designed to try to get us into war in a bad position, he'd get an advantage in war (as his setup is designed) then back out of the "well lose at min time" offer and beat us. IF we then got upset and complained/called in for help the other kds they will laugh at us because we were stupid enough to agree to a fake war... no one is going to help someone becuase their enemy didn't comply with a fake war offer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ed
This is semi true, he actually did less damage overall than u probubly took, however the disrespect was probably on par. But the thing is he dealbroke us and then refused to take punishment instead demanded we give him more resources. As acres, science, peoples prov in general have no value to Spartans the only way to damage and make them apologize is to cost them either a war win or a lot of honor. Now they knew that, we were hitting them and dealing with them and they chose to arrange a war with the sole purpose of avoiding punishment. Why should a war they only got to avoid us hitting them stop us from hitting them?Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ed
In contrast sure your war v Ascension gave you a bad taste, they were assholes, but you learned something. You learned "good" kds can pk and pk's hurt alot. That alone however isnt something thats going to get someone pk'ed as even the nicest kds in the game may need to pk to win a war, or make the war end in a reasonable time period. Do they deserve to be GB'ed for being !@#$ to you, maybe? Both Stoners and Strippers in the past 10 ages got GB'ed for being rude and disrespectful. But the standard of when people will waste time in a gb is sometimes easy: dealbreakers who refuse to apologize nor admit they were wrong get GB'ed. While sometimes its hard: how much of an asshole does someone need to be before they deserve a gb? Here let me make a suggestion Ascension was rude to you? Tell them that, say u felt like they were overly mean spirited to you. If they apologize then u'd have it, if they don't start hitting them. U'd be "justified" and hard pressured to find someone who is going to stand up for them if they insulted to so much that you feel like they deserve to be hit.
My gut says if you msg Ascension and say
"You know we wared u guys ealier in the age and while we know pking is part of the game it seemed like u guys actively tried to not just win but destroy our kd. And then when you did win you taunted us, rubbed it in our faces and overall treated us very poorly. Is this how you normally treat kds or did we do somthing to you to deserve the disrespect you've shown us"
They will respond with
"Well your right the pk's may have not been needed but we felt they would drastically reduce the length of the war and make an overall showing that we were winning. Since winning is the goal of the war we felt justified in pking. However it was not our intention to treat you like **** and if u felt that way we'll work on how we celebrate wins in the furture. ( possible addtion) However you guys did say XYZ (or do XYZ) that upset our guys and they also felt disrespected which is why they acted they way they did."
Try doing ^^ i bet you get those kinds of resposnes.
This post literally made me laugh. This game is all rainbows and good guys! Yeah message them that and you'll get a nice little well packaged love letter explaining why they screwed you. Hahahahahahahahahah. The response would actually probably look more like this "sorry buddy that is the game don't like it deal with it noob" but probably with more aggressive words. Thanks for starting my day off with a laugh though. I honestly enjoyed that. Maybe I got you wrong persian. You aren't so bad a guy. Just a big jokester. :-)
Just because you and your kd treat people like **** unless they give u a free win and then say omg u guys so good how do we act like you, doesnt mean most kds will respond that way. Sure there might be a response like you suggest, and then you threaten to hit them, they keep talking **** back....and that goes on for a while and then Eds kd gets the support he needs to GB. My response to Ed was that while he got treated like **** theres other ways to handle it than just a GB. We tried that with your kd Acres, they refused to be reasonable/apologize before we started GBing you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aces
Ohhh wow. Guess I hit a nerve there... sorry man I was just honestly saying I was humored by your post. Calm down man its a text based game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Persain
Edit: page 50!!!! Woooo
Actually, it could be. ;p but idk but in the case of Uncle Ed posts it is clear libel. He ruffly said this "18 guys are on for the same time and sleep the same 4 hours" which is not true. The assertion we tried to to pk 3 of them is simple un-true, but he insists on claiming it is fact. As far as the banners go I thought them harmlessly funny but knowing they offended him, I apologize. Actually I sympathize with him a little bit, I know what its like to be an unexperienced monarch. More could be said, and pointed out, but since much of it already has been in this thread by others, I'm just going to stop here.Quote:
Originally Posted by jo.t.reid
PKs usually don't happen in close wars. They cost a lot of resources and time for the attacking kingdom and in a tight war they need those attacks for other things. So chances are if you get PKed you stayed over minimum time and were losing badly already. And then sometimes PKs happen because the hit province refuses/forgets things such as turning wizard production off, releasing enough troops to survive, asking for soldier aid to release etc.
I didn't see the war so I don't know what actually led to the PKs.
If you think you are treated unfairly talk to people. Most kingdoms will help if they can ...if there are grounds for your complaint and they aren't currently involved in their own conflict.
Sometimes a banner is just a banner. Forum banter is part of wars and yes some take it a little too far. 9 times out of 10 though if you let them know you think it's hurtful they will stop and most likely apologize.
I have been nothing but honest here in the forum and in my conversations with you, Khrono. In fact, lets go over the conversation we had on whatsap.
Ed: U gotta understand ur fighting a newb kingdom this time. We are guessing how to handle u guys. Trust me, I got more guys crapping their pants over here than u guys do. lol
Khrono: We are newbs as well. Both have won 3 wars.
Ed: But you guys are the mighty ascension from the forums. we have read about ur exploits
Khrono: What? lol Caught me off guard with that
Ed: Isnt that u?
Khrono: Yes we are ascension, I just done understand the forum reference.
Ed: Maybe I confuse you with someone else
Khrono: We are terrible, we've just played **** kds
Ed: I am old with multiple head injuries. My apologies, I know I have heard ur name before. Maybe we warred.
Khrono: I head ascension was an old warring kd. I was unaware of it when we chose the name. That's not us.
Now you have the nerve to call me libel? Remember, you said I was too honest during negotiations. That's the difference between you and me, Krono. I don't think a person can be too honest, and you think it is admirable to lie. You are an amazing liar Khrono, you had me truly believing you were a nice guy, and we would have a fun, respectful and well fought war. Let your kingdom know that you got 2 of my guys to quit the game, I am sure you will all get a good laugh out of that.
Except there are still enough people who, when chained, will release down to 0 tpa, 0 dpa and then commence sending out all their elites to attack thinking they are invulnerable. Then they get kidnapped by attackers with 0.5 tpa down to 29 peasants and 3 ticks later they are dead. If you run a province without defenses just to be able to maintain 200 opa then it should not come as surprise if that province ends up dead IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodwitch
You are having major issues here, you and I never talked on Whats App. I'm going to assume your thinking we talked on Whats app is an "honest" mistake, but then again your willingness to assume things + make false assertions and also your willingness to outright lie, leaves me feeling unable to be surprised at all, if you are not making an "honest" mistake. I will assume , however, its an honest mistake because I know you talked to someone in Whats App but it was not me, I do not currently have Whats App, and, have not for over an age. FWIW I use Telegram an app a lot like Whats app but the two do not communicate at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ed
In any case your actions result in character defamation; that is the assumptions you make do, and the libel you spew does.
Khrono, are you the Monarch of Ascension? Were you the Monarch when we warred? Because that is who I talked on WhatsApp with, so if that was not you I apologize for calling you a liar. What I mean to say was the monarch of Ascension is a liar.
Real or not, I would like to know which part of that mysterious WhatsApp convo was the lie?
Good thing I'm not involved in warring tier diplo talks, fighting over who has the worst kingdom to try and get a war win doesn't sound like fun at all.. lol. :)
I am currently taking a break from monarchy, have been all age.Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ed
well, that WhatsApp conversation was with your monarch. Can you admit that he lied to me?
I can imagine why you might think he lied to you, but as far as I know, he did not not lie to you (the WhatsAPP convo does not demonstrate lying).
Ok, I think I will take jo's advice and just ignore you. You clearly are trolling.
More rude accusations, I am certainly not trolling. Your list of offenses against me grows and grows and now you have the nerve to assert I am trolling.Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ed
If the shoe fits.....
As i see it persain needs to step down from his high horse. Even if the utopias self claimed top lawyers has done their investigation, I dont see this as clear "db". Shady maybe yes. Coins has 2 sides. I am not convinced yet.
We have warred spartans before it was no trouble. We lost, mainly cause we lacked same activity they had. I wasnt involved in any diplo then, but it was a clean and hard war. Spartans are war machines.
Why can't people accept that Spartans fked this diplo up thinking they have outsmart their opponents but have actually only outsmarted themselves. Those examples from the past doesn't mean they can't make wrong decisions now. So before going on further, can we consider that they made a mistake this time and are being punished for it. 50 pages of it and people are still trying to say how Spartans have been good last time. If your grandma was an olympic medalist in her youth, is she gonna outrun usain bolt now? geez
This actually how sparta feels (generalization, there are 25 of us). We fked this up and are paying for it. We are not the fking hell spawn that some people are tying to make us out to be. Really the whole history of our kd isn't super relevant. Like any kd we have a history that is both good and bad. I don't think the people supporting us are trying to say our move on divinity was great (maybe some of the super bitter ones lol) but we are getting flamed for having a history of being ****ty to all the kds we war which just aint true.Quote:
Originally Posted by Heiney
beans, the issue is that your leader does not think he did anything wrong. The only thing he says he did wrong is the timing.
And even worse he is still getting y'all deeper and deeper into trouble by trying to play several kingdom leaders against each other.
No one blames all of the players in Spartans. You are a tough warring kingdom and don't need this kind of foul play.
I understand loyalty. I understand you want to support your leader. But blind loyalty leads to bad things.
Utopia is set up as a monarchy but it also gives individuals the tools to take influence in the direction and methods the kingdom uses.
Ask questions, demand answers, suggest things...if all that is not helping there is the politics tab.
As long as you let Heaven/Bart represent you, you are supporting the things he says and does.
I wont pretend I know all that is going on in diplo, i don't and don't really want to unless I'm invited to the table and have to catch up for real talks. My goal here is just to damp down the flames. Sparta is loyal to Bart, but not blindly loyal. The kd wanted revenge and a lot of us didnt know better then to try and get it this age, bart tried to do that for us but it was a mistake. We are not going to crucify him for trying to do something we wanted, even if it was a mistake. Bart should have realized we couldnt do anything this age and left it at that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodwitch
As for how Bart plays diplo now, well he can play hardball. We got pushed so far and so much is being demanded of us in payment that it really doesnt matter if we give in or not. If we give in we cant do anything this age, and if we hold out we can't do anything this age. Why eat a dog**** sammich now when the deals we can get only benefit the people who are GBing with oow hits? If they want to take this to EOA and beyond they can, or if they want to deal they can. But just because we fkd up doesnt mean we are obligated to give in to any demand made of us. Any deal we take would have to be more desirable than just getting GBd till EOA right, otherwise why take a deal at all?
So, you made a mistake, you wronged two kds, time to make ammends?Quote:
Originally Posted by beans
"just because we fked up doesnt mean we are obligated to give in to any demand made of us"
How does that work? You wronged divinity, and then emeriti (you broke the cf), its on your kd to make it right.
It is and it isn't. The fundamental problem right now is the difference of opinion on how bad what we did is. If we are DB devil spawn here to ruin UTO for ghettos and top kds alike then we must agree to their definition of what we did (DB), take a war loss, raze away half our honour, all after days and days of GB. Or if we are a good KD that made a bad mistake in (not a DB) pulling a ****ty move (on some one we had a grudge against but still not cool) and are sorry for it, trying to move on, maybe days and days of GB are enough. Or some sort of middle ground. IDK.Quote:
Originally Posted by zaza945
I'm not going to say we didn't deserve any punishment. But we already suffered a lot and are getting pkd now. The whole "beating will continue until morale improves" approach isnt going to get any where with us. We have nothing to gain and nothing to lose and dont feel like we owe any one anything more then what has already been taken. If they feel we do owe more, well they have the power to take it so good for them.
And as for "wronging" emerati that is clear BS. The cf with them was dead bc they told us it was dead. If you want to hate sparta at least hate us for legit reasons instead of piling BS ones on top of the legit ones.
So you also are of the opinion what you did wrong was doing what you did at the wrong time.
You still are not admitting to any wrongdoing which would be a good first step to make others see you may be on a better path.
Personally I think at least Bart if not the whole kingdom owe a lot of people apologies. Honest, heartfelt ones.
For example Korp's kingdom for building up a province just to farm it later on and leaving them hanging.
Divinity for nitpicking and deliberately stabbing their back.
Emeriti for breaking CF because you assumed that is what they were going to do. Also for threatening and insulting them.
Koalas who probably are under the impression you saved them, but you know that is not what happened here.
CR, BB and FS for trying to pull them into this mess.
Also a whole lot of people for insulting them in the process.
I am sure there are more but those would definitely be a step in the right direction.
well yes, we should never have waved a kd that thought they had an EOA CF with us even if we thought they didnt. We should have just fixed the diplo and gone after them next age when everything would be fair game. I assumed the argument was "dont wave divinity when they think you are eoa cf" not "dont ever wave divinity."
I am strongly opposed to any kind of deal that involves one party thinking something is true when the other party does not. That kind of **** is why I left utopia the first time, it pisses me off when I see it any where and it pisses me off the most when I see it in my own kd. I havn't been here long, but this is the first time I have seen bart pull a diplo move that was like that and I told him I didnt like it.
Ya'll apparently want sincere apologies. Well I, on behalf of my kd have been in here a while now saying that we realize what we did was wrong and are sorry for it. This had nothing to do with diplo because I did not ask for anything in return, except for possibly getting flamed less in the forums. Just because we are not willing to give in to every demand made of us doesn't mean we are not sorry, it just means we are in a disagreement about what a reasonable punishment is for what we did.
I don't expect any thing i say here to result in benefits for my kd. This is not diplo. But if people have any interest at all in what sparta was thinking, is thinking, and how we came to this unfortunate place I thought I should throw that in since we were getting talked about here any way.
As far as I know (and im not following closely) diplomatic talks have shut down at this point, which is fine. Getting razed in silence is at least better then getting razed while arguing with people. If parties involved want to try restarting talks feel free to message me in game (burritopia). Otherwise lets just let the topic die and those who feel the need can take what they can from us in blood.
I don't understand why Spartans are still complaining... If you guys think you have any chance of any crown still and that's why you want to 'make amends' with no punishment, you're dreamingQuote:
Originally Posted by beans
Who the Hell is with who?
I respect all the feelings, but I live with Sparta just like everyone else. The kingdoms I occupy aren't organized and I enjoy warring Sparta. Yeah, they get cranky about wave time declare but I think it greases the gears for fun warring.(we didn't have the activity to do our part)
Not blaming folks for taking the game seriously, more just want happy feelings to prevail. It just feels to me like too many parties are wasting the age in a negative light. There's things to do.
Off topic; are you the one I bounced on retal 3 ages ago? That was a timing thing.