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I'd like a clarification about UD elite conversion - will it work on all successful attacks, or just trads? It used to be the latter, but personally I think it should be the former. At least for the kingdoms that war a lot and don't grow much outside of wars there's a notable difference between the two, especially for the purposes of recovery after having been chained to oblivion.
Orc and UD are insanely powerful with these changes - I mean to the point of not bothering with any other races in the KD.
Orc/WH could just +time hits and be great for growth tier (better than the nerfed human). UD is just insane with that OPA. Why not go a full UD/Orc kd? Is there even a viable TM choice with these changes?
I mean sure you can run and Elf, but it would just get left in the dust vs Orc and UD. Just run 25 UDs in aggressive stance and never fort for an entire age.
Science who cares about it - it's dead.
But... nevermind.Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblogs
I literally realised what I just wrote. Carry on.Quote:
Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija
will just be another age of attackers smacking tms like much much higher than then in both land and potentially nw. only good tm be one super massive now and out of range of doing proper ops at this rate..and ya..majority of server will run orc/ud. avian fragile..dorf agree..is ok as tank but outside of that..dont see anything else as playable. i can see potential in the halfer and elf pure a and t...but the probabilities of being easyily broke..specially when you dont have a bank to kill drags..makes it that much more less fun to play as tm
Great changes. Make Utopia fun again. Let's roll with these and then can balance for next age. Eitherway more fun if everything is overpowered, than if everything is downpowered and super balanced.
My take
Elites values r off the charts while considering specs defence esp for the usual orc ud. Would like to see them lowered or elites harder to obtain, gonna get the standard butter n base kds, not much for experimental all elf or fae kds from what i see. 9 pt off specs just makes it harder to ambush for ud which is their only weakness while they double tap in the opening wave, with mods u r gonna break significantly higher nw range w/o really trying or with any elites tbh.
Humans need more flavour from standard income boosts esp if sci in the way it is. Maybe perks for a bank or cow role or sci role native to race. They have no bearings in atker, mage or thief roles as compared with other races and no perks to be a jack of all trades either, other than preying on undead/orc tm wise with moderate success.
Faes get be penalties instead of pop.
Halfers get income penalty maybe.
Herectics n sage shd have their personality spells swapped herectics with anmesia, sage with revelation or sage with rev n amnesia. Sages shd really keep 50 protection. Or otherwise gets boosts in labotories if they still exists.
Rogues get steal/sabotage sci ops instead of revelation that transfers or remove hours on a scientist?
War hero gets honor loss protection in war instead of gains. No modifiers of any out of war and starts with 500 or 600 lites instead of a full 800.
Git GudQuote:
Originally Posted by dizzysky
Please don't remove wizard pump from science. Otherwise, it will take a longer period of time to prepare for war.
already there nameisis. the fact is...sci pen doesnt really affect ud.. ud depends on raw power...to which they have an overkill on in suggestions. conversions to elites..is a more cost efficient way of training elites than paying for them..specially with wh conversion rate being buffed if you want to go that way over a more traditional attacker personality. an active attacker wont take long to pump up elites from overpowered off specs they can freely train with specs. the sci hasnt really held back orcs in the past..why would it hold back an ud that is even more powerful already with -offensive losses and plague...and is immune to plague as is. plague is already a retardo overpowered perk of ud. getting rid of it is 10x harder than spreading it..and can damn any ub or big tm to being chained in a hurry if you do not get the lucky 3 nb cast to rid of it and stuck with the 20 cast of nb and still have it lol. as for t/ms being less useful..it is a 2 way road really. they can be useful if over big to stay safe from the huge offence..by aiding out and drag kills and lower resulting ops due to nw difference...otherwise the damage is alot less.
we could probably use some clarification:
on ud:
"Attacks convert Offensive Specialists into Elites" - all attack? even fails?
on wh:
"on successful land attacks" - ambush, raze also? :P, or just tm.
"Increase honor gains by generating honor in all land attacks" - again, ALL attacks? even fails, raze, etc?
Does this work both ways? Can a smaller province gain acres off a huge fat province where they would normally gain nothing?Quote:
The Attack Gains formula will include a land factor such that attacks that may have previously yielded little to no gains will now yield gains, example: a 1000 acre province with 75,000 NW being attacked by a 1000 acre province with 250,000 NW would normally yield a 0 acre gain. This attack would now produce an acre gain.
not sure..but would be crazy lol. i know we sometimes in war when chained...would have crazy high off left over as defence always first to go...would war raze massive provs we could break and then rest hits for land. not always..sometimes.. i know in war raze doesnt destroy acres but buildings only..but enough of those hits could bring down a faes nw/def or a bigger prov..even if 5x the size..the raze gains were huge in war..down to size they can be clobbered easy enough. will be even easier now with crazy high off..specially elites..but even more so with off specs that are as powerful as other attackers elites almost lol
Races
I feel as though Elite values needs to be toned down, not increased. Numbers are already inflated as is. I feel like adding increased values and +spec bonuses to every race is the wrong way to go about it.
I also believe going the route of making races less unique with shared bonuses/penalties is absolutely the wrong way to go. There's nothing exciting about bland.
Human
*Less defensive losses on humans doesn't really belong. I would prefer their niche to be back to what it also has been. Income and Science. To make that more balanced, the increased losses that's already been proposed makes alot of sense.
*They also get an indirect buff from general Elite Values dropping on UD/Orc
Orc
*Orc already has a niche with gains and kills, they can take slightly less offense and still be totally viable.
*No longer need -10% science effectiveness
Undead
*It's tough for the average UD to maintain more than 50% Elites with converts.
*Between War Hero, -75% losses and Hosps, UD could be easier to maintain than it should. Solution is keeping -66% losses
*(8+13)/2=10.5 Average value. More than Human, less than Orc. Considering longevity
Avian
*Avians already burn out quick, adding military losses would be horrible. I think a way to achieve a similar result is to have the reverse Orc bonus. (And cutting Blood Lust)
*I also think they definately need 10p elites as they already fall behind due to no stables.
Dwarf
*I think Dwarves are in a good place without CS. They were strong this age but I don't think major tweaks are the solution. Its more like other races needs to match them.
Halfling
*Needs to to be better at fighting back.
*This makesHalfer is even more susceptible to FB/MS and may be forced to run higher WPA
Faery
*Faery without CS, +2spec and -5% pop is hefty nerfs. Adding additional elite offensive power makes sense rather than more def.
Elf
I think this improves Elves niche overall.
Thank you for removing the wizard production bonus from Channeling science. It seemed this was a very awkward age for spellcaster provinces and magic, good to see things getting back to balanced on that front.