wow, its been like a century since obama was still elected and people are still posting stuff like " dont vote for ..." yet right here in canada our government is about to be overthrown.
did you vote conservative?
if we have reelections will you vote conservative?
this "tihs" is hapening becaus of them, why would you vote for them and make them majority?
thoughts?
I voted Green last election.
If we have a re-election recently, then I'll try voting for the libs.
I won't vote for Harper, because I think he's an incompetent for the following reasons:
1) He can't even compromise enough to handle a minority government. All he had to do was convince one of the 3 opposition parties, but I guess that was too much diplomacy for poor gun blazing Harpy to handle.
2) He told us not to worry about the economy... the economy is fine. Canada is doing great. OMG, get real!
3) He doesn't care one bit about the environment. He has the weakest environmental portfolio of all the parties and while he's in power, I can rest assure he'll do his utmost to make sure Canada is a disgrace on the international scene as far as the environment is concerned (kinda like Butch did for the US).
I won't vote for the Bloc, because I think they are a redundant artefact from a mentality that will slowly, but surely makes its way into history archive.
They are a federal party who doesn't even have any ambitions for their entire country. How idiotic is that? If you want to only represent Qc, go into provincial politics and stay the heck away from federal politics.
And they will lose support in Qc too thanks to bilingualism and immigration. If dear old misguided Gilles knows whats good for him, he'll jump out of his sorry half assed ship in the not so distant future.
That leads us with dear mr Layton... but wait... he wanted to be a part of this experimental highly unstable coalition on the eve of an economic meltdown... hmmm.... not thanks mr Layton, I'd like to have a leader who can actually put his country first.
And finally the greens. If I had my pick, they would rule this country, but they'll be lucky if they get one seat and the situation is getting dire so I can't really afford to throw my vote away on ideals alone anymore.
Last election I voted for the liberals because i felt harper was vote pandering to specific groups too much (ex. truck drivers or people wanting to buy a house) and I agree with the economics behind the greenshift and other pigouvian taxes (though to point out, dion didn't like the idea of a green shift until a few months before the election).
However, I voted for the liberals, a supposedly centrist party. I didn't vote for the unionist NDP or the seperatist bloc. I do not agree with this far-left coalition and especially not their resoning behind wanting to overthrow the government (i.e. wanting to bailout the auto-industry and the auto-union and pretend that it is a stimulus to the economy rather than just throwing money at a failing industry while at the same time increasing corporate taxes by twice as much as is spent on the stimulus which would have a net negative effect on the economy).
However, harper did sort of back the opposition into a corner when he wanted to cut their funding. Anyway, unless harper has a poor platform in the next election (though he usually does) and the liberals pick a centrist like iggy and run a good platform, I probably will be voting for the conservatives next election. All those who think the coalition has the support of the majority of canadians are diluding themselves as many people who voted liberal would have picked conservative if given the choice between the conservatives and the far-left coalition.
i dont like calling the coalition far left. but i like your point of view, thanks :) and i dont think the majority of canadians are for the coalition. im just afraid harper is gonna end up with a majority and screw everything up. his tax cut was pretty rediculus. 1%? wth am i supposed to do with 1%? im gonna save what 100$ come year end... and the gorvernment is gonna lose how many millions? i would rather keep the same tax rates and have a beter schooling/healthcare.
harper has no chance now.
With Charest re-elected and Harper's comments about the block the conservatives won't win any seats there now. Especially with Harper supporting the ADQ against Charest.
As time progresses their support in the 905 area (central ontario surrounding toronto) will slowly weaken. We all remember clement and flarity and what they did to ontario.
So how will harper win now?
He can't.
It's sad really because with a better leader the conservatives could actually have won a majority and imo been a good viable alternative to the liberals. Of course that would alienate the reform wing (from alberta mostly). What's even sadder is that they could win 30 more seats in 416/905 area of ontario if they weren't so ideologically driven. It wouldn't even cost them much. Just pay their share of toronto's and ontario's infrastructure programs and fund some real road/ rapid transit expansion. That would cost less than what they would need to get seats in quebec and less than any auto industry bail out. And in exchange for funding these things they could secure support in ontario for a long time (very cheap way to win).
Regarding the coalition: it's irrelevant really. The majority of mps form the government regardless of vote share. We elect mp's, not a party, not a prime minister. That's our system. It's not a coup, it's not treachery, it's not unconstitutional. NDP/liberal/bloc make an agreement to turf harper they are within their rights to do so. Now there could be consequences for the next election mind you..
oh yeah.. as long as I've been alive, the conservative party (federal) has done nothing constructive for canada. Mulroney was twice the leader that harper ever was in spite of some of the bone-headed moves he made. At least he had significant support from all regions (including toronto/montreal/vancouver). I can't say harper enjoys the same.
I hate Harper and I will never vote for him. I don't want a coalition but if it comes down to a coalition or Harper I will take the coalition any day.
As for the block none of us want to see them get into power but truth be told if it wasn't for the bloc, Harper would have his majority and we would be in worse trouble then the USA right now.
On top Of that Harper simply sees this as a game and I feel as if he is simply wasting time and ruining Canada's reputation.
I have voted Green in every election because politicians make a promise and never follow through with it. It's time to give someone new power and someone to look over the environment. Money means nothing if we don't have anywhere to live.
Most young people are voting green now a days. Problem is most people are so upset and don't see any change ever going to happen so they don't go and bother voting. My parents have voted for liberal all their life for over 25 years. The last election they voted green. Greens will get seats it's just a matter of Canadian's actually going out there and voting. Until we get our youth to vote there will be no chance for change as the saying goes "it's hard to teach an old dog new tricks" Very few of the older generation people above 55 are the majority of voters currently and they see no need to change as everything has survived up until this point.
first let me say im a canadian living in mississauga. im actually surprised to see how many canadians are in utopia. i also go to college. even though i had voting rights i didnt vote last election.
i used to support federal liberals and still support provincial liberals but conservatives seem to be far better than the federal liberals. the problem with liberals nowadays is that they are trying to compete with NDP for working class votes. dion almost destroyed liberal brand and Bob Rae is a NDP wolf is liberal outfit. I would prefer a more centralist party. the new liberal party leader is very promising.
i dont understand why people hate harper or conservatives so much other than the unpopularity of bush. Conservatives-bashing is like communist-bashing in the fifties. and to the supporters of NDP/Greens, they never will have a chance.
Hopefully, there will be far less minorities governments in the future. cuz with minority government you can never get anything done.
last words, quebec should be kicked out of canada cuz they are a bunch of cry babies. they wont shut up about independence unless taxes collected from other provinces are given to quebec. Ex. last election premier of Quebec gave tax rebates with money given by federal government which was intended for other purposes. So the premier bought votes with money from rest of Canada.
you see this is the problem is the people that feel this is Conservative bashing. The conservatives just tried to implement legislation to kill off every political party except there own. There's democracy for you.
Harper announced we will not be in a deficit during this budget announcement that should of killed his goverment and gave him a good stance to run for a majority again. A week later after he wasn't toppled closer to the truth came outand it was anounced we may have a deficit for next year. A couple days later we find out we may have to run a deficit for 4 years. As someone said add 1% gst back and we will save a couple million dollars at least because no one other then people buying a house or car will notice 1% difference.
This is some of the games Harper plays and simply makes a joke out of politics. I don't know how you could ever vote for someone that cares about nothing including his own party and simply cares about what he want to do.
As for the Quebecois I think you should learn something about them before you say stuff about them. I was born in north york, Grew up in Barrie. Moved to quebec, BC and manitoba. Your bias is based on the block Quebecois party witch is not the majority of Quebec. Quebec voted this way because Harper is cutting all the stuff they like (such as arts funding) and that was the only way to make sure Harper did not get a majority to do this. Most people from Quebec want to be part of Canada and will not vote for Harper when Harper calls the Quebecois one thing in English and another in French. Half the peoplethere speak both languages and are aware of his games he continues to play. Most people from Quebec are happy to be in Canada but as the story goes the loudest people are the most heard instead of the majority. Any who I hope this helps enlighten you about Quebec and I wish people would learn about Canada as a hole instead of little areas of the country
grimborn,
if conservatives can fundraise i dont see why other parties shouldn't be able to do the same, if so many people claim they hate Harper and Conservatives they should open up their wallet and start donating. Dont argue that rich people support Conservatives because it is not true. rich people support liberals before they f*cked up with dion and his left-wing policies. NDP cries that poor people dont have money to donate. but if there are so many poor people that need representation they can each donate less amount. $5000 can be $100 from 50 ppl or $10 from 500 people. public subsidies is created in 1995, sounds you suggesting canada was not a democracy before then.
Politicians never keep all their promises. McGuinty said there will be no new taxes before he was elected. Afterwards he increased health premium, and most people in ontario accepted it because he won the next election nevertheless. Running deficit is not a huge problem in canada because Canadians hold most of the debt so debt interest goes back to canada in a way, unlike US. I do feel the difference when i pay 2% less taxes on everything. The people who dont notice are the idiots dont take a look at the receipts. Only people who dont benefit are the poor people who spend most of their money on vegetable and fruits things that arent taxed. People think income tax cuts are better because they get the whole amount at the same time instead a little bit at a time. government surplus depends on state of economy not who is in power.
i dont hate quebec, but i also dont see why they have to be part of canada or why rest of canada have to try so hard to keep them. they speak different language, have different culture and only is part of canada because french had lost to britain 300 years ago in a war. if identity is a main concern they should form their own country. im tired of federal politicians keep appeasing, first it was the official languages act now it is the nation within a nation bs. i think one day it will be a separate nation.
anyways, like i said i dont really care enough about politics as long as current government isnt doing that bad. yeah im part of the 40.9% that didnt care enough to vote last election. but sometimes when i see the posts made by liberal bloggers on globe and mail or CTV news i feel very tempted to donate to conservatives. cuz i know these ppl cant put their money at where their mouth is.
Last edited by kwwww; 21-12-2008 at 20:23.
I'm ok with Harpy preventing parties from getting subsidies, as long as he doesn't cash in his prime minister paychecks and the rest of his party do the same.Originally Posted by kwwww
The opposition is part of the government and deserves to be paid.
Harpy is just desperately trying to grab majority government power despite the fact that the voting population didn't give it to him.
Of course you don't hate Quebec.
Its just that... they don't tend to vote like you would like them to and it would be so much more convenient of Quebec was out of the way... and then, half of Ontario... and then, the maritimes...
That way, Canada would really be Canada with real western... ah, I mean Canadian values.
Quebec agreed to be be part of Canada when the confederation was formed in 1867.
We, with Ontario were the economic heart of the country which supported all the colonization that took place in the West. You needed us and chances are, you'll need us again when your oil is depleted or when oil peak is reached and people start to really look for alternate sources of energy so suck it up.
Furthermore, I'd bet you probably don't speak French and would feel uncomfortable as hell in a French speaking area and you probably don't want to mingle too much with all these Frenchies anyways and would rather they not be part of your English speaking country right?
With all the immigration that takes place nowadays, don't tell me you really believe in a country with a homogenous culture. Nobody who wasn't born in a barn would believe that. Chances are that in a couple of generations, most of the population in Canada won't even be of European descent.
Canada isnt that the social experiment where England and France try to run a thing together ;)
Technically, its 75% English and 25% French so not quite. Don't forget to throw in the natives too. People always forget about the natives.Canada isnt that the social experiment where England and France try to run a thing together ;)
However, the country is more than the sum of its parts.
Stressing an English/French schism is an overly simplistic view of modern Canada.
There are also a lot of language independant regional differences that some very vocal minorities seem to overlook.
At this point, I'd venture to say that the East/West differences in values overshadow the linguistic ones between the French and the English.
That say, the preceding statement is still an over generalization and significant differences can be found elsewhere (for example, in Quebec, there is a world of difference between the popular values held in Montreal and in Quebec city).
Overall, if we try to split the country until all parts are homogeneous entities, we'll end up with scarsely populated North American version of Europe.
Some of the more radical elements of this country seem to think this is the desirable outcome and we'd be better off that way, but I've resisted such argumentation all my life. I think if we try to reason and squable less, some satisfactory middle ground can be reached.
However, I don't think Harpy is that middle ground.
Last edited by Magn; 31-12-2008 at 20:49.
no, even singaporean politics is more exciting
Well, I think we need a revolution of some scale. Our entire political system is flawed. We vote for MP's who have to vote accourding to their party leader. Of course this is the only way things will get done, but it negates the point of even paying MP's out of tax payers money. We have one of the greatest nations with some of the best ideals, and the social wellfare we have for our people is amazing. We just need to restructure government to represent the majority more, and not have such a lame duck government every time a minority is elected, which by the looks of things will be another ten years of NOTHING being done. We have too many parties tying up votes now, which I don't mind, but the inability of free voting by our MP's makes it a buddy system. If Layton gets in an arguement with Harper he can simply side with the Liberals every time.
Another peeving thing is the representation. 11% of Canadian voters voted Green, myself included. We have zero seats representing us. Less than 10% voted Bloc(I think I'm right here), and they have a vast number of seats. I'm not sure how you can change this, but it is pretty depressing.
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