VT2 versus Sully.

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honestly, building a ghetto up to be a good warring kd is one of the most satisfying things you can do, but jeez, its damn hard...

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I'm in the process of doing that right now with what you would call a "dual monarchy." There's my monarch who has been in command for about 6 ages and I defected in about 4 ages ago. We just encouraged people to play hard. Encouraged them to plunder OOW and encouraged them to pimp ops. A couple of ages ago we moved all of our orders in the war to IRC to encourage more people to show up. This brought communication and teamwork up. We chose set races and set builds ever since I got there and people seem to buy in. Our only problem is that we are only about 21 strong - but still managed to throw out 89 attacks over a min time war for our last one. It helped that some were multi taps since one of the people in the other kd anon suicided and since we NSed the crap out of some people. It was about 3-4 uniques per person - mostly on the 4 side. It would have been closer to 5 if we actually got the button but I digress. Maybe we've just been fortunate in picking up newbs and defects that want to set their alarms and play for us. Currently, I'd say we have 3-4 players with 1 full age experience or less, and some of them are our better players.

I'd like to get into a war with VT2 or someone else who is building a kingdom at some point to test where we both are at. Not challenging anyone, but just curious to see where my kingdom is at.

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Originally Posted by VT2

And how do you propose I go about getting 100 hits in 48 hours, with 12 hour attack-times, and 19 people?

I'm sorry, wolfy, but it's not possible ... bla bla bla

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So... VT, you forgot (again) how to count?

With 12 hour attack times and 19 provinces (would be better 11.7-11.8 hours/attack, so you have some safety if someone is late) you theoretically should do 95 unique attacks isn't it?

And if you add some doubbles to that... I mean not allways possible, but sometimes it is, so at 1 doubble/prov during war you should do 114.

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Originally Posted by VT2

If they had 9.6 hour attack-times, always were near a computer, didn't care at all about sleep,

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At 9.6 hours attack time you should make ~114 attacks with 19 provs.

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Originally Posted by VT2

we X-logged for each other

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Don't do that, it's very possible without doing shady things.

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Originally Posted by VT2

Normally, I'd say something witty, sharp, and hurtful here, but I'll just say it straight: stop pretending you're badass, when you clearly have no idea what you're talking about.
Go hide in your den, wolfy.

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You normally would say something you THINK it should be witty, sharp or hurtfull, but you need more time in Utopia for that.

I'll enlighten you in my next reply, when you go totally off because you can't figure out what I'm talking about, then you ask around and still can't, so you will ignore my arguments because you made a math mistake...

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Originally Posted by VT2

Go hide in your den, wolfy.

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it's actually a cave, but whatever :P

Uniques do not mean much if you are getting out chained, out draggied,or out played. I had my last war with about 73 uniques at min time roughly compared to about 90 or so. We won the war within the first 36-48 hours but it dragged on. UNiques aren't th emain thing to accomplish in war, correct aid, precise and well ordered hits/ops. Not wasting mana or stealth on a stupid op, sending and killing draggies, plus many other things help win a war. War is so multi faceted it is not dependent on one thing, sure if you war a ghetto and out hit them your gonna win. But in better wars with better kingdoms, there are so many combinations of what and when to do that will win a war and war is everchanging so different gameplans have will vary and change at any given time during war.

Waheed is my Hero!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by VT2

So if you warred me, and I took 2/3 of your total kingdom members down below 800 acres, plus stole 3.6k acres from you before minimum-time, you're saying you wouldn't surrender?

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If I warred you, you'd be in a world of ****. :)

Anyways, in your current situation, it all depends. First of all, you cannot chain two thirds of the kingdom with that many hits. So lol at that. Second of all, doesn't seem like you know what effective chaining is at all. Third of all, if all of their kingdom can still grab for good acres, why would they withdraw? Fourth of all, if the 1/3 of the kingdom that you claim isn't below 800 acres are unbreakable, there definitely isn't a reason to withdraw. The list can go on and on.

And it's Warhead mikeland! WARHEAD!

I know him by NUblet Waheed, and that's all I call him. NO warhead, its Nublet Waheed!

Too bad.
I did chain them with 'that many' hits. Full chains aren't neccessary to break the morale of ghettos.

Oh, and look! Now they're almost 4 million networth, and we have the same amount of land as they - plus interest.

Two 'unbreakables' have joined the ranks of the bruised and bloodied.

How exactly do you define chaining?

Hit repeatedly until the target stops hitting back.
Whether is as a direct result of massive morale-loss from the rapid hits, or due to overpop, is easy to find out.

Essentially, it's the same type of 'chaining' we all use, but with the added effect that people might get so sad that they give up, or slow down their actions for the rest of the war.

They're still going, and going, and going.
Sure, I love acres as much as the next guy, but seriously - this is just silly.

So, VTnub, you have chosen to ignore my post alltogheder? HAHHAHHAHAHAHA!

Figured out where you went wrong with the math allready?

Let's see, 76 + 19 = 95. So, you hit on declare and on the last hour. For long term it's still around 38 hits per day for 19 provinces.

WolfDGrey, assuming everyone is running an 11 hour attack time and they ALL log in during the first hour of war and NOBODY had their armies out in a hostile attack, that would give them a 4 hour window of time to spread between attacks, and even then you only achieve the 95 attacks. If we also assume that these people have lives and its very likely not everyone will be around during the first hour of war, and we also assume that some people had their armies out when war began, and that not everyone can be around within a minute or even an hour of when their army gets home every time (you know, some people have like, jobs, and responsibilities), then I don't think its very feasible to get 100 attacks by min time with 19 people. In fact 80 would be fairly impressive for any non SKD, and I'm fairly sure VT2 doesn't fancy he is running a SKD.

Thanks for the meaningless posts though.

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Originally Posted by Syiss

WolfDGrey, assuming everyone is running an 11 hour attack time and they ALL log in during the first hour of war and NOBODY had their armies out in a hostile attack, that would give them a 4 hour window of time to spread between attacks, and even then you only achieve the 95 attacks. If we also assume that these people have lives and its very likely not everyone will be around during the first hour of war, and we also assume that some people had their armies out when war began, and that not everyone can be around within a minute or even an hour of when their army gets home every time (you know, some people have like, jobs, and responsibilities), then I don't think its very feasible to get 100 attacks by min time with 19 people. In fact 80 would be fairly impressive for any non SKD, and I'm fairly sure VT2 doesn't fancy he is running a SKD.

Thanks for the meaningless posts though.

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Thank you, I was imploding over here over his stupid posts and you summed it up for me.

WolfDGrey -> BOOOOOOOOOOO!

Syiss for president!

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Originally Posted by Syiss

If we also assume that these people have lives...

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Damn, you do assume that?

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Originally Posted by Syiss

they ALL log in during the first hour of war

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Well they should, since VTnub speaks about chaining and how impresive his last age's 7/7 war wins were, plus how he's so good monarch... so he should time his declare to be able to do one of those chains he was bragging about.

On the other hand, I think, he doesn't really knows what he's doing, he has no idea to count his attacks and the attack hours, and on top of all, he claimed it to be impossible, yet you had the infinite kindness to tell him why it's possible.
Wich was my point.

Your other comments are irrelevant and too dumb even for a joke.

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Originally Posted by ovard

Thank you, I was imploding over here over his stupid posts and you summed it up for me.

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You're not smarter than Syiss. Hush!

Boooooo!

The fact that people uses para after para trying too show VT2 sucks (giving others a head ache -_-") is an indication that VT2 is great ^^ I am sure you wouldnt bother so much time writing so many things for an average player >.<

Even if he plays his own trumpet a little to loudly so what? its a public forum and every one is entitled to his own.. The way some of you are going on...if it was my kingdom we would kill VT2's kingdom in 2 days and we would crush his kingdom in 1 day.....makes me wonder....if you guys were really that good...why is it that VT2 gets all the war win >.>

This is a funny thread.

Supposed to be about the war between VT and Sully and it's now degenerated into a slagging match about ???? .... Oh who cares? lol

Had to post though coz poor old Wolfgrey seems outnumbered by people who just wont do the math...

With under 12 hr attack time then 19 provs CAN make 95 hits within minimum time. Does anybody disagree with that???? It's a fact okay?

Combined with a chaining strat and one or two NS targets which (by 36 hrs) have very low def... there should also be opportunities for double taps, tripples??? Quads??? who knows???.... Anyway.... 95 (uniques) is possible... FACT... In reality... 100+ hits is easily achievable if double taps come into play.

You may argue that it would be difficult for a ghetto to achieve that level of activity (and you would be correct) but please please don't argue with the math.

First death, and we have more acres than they now.

Well congratz on your win. Even if they wont surrender, you know who the winner is. Go for their honor and when it wont be profitable just withdraw.

About the how many attacks are possible or not... It is obviously that VT2 doesnt have the best warring kingdom out there. But he doesnt need to. There are more Sullys to give you an easy war win ;).

It's not a win until they make it a win.
Also, they have no honor.

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Of course the king doesn't agree. They're still 1 million nw bigger than you and bigger in acres, as well. Until acres/nw is below ur kd's, I don't see them withdrawing as they have no need to.

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They lost 300k NW and still loosing.

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With 12 hour attack times and 19 provinces (would be better 11.7-11.8 hours/attack, so you have some safety if someone is late) you theoretically should do 95 unique attacks isn't it?

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2 attacks per day
48 hours = 2 days
2*2*19 = 76
Did you go to school or learn how to do math in a car washer?

I am the biggest noob in his kingdom and I am killing 2k troops per day with thievery and making my 2 attacks per day with no failure and have +200 acres in war. Can you make a noob do that? Stop talking behind your live-on-utopia provinces and start a new kingdom in a ghetto, make 7/7 wars THEN come here talk.

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If I warred you, you'd be in a world of ****. :)

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King I want him to be added in the list ;)

I can give you a reason unfriendlyghost casper, they have no dignity...

Minci, assume 12h attack time. Hits are as follows, assuming declaration on hour 1 meaning min time on hour 49:
1, 13, 25, 37, 49

Showing up for war start should be realistic. Especially for a kingdom claiming to be badass at warring who got the war button and the luxury of choosing declaration time. 12h attack time should be very realistic, even for non-warriors. 5 hits at min time for a standard good player is perfectly realistic. So you should be aiming for 95 hits min time with 19 players, barring stuff like Fog.

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start a new kingdom in a ghetto, make 7/7 wars THEN come here talk.

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I built a kingdom from nothing in two rounds, starting with 4 active players. Second round we actually did have an 8/7 war record (we didn't shy away from any kingdom who had a shot at beating us, as VT2 stated he does) and were around top 100 KD honour and NW.

I know but you can be the best badass in the world yet cant control other people.
When declaring, can you gather all your provinces?
I get out from my bed when VT2 is getting into his bed. I work, have a wife, have a life, you cant expect me to ride a horse in utopia itself.
So cut the 1 attack. It is not possible for everyone.
And 12 hour attack time is only possible if your attack time is below 12 hours.
Nobody can make me imply that in my build strat, because its my strat and my way of playing and enjoyin the game. VT2 cant control that. If you can control your own mates every doing, then your mates are nerds who only enjoy in clicking the button and seeing the result.
And 19 apples in the same basket are not the same. Some of us are less active while some are more...

Yet, that cat is a very sweet kitten :)) yours? (god, my wife doesnt want cats in the house)

You didn't build anything from nothing, catty, because you've always been trading in people.

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I built a kingdom from nothing in two rounds, starting with 4 active players. Second round we actually did have an 8/7 war record (we didn't shy away from any kingdom who had a shot at beating us, as VT2 stated he does) and were around top 100 KD honour and NW.

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didnt told that to you... ;)

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Originally Posted by VT2

You didn't build anything from nothing, catty, because you've always been trading in people.

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I built that kingdom without trading.

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Originally Posted by Minci

I know but you can be the best badass in the world yet cant control other people.
When declaring, can you gather all your provinces?

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If the kingdom gets more than 24h notice for war declaration, I'd expect 80% of the kingdom on for war start.

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And 12 hour attack time is only possible if your attack time is below 12 hours.

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I stated as much already, I said that 12h was a cautious estimate.

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Nobody can make me imply that in my build strat, because its my strat and my way of playing and enjoyin the game. VT2 cant control that. If you can control your own mates every doing, then your mates are nerds who only enjoy in clicking the button and seeing the result.
And 19 apples in the same basket are not the same. Some of us are less active while some are more...

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Why do you feel the need to disrespect kingdoms who choose to play collectively as a team? I don't disrespect your style of playing. Please be a bit more respectful of mine. I've been at your level, and I had great fun with it. However, coordinating a wave with 20 players online and seeing your kingdom carry out agreed on plans is also very satisfying. I enjoy having a kingdom which allows me that level of leadership. And the members of my kingdom enjoy having this level of coordination.

I agree with you for the most part, your kingdom has decent activity for a decent kingdom. Nothing more, nothing less. Only thing I object to is VT2's inflated sense of self importance and ridiculous putting down of others, flaunting the virtues of his own kingdom when in fact it's just a decent kingdom built over a long period of time. He did well. It's nothing spectacular. He should be proud of what he's achieved. I'm proud of what I've achieved, even though my kingdom will never be top notch. Compared with the time I've put into it, maybe we ought to be better. But it's my kingdom, I'm happy there and we're the best team ever.

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Yet, that cat is a very sweet kitten :)) yours? (god, my wife doesnt want cats in the house)

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Ceiling cat is watching you troll.

Sully's kingdom just got a magical boost in performance, activity, and intelligence.
Geeeeeeeeeeee, I wonder what's going on...

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Originally Posted by Minci

I am the biggest noob in his kingdom and I am killing 2k troops per day with thievery and making my 2 attacks per day with no failure and have +200 acres in war. Can you make a noob do that?

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Yea, we have several people who played at us from their day 1.

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Originally Posted by Minci

Stop talking behind your live-on-utopia provinces and start a new kingdom in a ghetto, make 7/7 wars THEN come here talk.

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Minci, you're too new to the game to know what is a good or a bad war, or even a good war win streak. Most kingdoms started as ghettos (except the scripted ones ofc.) and most good kingdoms have reached 7/7 or 10/10 warwins without writing about self and without bragging in every goddamn forum thread of the game.

If you really, really want to know, my kingdom won the honor crown, and the war win crown with 13/13, also another age we had 16 wars wins, but that age we didn't won the war win crown as Free (??? or some others, I don't really remember) beat us to that... The kingdom of Killing Fields with 20 (or 22?) wins had the most wars in Utopia. And to tell you the truth, I rather would have 4-5 good wars in an age, than many sucky ones.

Believe me, 7/7 is not that impressive, most people can achieve that without any problems.

I don't say you're a bad kingdom. You're on a good road to maybe become somebody. But until your mouth talks without your brain, without knowing who you are talking to, you better shut up, before you make a complete fool of yourself.

VTnub with his inflated ego - beside ruling a ghetto on the road to become a semi-decent kingdom - at the moment, doesn't do anything else but pour dumb things one after the other, mindlessly countering people like Catwalk, Toadi, BladeMaster, greenie, dodgil, UG, and many more who really achieved things in Utopia and have infinitely more comprehension of the game than him. All that, just because they try to correct his aimless ramblings, haha! (I'm not including myself here, I'm still a ghetto punk compared so some of the ones I mentioned)

In fact he dodged any real challenge from real kingdoms as (at least he knows) he would be ran over like a daisy by a tank.

Counting the time he spends on the forum and the post count he achieved, he is probably "eternally between jobs"... what an irony that Syiss says:

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Originally Posted by Syiss

If we also assume that these people have lives

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Instead of uselessly flaming here you'd better start learning about Utopia, so you know what can and can't be done in this game.

lol minci im afraid UG is out of ur league. and when he say u'll be in a world of **** hes being conservative

u can try tho if u dont believe him

and VT2 maybe its because u pissed them off so much that its actually giving them a positive moral boost? also xlogging is legit now... i guess?

anyway i really hope sully's kingdom dont withdraw. because things will get A LOT more interesting when they enter dragon range

X-logging one account per original account is legal.
Having one account online at the same time any other account is online, and only then does the first account actually do anything, is suspicious.

OMAC's been notified.
We're sticking in this until it stops being profitable to do so.

Now we have more total acres than they.

Just fyi Vt2, waheed is correct that there is little need for NAPs and such until you reach probably t20. The quality of the rest of the t50 is a far cry from the competitiveness it use to have. The only thing holding any kingdom back from competing at that level would be skill and ambition. From a cursory glance, you seem to have a decently skilled kingdom. If you have the ambition is another question.

I already said I have no interest in getting anywhere near the top.
Is that frank enough for you, or must I repeat myself again?

VT2 : good job on that war, but it looks like your KD is running out of juice too, the game is not clear yet - if they decide to go to the end.

We'll live.
Silencing their small attackers now, so we'll have less things to worry about.

They're below 4 million networth now.