Clearing the types of cheating

[TehDudeAbides]

Many people don't agree on the types of cheating and this is a thread to clarify it.
Many of you agree that x-logging is a clear cheating offense vs trading, but yet say sitting is also part of trading and should be allowed.

Yet I see "intra-kd sitting" "x-log" and "sitting" the same thing.

How?

What do we do in x-log?

1. Obtain the users info.
2. Ask for when they will log off.
3. Log in for them when they are not on.
4. Do various activities.
5. Log off.
6. The original user logs back on.

Why do we do this?
- Obtain an advantage in war/various activities.
- To cover for someones absences.

Why is this unfair?

Utopia is a game which 1 person is suppose to play an account at time.
Don't give me the technical bullcrap of:
" We are playing 1 account at a time, we log off an account, and then log on an account and log back off"
NO...
Also, a clean kingdom is put to a severe disadvantage because you are covering for someone's absence in retals/waves/attacks/ops/spells wateva.

If your friend isn't on at 4am and he doesn't want to log on, you shouldn't be able to cover for him.

What do we do in sitting?
1. Obtain the users info.
2. Ask for when they will log off.
3. Log in for them when they are not on.
4. Do various activities.
5. Log off.
6. The original user logs back on.

OMG? It's NOT ANY DIFFERENT.
Why do we do this?
- Obtain an advantage in war/various activities.
- To cover for someones absences.

What ARE the differences??

X-log is more frowned upon because it's short-term and you assume the "temporary transfer" of an account in which you an absurdly unfair advantage vs a clean kingdom.

I don't want to have to start cheating and playing other people's kingdom because my activity, while quite high, just isn't enough to compete vs another person with the same activity yet has control of several - 25 accounts to be able hit me.

Lets compare this.
If I log in say 18 hours a day and one of my kd provs logs in 16

We log in 34 or 17 hours average a day.

Then you, play 24 hours a day with a person who plays 3 hours a day

You obtain their account, making it 48 hours yet your "friend" over there.
You cover for their absence.


Explain to me how x-log is not the SAME as sitting.

Don't give me this duration crap about sitting is long-term whilst x-log is short-term because I can say, I'm getting a person X to sit Y account for 4 hours.
OR another case where most likely top kd's x-log numerous times during an age, making it a long-term advantage.


You cannot support sitting and unsupport x-logging because clearly they are the same thing.

[Sweetiepie]

Agreed.

[Neal]

Yep thats the jest of it and it ruins the game.

[RAKIdaRHINO]

Don't give me this duration crap about sitting is long-term whilst x-log is short-term because I can say, I'm getting a person X to sit Y account for 4 hours.

That wouldnt really be viewed as sitting though.. to me sitting happens when someone notifies someone that theyre gonna be gone for quite some time and asks if someone if they can take care of the account when they are gone.. xlogging on the other hand happens whenever someone for some reason just cant make that wave or be on that hour.. or whatever.. im a bit tired now.. so ill probably post more tomorrow.. but i think theres a big difference both in motive and advantage from doing so.. i mean.. if theres no difference between sitting and x-loging, whats the difference between x-loging and trading.. sitting should after all be done by another person.. while x-logging is multying..

oh and yeah.. sitting is done to maintain "normal" activity levels.. x-logging is there to improve "normal" activity levels.. yet another difference.. a sitter has a real life too and can miss a wave with a few hours.. if you xlog that doesnt really happen..

[Realest]

a sitter is a transitional trade. Person A has to go away for 2 weeks, trade Person B in to play 2 weeks, Trade Person A in again after 2 weeks.

xlogging is more than 1 person in 1 account in a certain often short duration of time.

Its not the same.

[Bluefaerydust]

xlogging is also 5 people playing 25 provinces - or 35 people playing 25 provinces...

[Neal]

Im shure time periods vary for differiant people at differaint times.
That makes no differiance its still nothing but pure cheating.
Cheating all the normal players from a good game play.
There are games that have these options but not here if you play by the rules that you agree to when you open an account here.

[TehDudeAbides]

xlogging is also 5 people playing 25 provinces - or 35 people playing 25 provinces...

And sitting is still the same thing.

If you sit 5 people, thats 30 people playing 25 accounts.

[TehDudeAbides]

a sitter is a transitional trade. Person A has to go away for 2 weeks, trade Person B in to play 2 weeks, Trade Person A in again after 2 weeks.

xlogging is more than 1 person in 1 account in a certain often short duration of time.

Its not the same.

a x-log is a immediate trade. Person A has to go away for 2 hours, trade Person B in to play 2 hours, Trade Person A in again after 2 hours.

Wow.
Huge damn difference.

[Realest]

u could see it that way sure, but xlogging is done with the same crew, there is no extra person.

[rosedragoness]

Sitting:
A sitter should be province-less.
A person notify/search a sitter in advance, more like to prevent VM mode or deleted because inactive.

Xlogging:
An xlogger have theirs own province and still playing other(s). They don't trade, they play multiple accounts.
xlogger can login anytime, in any occasion.

[TehDudeAbides]

Sitting:
A sitter should be province-less.
A person notify/search a sitter in advance, more like to prevent VM mode or deleted because inactive.

Xlogging:
An xlogger have theirs own province and still playing other(s). They don't trade, they play multiple accounts.
xlogger can login anytime, in any occasion.

How about if I'm not online and I get a person to wave for me who doesn't have a province in Utopia?
Still xlog?

And how about a sitter?
Can't they log in anytime because you have to give them user info?

[rosedragoness]

How about if I'm not online and I get a person to wave for me who doesn't have a province in Utopia?
Still xlog?

xlog, because the second argument: in advance and term of time.

And how about a sitter?
Can't they log in anytime because you have to give them user info?

No, it is like a contract, you move away after you finish it.

[RAKIdaRHINO]

TehDude
a x-log is a immediate trade. Person A has to go away for 2 hours, trade Person B in to play 2 hours, Trade Person A in again after 2 hours.

Wow.
Huge damn difference.

It sure as hell is a huge difference. Especially since you didnt consider trading == sitting == x-logging. Which wouldve been the logical conclusion in that case.

How about if I'm not online and I get a person to wave for me who doesn't have a province in Utopia?
Still xlog?
By definition its not CROSS logging. However its closer to "x-logging" in effects than "sitting" is imo.

One cannot only judge something by the actions performed to do that something,
one has to take into account motive and gain from doing so. That is true in legal systems and its true in Utopia.

[Catwalk]

Who cares about terms? This merely twists the debate in an attempt to tar everything black. Discuss what's good for the game. It's easy to argue that having people jump on to cover for hits isn't good. It's also easy to argue that being able to sit in for a guy going away for several days is acceptable. Based on that, come up with a reasonable system for legal sitting.