Spartans Vs Nonpandas

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12-09-2016, 09:20
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

I don't see it that way. What's so special about pumping in whoring tier against pumping in warring tier? If anything while I was playing in FS I pumped way deeper because when an even war is arranged the only edge over your opponent you can personally achieve is pumping out the most out of the piece of land you have. Whoring is more about oow play as in finding the right targets and things like that while the LS has to monitor the intricate CF deals - their terms and expiration dates. Sure a bit more strategy is involved in whoring conflicts simply because the competition is stiffer but that changes nothing for the regular grunt. My point is a good active warring tier grunt, after learning the basics of what constitutes a good whoring target, will outperform a "pro slacker" any day. Reasons for failure should be found in the competence of the LS, KD structure, overall discipline and similar. That is not to say that someone is incompetent but that there will always be someone who holds a slight edge.

So how long has FS been playing at the top end of the game? Not just talking whoring, but winning crowns and performing at a high level. Now ask yourself where Sparta was 3-4 ages ago. This is exactly the difference I'm referring to.
12-09-2016, 09:38
MyNameIsMatija

You've said it yourself you used to outpump everyone; what's different this time?
12-09-2016, 09:42
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

You've said it yourself you used to outpump everyone; what's different this time?

Me not being online 24/7
12-09-2016, 09:50
MyNameIsMatija

You think an absence of the other KD's "strategical mind" or whatever wouldn't have an impact on their overall performance?
12-09-2016, 09:59
JohnnyReid

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bart of Sparta

Me not being online 24/7

He's being legit, here.. xD
12-09-2016, 10:03
MyNameIsMatija

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyReid

He's being legit, here.. xD

Of course he's talking to me after all xD
12-09-2016, 10:19
Folle

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

You've said it yourself you used to outpump everyone; what's different this time?

lulz, he is cute isnt he?

#soyouthinkyoucanpump
12-09-2016, 11:28
Zauper

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

I don't see it that way. What's so special about pumping in whoring tier against pumping in warring tier? If anything while I was playing in FS I pumped way deeper because when an even war is arranged the only edge over your opponent you can personally achieve is pumping out the most out of the piece of land you have. Whoring is more about oow play as in finding the right targets and things like that while the LS has to monitor the intricate CF deals - their terms and expiration dates. Sure a bit more strategy is involved in whoring conflicts simply because the competition is stiffer but that changes nothing for the regular grunt. My point is a good active warring tier grunt, after learning the basics of what constitutes a good whoring target, will outperform a "pro slacker" any day. Reasons for failure should be found in the competence of the LS, KD structure, overall discipline and similar. That is not to say that someone is incompetent but that there will always be someone who holds a slight edge.

For what it's worth, you have not yet experienced a true whoring tier war. I don't think BB has had one since before the GB age. (maybe the Emeriti fight the age after would qualify? but that didn't escalate and you weren't there)

It's possible that FS is the exception to the trend of how war tier kds play -- I can certainly tell you that ED, which stomped over the majority of war tier kds -- certainly never homes pumped. And in our giraffes age, with similar results, we may have used homes but never went deeper than maybe 3-5 PPA.

A good active warring tier grunt is great -- but I'd still take a "pro slacker" like mango, godly, myself, flogger, etc -- over them. Many of our best recruits have come from warring kds. However, it has often taken 1-2 ages before they were really performing well, because there are significant adjustments to make. And one of those is learning how to micro your prov through a pump/prep phase.
12-09-2016, 11:30
Judge

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elit

Drink or not his post still make sense so lets him post!

I don't know his feelings but still i think he is one from my fans! :)

Eh, no. That post by flogger was legit, just that the number of ages is much more than 15 is what I meant!

Secondly I am not your fan. The forums are much more lively with the old timers around!
12-09-2016, 11:34
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zauper

For what it's worth, you have not yet experienced a true whoring tier war. I don't think BB has had one since before the GB age.

It's possible that FS is the exception to the trend of how war tier kds play -- I can certainly tell you that ED, which stomped over the majority of war tier kds -- certainly never homes pumped. And in our giraffes age, with similar results, we may have used homes but never went deeper than maybe 3-5 PPA.

A good active warring tier grunt is great -- but I'd still take a "pro slacker" like mango, godly, myself, flogger, etc -- over them. Many of our best recruits have come from warring kds. However, it has often taken 1-2 ages before they were really performing well, because there are significant adjustments to make. And one of those is learning how to micro your prov through a pump/prep phase.

100% true. Actually Sparta's good performance in war-tier was for a large part due to the fact we DID use deep homespumps for most of our conflicts while our opposition did not (strategy courtesy of CR - Zauper/Mango). This time our pump was rather slack due to lack of micro whereas pandas pulled it off perfectly. However, war is far from over, I'd say we have a 60-70% shot at winning it.

Edit: FWIW, I was just trolling you guys y'day about the external gc. I hadn't even checked any intel. Annoying huh, someone accusing you of stuff without providing any kind of evidence :) ?
12-09-2016, 13:08
citadela01

More like u flinged **** at ppl randomly like u allways do, and backed off when presented with math.
12-09-2016, 13:33
StratOcastle

Quote:

Originally Posted by citadela01

More like u flinged **** at ppl randomly like u allways do, and backed off when presented with math.

It's good fishing. If Bart didn't know something he knows it now.
I learned something, but not like a tectonic plate shifting naivety warp.
Without being in a specific environment it's tough to know the things that are second nature. This is why I experiment with builds; I'm in the skin and begin to see the nuances.

About Bart offending someone with accusations or insults I refer to the barbs between Elit, flogger, Anri. Barts accusations yielded explanations about pump you simply don't get in the Strategy Forum.

Edit: Maybe I've helped in some small way? I'm not defending Bart, I'm throwing you a bone.

I was 103 acres yesterday at 789 nwpa. How was your weekend?

No standing buildings. All zeros.
12-09-2016, 13:33
Anri

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judge

Eh, no. That post by flogger was legit, just that the number of ages is much more than 15 is what I meant!

Secondly I am not your fan. The forums are much more lively with the old timers around!

To be entirely honest, when Flogger post something i can make fun of him and he can make fun of me and there is still some level of respect and fun in it. But when you do it, it just looks bad, because who are you and what KD have you lead to even coming close of what ive done the last couple of ages. From my own awarness there is 1 age we actually farmed out so to speak (age 54). Other then that we beat pretty much every single KD on this server except for CR and AMA in its greatness i think, i also been actively leading Pandas when taking CR on and as far as i am concerned we gave them a hell of a fight from a disadvantage. I dont know where u get your idea of me farming out for the last 15 ages because we gave everyone a solid performance no matter if we been Simians, Pandas or 42. I think most that lost wars or got waved or even won over us would consider it to be solid and good fights. You however, what have you done? ****ing peon
12-09-2016, 13:47
Bart of Sparta

So much gratitude for someone that helped you a week ago.
12-09-2016, 14:30
Anri

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bart of Sparta

So much gratitude for someone that helped you a week ago.

We owe Binar for helping us out and we would do the same for them if they were in the same situation.
12-09-2016, 15:10
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anri

We owe Binar for helping us out and we would do the same for them if they were in the same situation.

Was referring to Elit. You know, part of the KD that first helped you.
12-09-2016, 15:17
MyNameIsMatija

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zauper

A good active warring tier grunt is great -- but I'd still take a "pro slacker" like mango, godly, myself, flogger, etc -- over them. Many of our best recruits have come from warring kds. However, it has often taken 1-2 ages before they were really performing well, because there are significant adjustments to make. And one of those is learning how to micro your prov through a pump/prep phase

Your strategic prowess doesn't make you more active or whore or pump better than me. I'd take 23 of myself and 2 Elits over anything else any day :D
12-09-2016, 15:21
Bart of Sparta

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

Your strategic prowess doesn't make you more active or whore or pump better than me. I'd take 23 of myself and 2 Elits over anything else any day :D

I'd take 24 Barts + 1 Makka over anything. Just imagine 24 of me on these forums. Wouldn't even have to beat you in-game :/
12-09-2016, 15:23
MyNameIsMatija

Hmmm my suggestion is well rounded, even after you add forum warring to the equation.
12-09-2016, 15:27
Judge

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anri

To be entirely honest, when Flogger post something i can make fun of him and he can make fun of me and there is still some level of respect and fun in it. But when you do it, it just looks bad, because who are you and what KD have you lead to even coming close of what ive done the last couple of ages. From my own awarness there is 1 age we actually farmed out so to speak (age 54). Other then that we beat pretty much every single KD on this server except for CR and AMA in its greatness i think, i also been actively leading Pandas when taking CR on and as far as i am concerned we gave them a hell of a fight from a disadvantage. I dont know where u get your idea of me farming out for the last 15 ages because we gave everyone a solid performance no matter if we been Simians, Pandas or 42. I think most that lost wars or got waved or even won over us would consider it to be solid and good fights. You however, what have you done? ****ing peon

Well this is where you are wrong.

I have crowned 4 times till now and all the 4 times I was in the leadership. You = 0?
According to me this one statement is enough to troll you for eternity!
12-09-2016, 15:32
Zauper

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

Your strategic prowess doesn't make you more active or whore or pump better than me. I'd take 23 of myself and 2 Elits over anything else any day :D

It actually does in both cases. If you asked me if I'd rather have Kerda, who will login 2x/day and hasn't played in 30 ages, or a random war kd player -- the answer would be Kerda every time. There's value in not having monitor and bash knowledge into people's heads. CR has pretty much without a doubt been the best whoring kd (at whoring) of the last 5-10 ages. You don't always have (or want to spend) 2 ages to bring someone from a warring kd up to speed -- or have the will to micromanage them heavily. Because it will be required. Look at Octo's struggles in Sparta, who pretty much insist on making terrible hits.

Beyond that, by late age, in the average growth kingdom, you have somewhere between 10 and 15 players in important roles -- a significant portion of core, frankly. You need a lot of players that you can trust to be an effective calf or t/m. Even upper core to some extent requires extra thought. You need to figure out the optimal builds for everyone in each of those roles, and having people who can think for themselves there is very valuable -- moreso than the difference between 3k and 3.1k acres, or hitting the whore cap 2 days earlier (especially with the current sci system).
12-09-2016, 15:50
MyNameIsMatija

You haven't played with me yet, people put me on attacker because of my attitude not because I can't think for myself :D

I'll make a blunder here and there but that's because I'll try stuff that you shouldn't try, now I wouldn't even try it, the risks I make are usually when it doesn't hurt the KD from crowning, let's call them premeditated risks. Actually reaching 3000 acres while someone else is still at 2500 can have significant ramifications if taken advantage of accordingly. You will pump 10nwpa more because of the early advantage, you will simply be ahead for a while, until you get chained of course because you remain the biggest threat. Being active per tick can make a significant difference on its own in certain situations as well. There's not much thought involved most of the time if the correct orders are given on time and you simply follow them either. I'm out, I won't change your mind on this and you won't change mine, I speak from my experience and you speak from yours.
12-09-2016, 15:53
Korp

The issues is that the discussion becomes moot when one part lacks the relevant experince for the discussion.
12-09-2016, 15:59
MyNameIsMatija

There it is, argumentum ad verecundiam.
12-09-2016, 16:12
jwuzi

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

There it is, argumentum ad verecundiam.

TIL Korp = Zauper?
12-09-2016, 16:16
Korp

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwuzi

TIL Korp = Zauper?

Korp = Zauper = BoH = JohnSnowstorm
12-09-2016, 16:21
MyNameIsMatija

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0oDjBh5lF4

Because, I don't know, what doesn't Pulp Fiction go with?
12-09-2016, 16:38
Anri

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judge

Well this is where you are wrong.

I have crowned 4 times till now and all the 4 times I was in the leadership. You = 0?
According to me this one statement is enough to troll you for eternity!

Take your crowns and wear them proudly because it was all your effort ohh great leader Judge.
12-09-2016, 16:42
Band of Horses

Quote:

Originally Posted by Korp

Korp = Zauper = BoH = JohnSnowstorm

Jet fuel can't melt steel beams.
12-09-2016, 16:46
Korp

Quote:

Originally Posted by Band of Horses

Jet fuel can't melt steel beams.

Its not whats possible, its what you can make people believe.
12-09-2016, 16:51
Persain

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zauper

It actually does in both cases. If you asked me if I'd rather have Kerda, who will login 2x/day and hasn't played in 30 ages, or a random war kd player -- the answer would be Kerda every time. There's value in not having monitor and bash knowledge into people's heads. CR has pretty much without a doubt been the best whoring kd (at whoring) of the last 5-10 ages. You don't always have (or want to spend) 2 ages to bring someone from a warring kd up to speed -- or have the will to micromanage them heavily. Because it will be required. Look at Octo's struggles in Sparta, who pretty much insist on making terrible hits.

Beyond that, by late age, in the average growth kingdom, you have somewhere between 10 and 15 players in important roles -- a significant portion of core, frankly. You need a lot of players that you can trust to be an effective calf or t/m. Even upper core to some extent requires extra thought. You need to figure out the optimal builds for everyone in each of those roles, and having people who can think for themselves there is very valuable -- moreso than the difference between 3k and 3.1k acres, or hitting the whore cap 2 days earlier (especially with the current sci system).

I like this post. very few leaders understand this and even in the war tier you can have "between 10 and 15 players in important roles" which lots of kds underestimate.
12-09-2016, 16:55
Judge

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anri

Take your crowns and wear them proudly because it was all your effort ohh great leader Judge.

See this is where you fail again. I said leadership not kd Monarch! But oh Well, you should stick to triple noticing kingdoms!
12-09-2016, 16:58
MyNameIsMatija

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judge

See this is where you fail again. I said leadership not kd Monarch! But oh Well, you should stick to triple noticing kingdoms!

I have to ask you, are you home.alone?
12-09-2016, 17:03
Osaze

Quote:

Originally Posted by Korp

Korp = Zauper = BoH = JohnSnowstorm

JohnSnowstorm = Vines

#Truth
12-09-2016, 17:21
Anri

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judge

See this is where you fail again. I said leadership not kd Monarch! But oh Well, you should stick to triple noticing kingdoms!

When and if we go to war the ones id like to beat is those people that matters to me, winning over Binar, Proteus, Jdorje etc. You are not on that list Judge.
Because you are a second rated player in an otherwise good KD. I dont know whos ass you been wiping to get a position in a LS in any KD.
12-09-2016, 17:21
octobrev

Playing in Spartans causes stress and gastrointestinal bleeding.

#truth
12-09-2016, 17:36
Dean21

Can we please get on topic? Any update on conflict? Ty
12-09-2016, 17:39
MyNameIsMatija

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean21

Can we please get on topic? Any update on conflict? Ty

My real play are in forum :D
12-09-2016, 17:46
Judge

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anri

When and if we go to war the ones id like to beat is those people that matters to me, winning over Binar, Proteus, Jdorje etc. You are not on that list Judge.
Because you are a second rated player in an otherwise good KD. I dont know whos ass you been wiping to get a position in a LS in any KD.

Again you fail here. When I left Sanc and joined you, you directly invited me in your council cos you wanted support other than calle and chuck. Realm was new into council so you needed someone after you. But you listened to calle and went Dwarf mystic and then O My Lord the triple notice.

Understood that you are good for nothing! Oh and I also do not consider myself on the level of jdorje or proteus but atleast again I will repeat I got crowns when i was not the main leader. You have been in pandas in god knows what position, advisory council leadership during CR war, 69 position in Emeriti War or Missionary position during war with BB. You still havent won a crown being primary secondary tertiary or the last member in any kd yet!
12-09-2016, 17:47
Judge

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

I have to ask you, are you home.alone?

The last time someone asked me the same question in Emeriti, I ended up blocking that person on slack!

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