Most and least valuable crowns

They failed in love and married.

Is someone writing this down?

You never recommended a girl to me :-(

Dear Korp,
I see ASF has sent Bourreau to forum warar you.
Presumably ASF will vulture you with a wall text after you farm him.

Regards,
makeo

p.s Any implication or relation to how Absalom used Grace for many ages is purely coincidental

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Originally Posted by makeo

Dear Korp,
I see ASF has sent Bourreau to forum warar you.
Presumably ASF will vulture you with a wall text after you farm him.

Regards,
makeo

p.s Any relation or implication that this is how Absalom used Grace for many ages is purely coincidental

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The guard dog behaviour is rooted deep within.

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Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

They failed in love and married.

Is someone writing this down?

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Personally, I am tempted to rename my province that one. It is amazing :)

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Originally Posted by makeo

Personally, I am tempted to rename my province that one. It is amazing :)

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elit theme is best theme

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Originally Posted by Binar

elit theme is best theme

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That elit theme you ran was one my personal favourites, yes. =)

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Originally Posted by Elit

You fail to understand something. Age 46? Its was alliance war involve many kingdoms from both sides. You won only because you had like 10 Kds help you. Age 50 Dreams had zero kingdoms to help us during GB. Its was first age for new kingdom. We had no ally. If rage was in same situation you wont have won. Second you miss after all GB and BS i got, still when Proteus came to me and ask when "big solo cow dont remember name" Suicde/hit rage if we can stay away and not hit him. I told him yes we wont farm acres like this. Some other Kds used situation for gain acres. I really did my best for get proper relation Dreams and ABS.

Second, you blame Realest for age 46 but he didn't play or lead KD. You can blame him for what he did first 2 ages on Sonata. Its hard to explain but Realest is naturally born troll. He can trick any one with his words. He challenge Simians with Trolfages when he didn't play in Kd at all. He is this kind "master". From other side he is really good on keep kd channel alive and high motivated.

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You misunderstand the scope of both gangbangs. The one on Dreams lasted about 2 days and mainly just bounced your province into your fake war before you hit VM and then it was ended. Rage was gb'd down to under half their starting size when they were in full pump mode without military. It was initially just a full db gb on Rage with the "alliance war" coming after. Rage was completely unprepared as were their allies while those doing the db and gb were of course prepared. Things only ended because the db'ers and gb'ers were crushed, not because of mercy like was shown to you.

You also misunderstand my position on Realest. I like him as a person and I have some respect for his win at all costs play even if I chose an opposite approach myself. I also am aware it was Phiwha in charge of the GB along with his supporting leadership in Sonata, but it was Realest who was the "master" as you put it and who announced in the forums that Sonata was back. It was also Realest's gf who hacked the accounts in Rage with his knowledge. Also, don't forget, that it was actually Sonata's former ally who came to me with the request to gb them if they came back as payback and it wasn't just me pushing some agenda there.

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Originally Posted by Korp

So Rage nor Absalom could handle few key players quitting? Albeit being such great alliances and "strongest warring kd in Utopia". Whats more likely is that since more people quit resulted in fewer Absalom kingdoms, fewer Absalom kingdoms meaning there was no dominant position, no dominant position to powerplay less success.

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Korp, I think Rage had one of the longest reigns as a true top kingdom of any kingdom. Over time, we lost many players and leaders just like every other kingdom. Towards the end, we were low on leadership and no where near as strong as at our peak, but still finished #1 NW and #2 land in my last age there (and their last age before becoming RBL). I have a pretty good understanding of game dynamics and I am certain that Rage would have had more individual success without an alliance. The gb's that happened to Rage most likely couldn't have gotten the support if it wasn't "against an Abs kingdom." There were many ages where Rage likely would have crowned if they were free to war who they wanted.

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Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam

You misunderstand the scope of both gangbangs. The one on Dreams lasted about 2 days and mainly just bounced your province into your fake war before you hit VM and then it was ended. Rage was gb'd down to under half their starting size when they were in full pump mode without military. It was initially just a full db gb on Rage with the "alliance war" coming after. Rage was completely unprepared as were their allies while those doing the db and gb were of course prepared. Things only ended because the db'ers and gb'ers were crushed, not because of mercy like was shown to you.

You also misunderstand my position on Realest. I don't like him as a person and I have some respect for his win at all costs play even if I chose an opposite approach myself. I also am aware it was Phiwha in charge of the GB along with his supporting leadership in Sonata, but it was Realest who was the "master" as you put it and who announced in the forums that Sonata was back. It was also Realest's gf who hacked the accounts in Rage with his knowledge. Also, don't forget, that it was actually Sonata's former ally who came to me with the request to gb them if they came back as payback and it wasn't just me pushing some agenda there.

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Yeah you're well known for pushing aside valuable game time to gb people out of the kindness of your heart. No motives besides being a kind soul and good friend.

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Originally Posted by Elit

ABS power was all about alliance team play not around individual Kingdoms skills. Is true in alliance was very good plaers. I dont know good zoot but from what i remember he was good, carsen (name is with typo) too. I cant really say how good was Titan, but sure he was arrogant. He is first ABS leader i meet during my ghetto lead days and one from 3 kingdoms i punished being ~~30% smaller.

Overal you have point but this don't change fact Rage never prove something outside ABS limits.

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Of course being allied to a few other top kingdoms always was a big advantage, but beside that, one of the reason Absalom was so succesful was that a big proportion of the leaders/kingdoms were individually very solid. Ultimately, I think you're right that winning without an alliance is more impressive than a win with Absalom, but let's also remember that even the independant kingdoms weren't without allies or friends.

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Originally Posted by Korp

So Rage nor Absalom could handle few key players quitting? Albeit being such great alliances and "strongest warring kd in Utopia". Whats more likely is that since more people quit resulted in fewer Absalom kingdoms, fewer Absalom kingdoms meaning there was no dominant position, no dominant position to powerplay less success.

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I'm sure ASF will tell you exactly how many ages Rage has lasted, but if a kingdom lose it's leaders without being able to replace them with equally skilled leaders, the kingdom will decline. Absalom and Absalom's kingdoms are no exception. Now if you want to believe your fairy tale and pretend like Rage was only good because of Absalom based on errenous interpretation of a correlation, then be my guest.

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Originally Posted by makeo

Dear Korp,
I see ASF has sent Bourreau to forum warar you.
Presumably ASF will vulture you with a wall text after you farm him.

Regards,
makeo

p.s Any implication or relation to how Absalom used Grace for many ages is purely coincidental

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LOL

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Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam

Also, don't forget, that it was actually Sonata's former ally who came to me with the request to gb them if they came back as payback and it wasn't just me pushing some agenda there.

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That's "kinda" BS after the logs Elit so vehemently posted. I mean, even if true, it doesn't really excuse anything. Doesn't really matter if someone asked you to do something while you are the one in position of power.

Matija, Cheese had his own alliance and own power and was allied with Sonata when they tricked his alliance into gbing Rage. Sonata then mass deleted when Rage was about to declare on them rather than continue to help their allies who were getting smashed. He wanted some revenge and with Sonata having deleted and never worked out a cf after initiating a db and gb, it seemed appropriate to me to also give some payback.

Elit's argument was that Dreams was not Sonata despite Realest saying it was and many of the core Sonata leadership being there. My counter argument was that "if it's Sonata, then they need to accept their medicine. If it's not Sonata, then why did the ex-Sonata players now in Dreams hack Rage accounts which is something Sonata would have done? Remove the Sonata leadership that hacked us and we'll drop it, or just accept your medicine."

In Elit's "golden age" victory, he was "unfairly gb'd" due to the Sonata ties and Dreams players hacking Rage accounts, but the gb was short and minimized before we ended it. Elit then later went for "revenge" and deal broke Webmaster's SG kingdom who had helped gb him. He deal broke that kingdom when they were in pump mode and farmed them which gave Dreams the crown.

This revenge deal break by Elit isn't that much different than revenge on Sonata for their db and gb. The revenge on Sonata/Dreams was also timely since the Sonata players hacked Rage accounts while in Dreams to spur the action on Dreams. Elit used his deal break on Webmaster to get Dreams #1, while Absalom helping gb Elit actually hurt the Abs kingdom chart positions while they bounced held armies while other competitors outgained.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bourreau

Of course being allied to a few other top kingdoms always was a big advantage, but beside that, one of the reason Absalom was so succesful was that a big proportion of the leaders/kingdoms were individually very solid. Ultimately, I think you're right that winning without an alliance is more impressive than a win with Absalom, but let's also remember that even the independant kingdoms weren't without allies or friends.



I'm sure ASF will tell you exactly how many ages Rage has lasted, but if a kingdom lose it's leaders without being able to replace them with equally skilled leaders, the kingdom will decline. Absalom and Absalom's kingdoms are no exception. Now if you want to believe your fairy tale and pretend like Rage was only good because of Absalom based on errenous interpretation of a correlation, then be my guest.




LOL

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I never claimed Rage was a bad kd, they were quite skilled. What I claimed was that the claim that Rage would win more crowns if they would be solo. But sure, if you want to keep believe that being in Absalom at its peak had no impact at all on sucess for the kingdom go ahead. :) Also, how can you claim that there is no correlation between power and success?

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Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam

Matija, Cheese had his own alliance and own power and was allied with Sonata when they tricked his alliance into gbing Rage. Sonata then mass deleted when Rage was about to declare on them rather than continue to help their allies who were getting smashed. He wanted some revenge and with Sonata having deleted and never worked out a cf after initiating a db and gb, it seemed appropriate to give some payback.

Elit's argument was that Dreams was not Sonata despite Realest saying it was and many of the core Sonata leadership being there. My counter argument was that "if it's Sonata, then they need to accept their medicine. If it's not Sonata, then remove the Sonata leadership and we'll drop it."

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Oh yea, totally need to trick Cheese into hitting Abs. :) Thats a good one! Funny how you trust Realest (The person you supposedly dislike) when it suited your goal and didnt trust Elit who so far has been quite honorable and fair.

I'm new to this in comparison. You'll have to further explain how you trick someone into GBing.

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Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam

This revenge deal break by Elit isn't that much different than revenge on Sonata for their db and gb. The revenge on Sonata/Dreams was also timely since the Sonata players hacked Rage accounts while in Dreams to spur the action on Dreams. Elit used his deal break on Webmaster to get Dreams #1, while Absalom helping gb Elit actually hurt the Abs kingdom chart positions while they bounced held armies while other competitors outgained.

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Are you trying to tell us Elit outplayed the entirety of Absalom? All 10+ of your legendary leaders and so forth? :)

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Originally Posted by the great kN herself

Most Valuable Crown:

Brute Force (8:8) Age 18 Triple Crown

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Agreed, but i am biased because i was in bf

https://forums.utopiatemple.com/showthread.php?t=30142

http://www.utopiatemple.com/news.php?id=879

https://forums.utopiatemple.com/showthread.php?t=32646

And just for anyone who hasn't read/remembered it and to give Pam a faettacker boner, the Pansies best crown ever run at the peak of the game

I believe the faery age was their near triple crown age, which was their b2b2b age (which I already listed). Could be wrong though.

Yes. It was.
#1 nw, #1 land and #3 honor.

My list of fave crowns is very similar to yours.
I like the Pulsing Trollfag crown as well as your list.


I actually just spat coffee when I saw that they beat up FREE as well. =P

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Originally Posted by makeo

Yes. It was.
#1 nw, #1 land and #3 honor.

My list of fave crowns is very similar to yours.
I like the Pulsing Trollfag crown as well as your list.


I actually just spat coffee when I saw that they beat up FREE as well. =P

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flogger + superkingdom roster = auto-win.

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Originally Posted by Korp

But sure, if you want to keep believe that being in Absalom at its peak had no impact at all on sucess for the kingdom go ahead.

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Originally Posted by Bourreau

Of course being allied to a few other top kingdoms always was a big advantage

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Do you even read?

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Originally Posted by Korp

Also, how can you claim that there is no correlation between power and success?

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I claimed that your explanation of the relation between the two isn't an argument of what you're trying to prove : Rage wasn't good without Absalom and they would have won less crowns.

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Originally Posted by Korp

I never claimed Rage was a bad kd, they were quite skilled. What I claimed was that the claim that Rage would win more crowns if they would be solo.

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Originally Posted by Korp

Rage would have less crowns if they were solo just look how Rage turned slowly to **** as Absaloms power dwindled. You must be drunk if you think that Absalom had nothing to do with your success story. But I guess its easy to claim things when you never have to own up to them. :) PS remember how Rage lost to SWEA? lul.

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Looks like you implied Rage was s**t without Absalom at its full power.

But just for the discussion, can you tell me of two disadvantages to be in Absalom for Rage that could have hurted their crowning attempts?

Not being able to farm the less skilled kds.

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Originally Posted by Bourreau

Do you even read?



I claimed that your explanation of the relation between the two isn't an argument of what you're trying to prove : Rage wasn't good without Absalom and they would have won less crowns.





Looks like you implied Rage was s**t without Absalom at its full power.

But just for the discussion, can you tell me of two disadvantages to be in Absalom for Rage that could have hurted their crowning attempts?

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What Rens said.
But also having to take turns crowning between them.

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Originally Posted by Bourreau

Do you even read?



I claimed that your explanation of the relation between the two isn't an argument of what you're trying to prove : Rage wasn't good without Absalom and they would have won less crowns.





Looks like you implied Rage was s**t without Absalom at its full power.

But just for the discussion, can you tell me of two disadvantages to be in Absalom for Rage that could have hurted their crowning attempts?

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Its quite ironic that you ask me if I dont read when most of your text can be answered in the last posted quote.

No I didnt try to prove that Rage wasnt good without Absalom, what I did was claim that they would have less Crowns if they would be solo just as I wrote it.

No I didnt imply that Rage was **** without Absalom, what I implied that both Rage and Absalom got gradually worse. Which is the truth cause both disbanded.

What made absalom so powerful was 1) dorje's sim 2) their competition being worse. Last age is pretty symbolic of what happens when you let the non-abs inmates run the asylum. As is all the jerks/swea/simians/ama/pewpew beef mentioned previously in this thread or other threads.

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Originally Posted by Korp

Its quite ironic that you ask me if I dont read when most of your text can be answered in the last posted quote.

No I didnt try to prove that Rage wasnt good without Absalom, what I did was claim that they would have less Crowns if they would be solo just as I wrote it.

No I didnt imply that Rage was **** without Absalom, what I implied that both Rage and Absalom got gradually worse. Which is the truth cause both disbanded.

Maybe if you learn to stick to the discussion and not

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Rage and absalom disbanded because they recruited proteus. He was anti-absalom's most powerful weapon.

Smart guy, though.

Korp, Rage had the best war record of any Abs kingdom by far and I'm pretty sure the best war record of any kingdom on the server over the ages Rage existed. Do you really think that having a bunch of unbreakable eoa NAPs is helpful in that situation? Elit can probably tell you himself that having EOA NAPS with kingdoms you could own in war will cost you crowns.

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Originally Posted by Korp

No I didnt imply that Rage was **** without Absalom, what I implied that both Rage and Absalom got gradually worse. Which is the truth cause both disbanded.

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Yes, this is true, but the competition also got gradually worse. The age I retired, Rage finished #1 NW and #2 land. HoH (an Abs NAP kingdom) got #1 land. Dorje and I both retired after that age and it was really Abs last age.

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Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

Are you trying to tell us Elit outplayed the entirety of Absalom? All 10+ of your legendary leaders and so forth? :)

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First, Abs cf'd Elit without too extensive damage on him (mostly a lot of both sides being stalled and some damage to his province.) In the end we accepted his argument that Dreams was no longer Sonata after Versace was deleted for hacking rage and realest quit. After this cf, there was no "Absalom vs Dreams". The top kingdoms later were Webmaster with Sg, ZZ, and Dreams. ZZ was one of the kingdoms that had initially agreed to help Cheese gb "Sonata" but then backed out and used the time to get out front. After Elit dealbroke Webmaster, it was between Dreams and ZZ. After ZZ backed out on the coalition against "Sonata", no one shed a tear when Dreams beat them.

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Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam

Korp, Rage had the best war record of any Abs kingdom by far and I'm pretty sure the best war record of any kingdom on the server over the ages Rage existed. Do you really think that having a bunch of unbreakable eoa NAPs is helpful in that situation? Elit can probably tell you himself that having EOA NAPS with kingdoms you could own in war will cost you crowns.



Yes, this is true, but the competition also got gradually worse. The age I retired, Rage finished #1 NW and #2 land. HoH (an Abs NAP kingdom) got #1 land. Dorje and I both retired after that age and it was really Abs last age.

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Hey ASF, y u ignoring me? you watching the fights?

Hmm, just got home and had the forums open and got distracted! Will be watching now.

That being said the only time in between me playing in Abs and Emeriti forming that rage won was as a result of like Grace waving us OOP to give you a cakewalk, so sometimes those naps help too.

I recall our OOP orc setup that age to be a real threat to whatever dwarf thing you guys ran, and that particular age literally we were the only non-abs kd even trying for land.

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Originally Posted by chadbrochill17

Agreed, but i am biased because i was in bf

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Yeah Brute Force! (=

Who are you old friend!?

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Originally Posted by Binar

Hey ASF, y u ignoring me? you watching the fights?

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Talk to me Bin Bin, I see you and i will listen to you!

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Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam

Hmm, just got home and had the forums open and got distracted! Will be watching now.

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Im drink my morning coffee and gone bring you soon distracting arguments so keep check forum :)

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Originally Posted by Elit

Talk to me Bin Bin, I see you and i will listen to you!

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ASF usually watches UFC when I do, and I like to discuss the fights but today he wasnt there! :) You a fight fan elit?

and I guess Iam not keeping to topic, but ive heard these stories sososososos many times before

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Originally Posted by flogger

What made absalom so powerful was 1) dorje's sim 2) their competition being worse. Last age is pretty symbolic of what happens when you let the non-abs inmates run the asylum. As is all the jerks/swea/simians/ama/pewpew beef mentioned previously in this thread or other threads.

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Generally spiking you are right. Most from time Anti ABS coalitions was much more lame from ABS, but i cant understand why you mix this with Kds you mention and where is BB in this list?

Lets not forget when game was big its was much more dirty and every one have done everything and no one bothered about ethic and moral. All what mattered is chart EOA. Second more you go down from top more dirty become game. Every one get hits in his hostiles, TOP honor Kds raze other in his war for win age. Its common practice from decades. Warycray/Jerks/Swea/simians and many other are all Kds with no ability to compete in top for win age proper. ITs why when they have his one time chace they are ready to do anting for win. Ronin last age is no different from any other kingdom in past. Still this is not "alliance problem". When AMA and BB become only ally together we didunt had any from this kind problems because both from us was strong enough to compete proper. ITs why is very bad to get weak ally, they make all time problems. Still on alliance level Jerks never made any BS during our 1 age together. They listened to us. SWEA is not guilty at all. ITs was Pure our intra kd group mistake for not able to handle our problems. Let remind you how during all crisis you left and become inactive. Its was your duty to deal with all this but most active BB member was Baka coming to alliance channel drink every day and call me names.

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Originally Posted by flogger

Rage and absalom disbanded because they recruited proteus. He was anti-absalom's most powerful weapon.
Smart guy, though.

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Making fun on Proteus was my favorite for long and its was really big loss for me to take him in AMA because i dont troll my/ex KD mates. Still here is something important i learned about him during our time together. Proteus really respect ASF. He never told any bad or disrespectful word about him. Its real loyalty and i value most from all this. So he deserve respect for it, but when i learned he joined Pew Pew its broke my heart!

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Originally Posted by Binar

ASF usually watches UFC when I do, and I like to discuss the fights but today he wasnt there! :) You a fight fan elit?

and I guess Iam not keeping to topic, but ive heard these stories sososososos many times before

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Gona bring some new special for you :)
I don't watch UFC and its crazy i wake up. ATM is 5am for me!

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Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

Are you trying to tell us Elit outplayed the entirety of Absalom? All 10+ of your legendary leaders and so forth? :)

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I can confirm ASF think high for my abilities !

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Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam

First, Abs cf'd Elit without too extensive damage on him (mostly a lot of both sides being stalled and some damage to his province.) In the end we accepted his argument that Dreams was no longer Sonata after Versace was deleted for hacking rage and realest quit. After this cf, there was no "Absalom vs Dreams". The top kingdoms later were Webmaster with Sg, ZZ, and Dreams. ZZ was one of the kingdoms that had initially agreed to help Cheese gb "Sonata" but then backed out and used the time to get out front. After Elit dealbroke Webmaster, it was between Dreams and ZZ. After ZZ backed out on the coalition against "Sonata", no one shed a tear when Dreams beat them.

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I have hard time to understand your definition about "extensive damage". I got like 100-200 hits (bonces and after it break) for 1h. During all this process Proteus send me pm asking polite how i feel and do i think exploring few acres more from him make me any better. He really try to understand me but cant tell same for you:P

You never bother to understand my situation and why for example i was against Realest when i joined KD. Its a bit ironical but reason is again age 46, same excuse you used to prepare all GB. During age 46 if you remember i had 1 age ghetto with friends (you named us: Retired allyas). I was away from game for 5-6 full ages and didn't know whats going so when all AWAR/GB start i spend time talk to almost every KD in TOP 50 and ask about his opinion for all situation. Result was shocking. Almost everyone told me: We hate ABS and We Hate Sonata so much. Can you explain how its possible for kingdom being only for 2 ages around to be equal hated with ABS. Sure Realest have some amazing skills to gain people hate. I don't know any details about how they play but its alone made me against idea Realest to have any lead role in Kd we decide to play together. Its why i made all big fuss when i joined. Later i got GBed from ABS about what i didn't like in Realest. Can you see all irony here?

About Versace hack, its was very bad from her but how im supposed to know and prevent it, You didn't know your Kd mates shared his login info with her before all this hapen. Its not fair to blame any one from Dreams about it and mention together. Lets not forget your GB was planed and prepared long before it. You served us notice 1h before (Fury? forgot name) declare us war. Its really dirty move and rumors about incoming GB was all around. Its not hard to understand why Versace did what she did. So its not only her fault too. ABS have his fair share in all this.

You talk how some other kingdoms back off from GB. Well i did really good job talking to any one for prevent GB and make its only ABS. Still for ZZ im not sure its was result from my effort. I talked to ZZ king but we didn't know each other good. From other side Realest was supposed to be close with him? I really cant tell main reason for ZZ to stay away but they are one from Kds alarm me for incoming GB and wish me GL.

Webmaster was poor innocent kid destined to meet strong political manipulator like you. SG had zero reasons to join GB. I talked Webmaster and he told me direct: If ABS GB you they will gain much acres and if i dont join i will be in disadvantage. He have see situation this way, but he forgot its same for every other kingdom and when ABS/SG gained so much acres in lame way its put naturally every one involved in GB in wanted list. Its why later on age we was in position for deal break them with no interfere from any one. Our wave on SG was well made decision include opinion outside KD. Solo kingdom cant decide on his own and deal break KD in alliance when here is 20 more competitive Kds. Its not going to work. I never had any bad feeling about WB. He was way to young for lead KD and make proper decisions in complicate times.

I want to honor mention Fratzia. They did really great age. If remember correct they won against rage? Age 50 was really great true competitive age. I have so many fun memory from it.

Yes, it was actually Fratzia I meant, not ZZ.

Im going to say something i think might not be popular but whatever.. From what i remember pansies several times just cfed everyone and diced to victory? At least their last age winning they did that.. Sid was probably great in war and all that but it seems he was very skilled with getting people to like him and getting cfs. I mean i dont really care how you win as long as you win, but people claiming they did something so magical and beyond what others did.. idk..

I obviously think every crown bruteforce got was the best ever gained in the old days.. I also agree with what someone said earlier about that the irc-notice brute did to pbs, that was a good moment in the utopian history.

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Originally Posted by vir

I also agree with what someone said earlier about that the irc-notice brute did to pbs, that was a good moment in the utopian history.

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Its was me keep track on cool events. Way BF gave notice PBs was way to cool and inspiring.