You can this thread to provide feedback & suggestions on the preliminary changes found here.
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You can this thread to provide feedback & suggestions on the preliminary changes found here.
Try again. Kthx
What'd you smoke?
Ok, in all seriousness:
– It's new. It's radical. It's a mixed bag.
– Where's bloodlust!?
– Elemental needs something more, like Town Watch.
– Heretic is still terrible.
Wonderful ,looks interesting ,fresh and you can tell someone bothered with it and we can call changes ...changes.
No race/ personality with - attack time?
Godspeed no longer - attack time?
Did you reduce the base attack time?
Also what southland said....
Wow.. gratz for thinking big.... Now let me go look at the changes properly
Going to be a weird age - keep having to release elites in EOWCF and retrain them as specs. Any chance we can have a setting to turn off elite degradation? (Otherwise waving for war gets really slow - wave, release and retrain... going to be very slow.)
Archon Sol Def is only 15% weaker than Archon Specs. This seems ok, but maybe a little high - sol ball games don't strike me as good for the game.
Fiend Aggro Sol Offense is only 10% weaker than Fiend Specs. This seems like a problem. Admittedly, that assumes you are mounting them... but if you plan on that and play sol ball offense games, you might get some really stupid results because the marginal loss isn't that high.
The changes look really interesting! Here are my suggestions:
Firstly, I think we deserve a little better explanation to what happened to the world of Utopia than "for unknown reasons most of the old races went extinct, except faeries and humans, and some new guys just showed up in a timely manner!" that's pretty lame lore right there, c'mon guys. And they all continue to use the same gold coin currency, same runes to cast spells, still eating bushels. Would have been fun if it was all presented in a way to help make sense of these drastic changes.
Mechanics - Really looking forward to most of these mechanics changes. Don't see a reason to remove draft discount during eowcf though, I think that period should in fact make it easier to pump back up, maybe wizard production increases during eowcf even. Make expose thieves a little more difficult to cast.
Races - looks crazy and the race's spell book's are a bit imbalanced, but will be fun with the mix-up of bonuses and penalties. Fey is obviously a defensive T/M race so instead of a combat gains debuff you take away a general instead, especially now that at home generals decrease troop losses.
Personalities - for mystic, does increased guild effectiveness include wizard production, or do they not have increased wizard production anymore? In heretic it's worded wizard production and mystic is guild effectiveness so I assume mystics won't produce increased wizards which makes much worse and needs something else to make it viable. Raider seems like a cool idea, but it is very weak as it stands.
Looking forward to the changes, but bummed the races I've played the past 22 years were taken out of the picture with such a dumb explanation.
Guilds effectiveness includes wizard production, yes.
1) New Races - Utopia will be a bit strange without the usual races, but I understand the need for a shakeup. Last time that was attempted everyone complained about the races not filling their traditional roles, missing the bonuses they "always" had etc.. So I guess I'll google what these new races are supposed to look like.
2) Honor seems allright. Bit more of a climb, but top titles also easier to achieve.
3) Science/Libraries - not sure I agree with changes to Science and Science buildings.
Boosting Scientist production was an effective way of increasing ones scientists and science production in turn. Now revelation will be the only way of increasing Scientists. And while Universities provides increased Science production, everyone will now be stuck with the same number of Scientists which seems like a further dumbing down of the Science system. If I spend my time efficiently when the KD has downtime (between wars) I would like to be rewarded for playing better than someone who chooses not to do this.
With the change to Universities (and elite costs) Learns will also be a much more unattractive attack option as people will be using Universities much more frequently (reducing gains from Learns) and the cost of Learning will be higher (due to higher elite costs).
Decreasing book production by a factor of 10, while "only" increasing book efficiency by a factor of ~3, seems to be yet another change to reduce the impact of Science. I don't really understand why.
For me, part of the fun is to see my province growing stronger throughout the age - with less and less science being produced/available, this also means my province will progress less through the age, nor can I "specialize" it in a manner I see most beneficial to my setup and role in KD.
4) Attacking ...
Trads converting Specs to Elites ? What is the ratio here ? Similar to current UD ?
I like the increased Elite prices.. this makes Specialists viable for a longer period of the age.
I also like the removal of RKNW.
Lowering desertions - interesting, though this seems to make it harder to disable provinces. Any notion how much desertions will be reduced ?
5) Relations
Seems like Hostile Meters will be purchansed this age hehe.
I sort of dislike that recent changes in this department has reduced ones ability to fight back against bigger KD's, but I guess complaints have been voiced in regards to difficulty dealing with much smaller KD's as well.
6) Rituals
Godspeed ritual needs a new name
Races and Personalities - nice with a proper shake-up. I think I've seen people excited over more or less every race and every personality so far, so I hope Final Changes will manage to cause as much excitement as the proposed ones.
EDIT: Revised Changes posted while I posted this..
Laboratories still exist.
Sci effects will be almost identical.
So just a quick question, why is science getting nerfed so hard?
I see Hex bottled the racial name changes.
What spells are classified as support spells within these changes?
All the previous ones plus Divine Shield.Quote:
Originally Posted by thejudge
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avenger
- Science Book production and rewards decreased by a factor of 10
- Science Book NW value increased by a factor of 10
- Science Book effects increased by a factor of ~3
I'm not sure if we're in the same universe here...but reducing books by a factor of 10, and only increasing their effects by a factor of 3 does not seem to add up to being "identical". Seems more like science will be much more difficult to increase while having a higher impact on NW.
My understanding is that science is pretty much the same, they've just divided the numbers by 10.
The science formula is that science book effects is proportional to roughly the square root of your number of books (actually to the power of 1/2.125,).
This means that if you give everyone one tenth the number of books, and you triple the effectiveness of books, nothing has changed.
EG 100,000 books of income science gives you 16.3% now, (100,000^1/2.125)*0.0724, according to the wiki
In the new world, you only have 10,000 science books, but books are ~3 times as good. So that's (10,000^1/2.125)*0.0724*3 = 16.6%
Presumably what they mean by ~3 is that the 16.6% will actually be 16.3%, i.e. no change.
Re general feedback though. What I don't like is that in general, racial penalties and bonuses seem to have shrunk. This makes everything less interesting.
Thing's seem more interesting when the races have big bonuses and large drawbacks. But that might just be me.
These changes suck
Yes they did. To 14.4 ....Quote:
Originally Posted by Stingaaaa
Is there any rationale as to why Dwarfs that could use war horses and build stables throughout their history are no longer able?
Why does necromancer, that dabbles in the dark arts, carry the plague?
Devoid of logic and uninspiring. RIP.
It was a harsh winter and they ate them. Then they developed a taste for horse meat, so now they raise them on farms for food. It also explains why they no longer need to consume extra food.Quote:
Originally Posted by thejudge
Because you're reviving people that died of who-knows-what virus without curing that. Of course you're bound to bring back an ancient disease or two.Quote:
Why does necromancer, that dabbles in the dark arts, carry the plague?
Quote:
Originally Posted by thejudge
Somebody didn't see the Lord of the Rings movies...
Huh, that actually makes sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbrown
Thanks for doing the math where I was too lazy to do it myself.
So lets accept the changes.
How are you going to play? What race/personality combos stick out as OP or have great synergy?
Human Raider
Dwarf War Hero
Does a Dwarf Raider get to attack with the war horses he just stole?
No access to war horses so id say no.
Can we clarify if university science production affects all science or just one category? The option to select the category still seems to be there in the science page, although it refers to schools.
One category.Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbrown
Does only rogue have the steal horses?
Does the war draft bonus apply during EowCF?
Is amnesia dmg same as the last age - On 11 successful casts you could expect the science effectiveness of the target be reduced to somewhere between ~84% - 72%(form last age post didn't experience amnesia last age).
EDIT: what is base attack time during war?