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Kid (orc) hit a prov 90% his nw with 37 scientists. He went non-anon, +4. Prov was checked for Unis, GS, and GBP. None of those existed in the target's build.
He got 2 scientists, a Prof and a Novice.
Then he saw someone had 47 scientists. It was a sage. He wanted to try anyway, and since we're still experimenting, we did the same process: No GS, unis, GBP.
I think the target was 101%, +4, no anon.
He got 1 prof. :)
You could have been doing successful abducts for the last 2 weeks. You are just making blind hits and ignoring gains factors.Quote:
Originally Posted by anycolor
Bishop, kid wants to say he likes the scientists and "you got that idea from Pokemon, huh? They evolve just like pokemon and you have to catch them."
Haha. Just thought I would share. and not him, because hell if I am letting him anywhere near these forums. :p
Spoken by the next generation. This is all he wants to do now! omg...
Province in my kd:
Target: 101%, 34 scientists, light GBP, no gs or unis
Orc, +2
Result: Abducted 1 Scientist
interesting to test with + hours, just added 2 hours on the abduct against a 30 scientist guy and got one, would not have feelt safe on normal attack time. My first with + hours but 13th succesfull so far.
it is a bit crazy to see the first reported (in this forum atleast) dubble abduct, and against a sage on 47 means that you could have taken one from someone with similair stats and 24 scientists but non sage, orc on +4 hours sure is strong with this.
Yeah, we've been trying different scenarios. It's interesting. A non-orc hit for sci today.
Target: 84% nw, No GBP, Unis, GS. No time added. 34 scientists.
1 prof scientist gained.
One of my undead kd mates against a prov with 30 scientists, ~95% RKNW, ~100% nw, did 3 abducts in a row and got 1 professor each time. Aggressive stance, no +h.
Orc in kingdom.
Target 104% nw, no GBP, unis, or gs.
Human, non-sage with 48 sci! Wooo!
He went +4, though I suspect that wasn't needed here.
He got 2 scientists: a prof and a novice.
RkNW plays a bigger, or perhaps, more noticeable role in abducting, I think.
Found a target, non sage. 50 scientists.
No gs, no unis, no GBP (the first time)
We hit this guy 3 times, because the results don't make sense.
All attackers 90-100%
one anon, +4, non-orc
1 scientist
two orc hits, non-anon, +4
both got only 1 scientist
Finally looked at who they were hitting. Yeah, big difference in RkNW. This is a good thing, I think! ;)
most likely that is true, my only abduct against a 1 million nw smaller kingdom did not give a scientist despite the province had 29.
I feel abducts is somewhat overpowered as you can do those continious abducts without any gb protection kicking in, true you could easily gain 10% land in one hit, but 10% scientists on a tripple hit seams a bit harsh. Of course I've hardly ever used learns, so I'm not sure if you could tripple learn for 10% of books before, my impression is you recovered from learns in 2-3 days.
Learn was default 8% gains on 1rnw without gains bonuses on one hit I think.
Please don't disseminate false information.Quote:
Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija
please for next age swap back to normal sci, this abduction crap is faulty...
my last 3 attacks were calculater like this: no gbp, no laboratories, 95-105% range, 25% diff between kds...all were failed abductions...oh not to mention that one of them had 42 scientists!!!
It's not faulty in the slightest, info is missing from your hits but if someone has 42 scientists you are either hitting down a lot in kdnw and/or they have a ton of gs. Or you hit a sageQuote:
Originally Posted by portofelia
The whole game is faulty !
Bugged jacked up and all that stuff
Who is this portfeller guy and bishop guy they act like they know it all ??
Except a 10 yr old has no trouble understanding the factors of abduct by taking just a few minutes to think it through. So I suspect it's user error, friend.Quote:
Originally Posted by portofelia
it is with changes you realise who the stronger players are, those who can best adapt to a new situation, and that goes for both top 10 and bottom 10 alike.
Of course if you are truly a stronger player you would not even need to complain about the spawnrate or abducts, cause you will likely find a way to beat me even if I'm at 54 scientists while you have just spawned your 28th, there is after all a lot of other factors at play, so you should be thrilled of an oppotunity to prove that you can play better now that people can't rely on very high science bonuses just because they spend half the age pumping or drastically landdropped at some point.
Yeah, so far so good. I'm going with fixed distribution(oops I gave away my tactics). I'm not pulling a lot of scientists, just sticking to most fundamentals. I don't random so I won't be dragging other players scientists away to my coffin of the abyss. This has not stopped me from enjoying the game or even excelling, now or in the past 10 ages.
I think its just jarring to people having another variable to worry about that other players can affect, but I think it will be fine in the long run.
enjoying the game is how it should be played, but I think many of the haters of this new system are the people who think themself more supperior to the rest of us because they play in or has played in a top kingdom at one point and think they are superior to anyone else and thus automatically should be getting ahead with the new system but are not. I say the new system gives you an oppotunity to beat us at something new, complaining and whining just sadly make you come of as any other sour has-been, and this forum boast a large enougth % of those already.
If it is not working out for you at the moment try and listen to the people that are reporting successes so far, you'll learn and then master it, and yes if you know a better way of distributing scientists you may do much better than someone like me who are barely even moving newly spawned novices but seems to be ahead of the majority in sheer numbers.
We could probably do with more reported sucesses from players who sort of have figured out the big picture of the new science, but I thik we already have enougth information for anyone to be carrying out a sucesfull abduct.
madchess the majority of people complaining are not top kingdom players.
from your posts it seems like all you do is abduct. have you done anything else with your science, like war or something?
Somebody, maybe in another thread, pointed this out in so many words. The top is more active and systematic in problem solving, whereas in the lower tier communication is the problem. The reasons could probably be explained in octobrevs personality profile. I'm of the mind it has to do with organizational refinement which is a mutual concern for top performance. Intuitive thought processors build the top the mathematicians have refined.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodwitch
When I ran across a chain target that was proving to be comparatively difficult I spied his science and saw his mass distribution. When I was targeted I followed his approach, for survival. Basic curiosity is eerily missing in huge sectors of the lower tier. I'm one of those players that loves being original, though there are times to simply admit the mechanical guys are right...sometimes ;-)
This is a deeper situation, based in personality, that I've noted in the past. The game appeals to mechanical thinkers because of the intricacy of the math. Studies show that those of this mindset aren't especially intuitive and my experiences as an intuitive confirm this. These aren't absolutes these are trends.
Getting back to referencing the province that was particularly difficult to chain; because he was the exception to the rule. Mechanical thinkers essentially rely on proven fact over theory. They won't adopt an arsenal of unknown quality. This creates it's own culture of static meta and why I consistently question the art of chaining and waving. These are practical compromises, not optimum strategy. I see kingdoms constantly hurting themselves by chaining because they can't fathom alternative, unexplored strategies. These people are intellectually above my pay grade yet they can't make themselves take risks.
Being an intuitive thinker isn't about always being right. I admit to following another in this instance. Adaptation is a respectable portion of playing Utopia.
anyone did successful abducts from fortified or into fortified stance?
Hmm Guard Stations affect abduct/learn attacks??? Why we have Universities/Schools then?
Yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by ahtoad
you can have both to secure your scientists even more, if you really wanted toQuote:
Originally Posted by ivan_ddimitrov
I think war is in a few days if our leadership can find one. I've not really figured out if swapping science arround is worth it, so just keeping the spread for overall effectivness. Closest to max out on Alchemy I think, but constantly running Universities and to many gs might not be the best strat for prolonged periods OOW. I plan on keeping it still for our shorter OOW periods comming up, as my kd is in the warring tier I should be able to run this ecconomy wise crappy strategy when we are dooing something besides warring.
If anything I think the system is a bit harsh on non attackers, we got a t/m on 29 who have no way of abducting, and did not spawn for weeks where I genneraly get 3-5 a week if we are not fortified and can easily dubble that number with abducts. He can of course still get better benifits from channeling and crime and rip me apart with ops if we was facing off rather than beeing part of the same team.
@ Madchess. My intent was to experiment with fixed scientists and it's not bad if you're not chained. When you are chained I think you'll find switching scientist beneficial.
First, I noticed one of our targets was retaining an alarmingly high defense as we forced him down into the pit. This can get to crisis mode for your own chained because the guy can wreak havoc with impunity vs your guys who didn't adjust scientists and are fighting at near land defense. Spying on science, I noticed he moved the majority to housing. I took lower gains to push him into relative overpopulation, but...
Second, those lower gains put me on the radar where I was getting chained myself. I immediately moved scientist to housing and held onto my specs. My peasants got blasted so recovery is arduous. We don't have the activity or resources to save the chained so it was a lone strat tactic.
You have to be more cautious prelude to attacking an actives online. I noticed one of our bigs got repelled and I'm convinced it was the enemy seeing the intel taken and moving scientists to military efficiency. The same precautions apply in addition to strategic maneuvering of scientists: avian/faery stacking protection, undead casting town watch, etc.
You can kind of tell an experienced group by the ops they use and relative coordination. The enemy has a few proactive players who are willing to experiment with the new science system and it shows in our Nw deficit. I think we must accept this as the new meta, at least in the areas I've seen it. I'm not cruel enough, nor did I have the runes to hammer the enemy with amnesia. I think it would be effective in neutralizing some of this effect. I'm here to experiment but I plan on keeping amnesia more as a deterrent. ymmv.
A guy abducted me (i have 34 scientists and 8% universities, I lost one professor and some NW due to the losses. I retalled, he has 36 scientists and no universities, and is 10% bigger than me, I GOT NOTHING...
Next time such bull**** happens i swear ill quit for good this badly developed game. (ill miss the other sufferers friends i have here)
Missing at least 3 key factors to determine gains there. I am not sure how else to say this to you but you seem incapable of taking advice on board.Quote:
Originally Posted by gpimento
Why do you believe you should have gained a scientist off that guy, list out the factors applicable to him that determin gains.
Never mind, you anonned into a guy with GS. Looks like he may have had GBP when you hit also.
All three of those things drop your gains.
Today I was abducted twice from the same bigger guy. Both took scientists. I retalled, I got nothing. And some ball-licker say abducts are perfectly fine.
Yesterday the game had 3683, today 3679.
3679 provinces of what had 120.000 there is the reason. Crappy changes that makes it worse and worse.
Count 3678 now as i am out.
(Sure that Bishop will say "Its better without a complainer" and my answer is "This kind of attitude that lost the other 116322 players - maybe you should open a coffee shop like Mehul did, you probably is way better serving espressos than creating game rules. ")
To the remaining ones, Good luck, may in the next 20 years the thing change to something positive. The last one out please donīt forget to turn off the lights.
There was never 120k players around 100k was the total amount of accounts on all the servers. That included multis and what not. Also the major drop in players happend during the Mehul era.
Btw each time I've retalled with abduct I've gained.
Banned for Malicious Flaming/Personal Attacks.Quote:
Originally Posted by gpimento
If you choose to post again then do so within the forum rules.
On topic, you completely ignored my post showing where you failed to calc gains properly. Can't help you if you don't actually want help.
Actually, Mehul had much the same attitude. He had a specific vision of the game, made changes to serve that vision, and if people didn't like it, tough. He didn't cater to the masses. Usually.Quote:
Originally Posted by gpimento
And in terms of the 'game rules' created by new management...aside from the new science system (which I do think needs some...adjustment...though I don't see any reason to think it's actually 'broken'), there aren't a lot of fundamental game differences from Mehul's days. Just minor balancing tweaks.
Well, that...and the 'premium content', including choosing your own Kingdom. (My running theory is that it's THAT change that turned Utopia from a massive open game with 60k players to a boutique elite game. There had been people asking for 'legalization' of Province-trading under Mehul for *years*, mostly on the basis that they wanted to play with their friends or old KDmates [or multis], but I observed that the flip side of that desire is that they *didn't* want to have to play with any significant number of new or inexperienced players. Account-trading always created a degree of polarization - people leaving ghettos for stronger Kingdoms, people entering the "SKDs" from weaker ones - leaving ghettos without the talent to be able to lead and teach the inexperienced players how to get anything out of the game, and I always argued that allowing trading would increase this polarization, and grow the ghetto to a massive scale...and that those players just wouldn't stay. Suffice it to say that I'm not surprised that the game is much smaller.)
Interesting results yesterday when we abducted into a kingdom 12 hours into fort.
Target: 104% of attacker, 45 scientists, no unis, GS (maybe 1.7% or something useless), no GBP. Anon was used for the attack.
RKNW was 36% bigger than us. I wanted to try going up a bit to see what would happen. And halfway into fort no less.
Results: 2 scientists abducted
Wow, I thought, this doesn't bode well for larger kingdoms. Hmn.
Then another province from the same target kingdom retalled, from fort, and abducted 2 scientists back from the attacker. Interesting!
the return response is why universities are needed when you try to abduct from others, I'm gooing to slap 20% on my province as soon as we get OOW cause I got 65 to protect now.
Yesterday we had an abduct yield 3 sci.
Today, same results. 3 Profs abducted in one go. Yeah, Unis are in. :p
Queen cannot understand what you talk. It's a foreign tongue. Send a PM. Mine is broken or its possible it's me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Panthira
Wouldn't Munk have recorded sufficient amounts of abducts to reveal the formula to the masses?