Israel, it's about time!

[1eye]

Nemo, the palestinians want -67 borders. Hamas offered it many times, but Israel refused. And Israel will NEVER give up Jerusalem, they want it all.

And the reason why USA supports Israel, is because american presidents are bribed by jews in usa. Well, americans don't call it bribe, but in norway, paying the president for services like that, is a bribe. Corruption.

Also, did you know that the ISRAELI JEW that Obama has as chief of staff is suspected to be Mossad's leader in North America? And why on earth are Israelis that high up in the government? He doesn't want what's best for usa, he wants what's best for Israel.

stoffi, what do you call the people that pay Hamas? oh yeah, Iran, theran, iyetollah..they are not corrupt, they are just cleansing the world of us infidels..leave them alone and lets all hate jews like stoffi you hitler azzkizzer

[Mystarria]

The Irish did not use suicide bombs, true, they just used bombs. They did target civilian targets, including pubs. The crux of the argument being, the IRA gave warning before a bomb went off. In general they did not wish to kill, but would do so if their threats were not taken sufficiently serious.

I am fed up of reading about hostilities. I am fed up of watching the UN be incapable of stopping at a traffic let alone capable of stopping military action. Following the Georgie crisis with Russia was bad enough, and no doubt Georgia was not 100% innocent in that, but they still were in a David and Goliath situation and there were no slings/stones.
Israel and Palenstine have issues - agreed. The UN is a waste of space. The USA is riddled with Jews who pressurise politics into doing what's best for Israel. Give them credit, very cunning, but i get so bored of watching Israel get away with military action because AMERICA looks the other way. I also get fed up that anti semitism even comes up in debates as an accusation... just cause you criticise doesn't mean you're antisemitic. In a way, the Middle East has always been fked with by Europe, specifially France and England, and the USA. You can understand their outrage, but you cannot condone suicide bombing designed to do the most damage possible. I was in London for 7/7 and it is days like that you can understand why people want to hit back, but where does it get you? Nowhere. It just gets you more dead lying in the streets. Beg the UN for peacekeepers, if any of them get hurt, then it will be a new ball game. At the minute it's like two squabbling children that have bunked off school.

[Mourhelm]

The attack on the Tsar was a suicide bombing.

But it was not a wide spread tactic of Poland and it was not in a western country (east Europe is eastern...).

In their eyes, this is a war. Their only means of protection, since they don't have patriot missiles to save them from the F-16s, is to hide inside the civilian population. It's guerilla warfare. They fight, the people protect them. To the palestinians, they are freedom fighters.

They are not only hiding inside civilian population, they operate from withing the population (for example, they launch rockets from schools). According to international law, the responsibility for civilian deaths is theirs, because of this.

I thought you were referring to the actual suicide bombers. Not the leaders.

I was referring to both. I think it's kind of obvious that if you bomb civilians you value their death more than your own life.

That, I'm afraid, is the effect of the brainwashing they receive. They don't know any better, cause they haven't been taught any better.

See, this is like the dark ages for Islam. There's very little education. Very little knowledge about what their religion really is. In the middle ages, it consisted of civilized countries that valued education, knowledge, science and arts. Of course, in every religion there are extremists. And they would've never had this much power had it not been for the West's foolishness. Even liberal Muslims are starting to doubt the West's sincerity now. Why? Because the West has given the extremists a cause.

See, they think this is all a conspiracy by the Christian and Jewish worlds, who don't want the Muslims to prosper as they once had. Before the British took over India, the divide between Muslims and Hindus wasn't as glaring. Blinded by their Imperialist hatred, the Brits divided the Indian subcontinent. They created Israel. They created conflict zones, where a normal childhood, normal education was not possible. They created a breeding ground for terrorists. Then they supported Israel with whatever they got. The extremists rejoiced.

When the impoverished kids, living in the middle of a war zone, grew up watching people starve and die everyday, what did they hear? "Oh, this is a tactic to keep us under their feet. Their fancy speeches are lies [bigshot political leaders in the middle eastern neighbourhood routinely turning up dead, didn't help Mossad and CIAs popularity, even if in certain cases, evidence pointed elsewhere]. They want to take revenge for losing the crusade." When George Bush, the idiot of the century, actually mentioned the word crusade, all hell broke loose in the Muslim conscious. Every action you have taken, every step you think you've moved forward, you've taken things from bad to worse. Every bomb dropped in Gaza, every missile attack into Pakistan, feeds those flames. You gave the extremists the background, the cause and the direction to point fingers. And things are all f'cked up now.

If things had not headed this way, we might have had more peaceful, liberal muslim countries, like Algeria, Tunisia, Turkey, Morocco, Bangladesh. But that future is screwed. I don't know how this mess can be solved. But bombing Gaza sure as hell ain't helping.

So lets say it's all the UK's fault - It doesn't help us at all.

What they believe does not justify what they are doing. If anything, it calls for the world to intervene and take control of Gaza (get an Arab/Muslim country like Malaysia or Saudi Arabia to do it), educate the population and work to build their own country instead of concentrating on the destruction of Israel.

Bombing Gaza is hardly a long term solution, but it is a course of action taken after eight years of continuous fire of rockets on Israeli cities.

I don't know where you live, but I doubt you'll agree to live in terror of rockets fired on your city (even if the enemy is out gunned and brainwashed).

[1eye]

IF YOU LIVE IN PALESTINE AND HAMAS BUILDS AN AMMO DUMP UNDER YOUR APARTMENT BUILDING...you better move before it gets bombed.

hamas is using human shields.
when planes take out ammo dumps or a rocket pad, it might be next door.

Hamas puts military installations near civilian residence for a reason.
that reason is to create public disapproval for israel action. But that is OK because the palestinians that lived on that ammo dump died for allah!


US and israel will aid and protect the Palestinian people without religious opression and propaganda.

Iran, and Hamas only care about the Palestinian people so far as they are weapons that change public opinion about israel and the palestinians are a tool to use in their holy war and jihad.



you infidels better wake up and read that,

[stoffi]

IF YOU LIVE IN PALESTINE AND HAMAS BUILDS AN AMMO DUMP UNDER YOUR APARTMENT BUILDING...you better move before it gets bombed.

hamas is using human shields.
when planes take out ammo dumps or a rocket pad, it might be next door.

Hamas puts military installations near civilian residence for a reason.
that reason is to create public disapproval for israel action. But that is OK because the palestinians that lived on that ammo dump died for allah!


US and israel will aid and protect the Palestinian people without religious opression and propaganda.

Iran, and Hamas only care about the Palestinian people so far as they are weapons that change public opinion about israel and the palestinians are a tool to use in their holy war and jihad.



you infidels better wake up and read that,

Hamas has no place to go, and they don't use human shields. Israel on the other hand, has many times used palestinians as human shields when entering houses of suspected militants. They pick out a random palestinian, and let him enter the house at gunpoint. This has lead to a few deaths.


Btw, 46% of all the wounded are women and children. 24% of the dead are women and children.
Today Israel bombed a market place, and killed a mother and her 4 children, injuring dozens of civilians.
How do you explain this? It's a massacre, it's state terrorism.

[stoffi]

IF YOU LIVE IN PALESTINE AND HAMAS BUILDS AN AMMO DUMP UNDER YOUR APARTMENT BUILDING...you better move before it gets bombed.

hamas is using human shields.
when planes take out ammo dumps or a rocket pad, it might be next door.

Hamas puts military installations near civilian residence for a reason.
that reason is to create public disapproval for israel action. But that is OK because the palestinians that lived on that ammo dump died for allah!


US and israel will aid and protect the Palestinian people without religious opression and propaganda.

Iran, and Hamas only care about the Palestinian people so far as they are weapons that change public opinion about israel and the palestinians are a tool to use in their holy war and jihad.



you infidels better wake up and read that,

Also, USA is a much more religious society than the palestinians in the west bank. I guess you didn't know that.


Plus, how can you blame Hamas for the massacres? If your father hits you, is it his fault if you kill him for it?
If someone beats you up, is it your right to knock on his door and shoot him later?

Ofc not. YOU are responsible, and ISRAEL is responsible for their own actions.

[stoffi]

stoffi, what do you call the people that pay Hamas? oh yeah, Iran, theran, iyetollah..they are not corrupt, they are just cleansing the world of us infidels..leave them alone and lets all hate jews like stoffi you hitler azzkizzer

No, I call them jews, Knesset, Prime minister. Did you know Israel funded Hamas? Not anymore, but Hamas is strong BECAUSE of Israel, they wanted to split the palestinians and they wanted a weaker PLO.

Also, did you know that Iran is the country in the middle east that has the most jews except for Israel? About 50k jews live there, in peace and harmony.

[Mourhelm]

The USA is riddled with Jews who pressurise politics into doing what's best for Israel. Give them credit, very cunning, but i get so bored of watching Israel get away with military action because AMERICA looks the other way.

You give AMERICA way too much credit. You also make it sound like there are no other opinions in America.

There are plenty of Israel haters in America and plenty of Palestinian lovers and more America lovers than both together. Each pushes for it's own direction.

I assume you live in America because you seem to think that only America has a voice in this world. According to you, the other parts have no voice what-so-ever.

I also get fed up that anti semitism even comes up in debates as an accusation... just cause you criticise doesn't mean you're antisemitic.

I totally agree.

In a way, the Middle East has always been fked with by Europe, specifially France and England, and the USA. You can understand their outrage, but you cannot condone suicide bombing designed to do the most damage possible.

Of course I can condone suicide bombings aimed at civilians. You can do it too.

I was in London for 7/7 and it is days like that you can understand why people want to hit back, but where does it get you? Nowhere. It just gets you more dead lying in the streets. Beg the UN for peacekeepers, if any of them get hurt, then it will be a new ball game. At the minute it's like two squabbling children that have bunked off school.

Look at the history. There was a joint french-USA UN force in Lebanon. It was changed after it was bombed by Hizbulla (IIRC).

UN peacekeepers are worthless. The UN is worthless.

[Mourhelm]

Hamas has no place to go, and they don't use human shields.

Yes they do. There's no point talking to you if you can't agree on facts.

Israel on the other hand, has many times used palestinians as human shields when entering houses of suspected militants. They pick out a random palestinian, and let him enter the house at gunpoint. This has lead to a few deaths.

It's true it happen in the past in order to protect Israeli soldiers. Our supreme court ordered the military to stop that activity and it has.

Btw, 46% of all the wounded are women and children. 24% of the dead are women and children.

You are so biased you don't even bother showing the Israeli death statistics.

Today Israel bombed a market place, and killed a mother and her 4 children, injuring dozens of civilians.
How do you explain this? It's a massacre, it's state terrorism.

All I can say about that is that Hamas should stop hiding their ammo in market places.

[Mourhelm]

Plus, how can you blame Hamas for the massacres? If your father hits you, is it his fault if you kill him for it?

Of course your father is responsible for your death if he kills someone and then hides behind you for protection. He shouldn't use his children as meat shield!

If someone beats you up, is it your right to knock on his door and shoot him later?

No, it's not your right. There is a police for that.

It's too bad that Hamas Kills people and not only beats them up.

[1eye]

since i was a young boy, my grandparents read to me a my parents taught me and the bible teaches me to love thy enemy.
walk the path of the god while you are alive and have a chance to make a difference, fighting will not get you there.


love thine enemy




i read the Koran,
it told me to kill people that try to attack or denounce Allah
it told me to kill anyone that changes their religion other than islam
the koran teaches that you will be killed and you will never see heaven unless you live and die for allah because this prophet is the greatest forever.



i just want everyone who reads this to know that i love you and jesus loves you no matter what you believe, and no matter how you act, you will be forgiven in the eyes of the lord if you repent and try to make things better. we are mortals and we make mistakes. our father in heaven understands this and he is a kind god. that is what i believe


i am not a religious man, i do not preech, but i just wanted everyone to know the alternatives. the problem is when your government or your ayetolla burns all the books, and controlls your knowledge. i guess some people know no different, and they attack what is different because that is what they have learned. we must love and forgive them, but we cannot let them lauch rockets at us either. let us live a great new year, and remember that there are many people enduring loss at this time , we must love and support them

[Lightzy]

"women and children" is not a valid claim.

The terrorist organization known as HAMAS trains women to be suicide bombers. The news happily categorizes anyone under 18"children", except Hamas also trains 14-17 year olds as suicide bombers and front line fighters.
One HAMAS leader (who was killed by israel a couple of days ago) sent his own kid son to be a suicide bomber..



That is not to say that innocent civilians aren't hurt. they are, which is horrible and sad.
But when israeli civilians are hurt its because hamas fired a rocket with the intention of killing them. when palestinians do it's generally because hamas cynically used them as cover and camoflague.

Get it, hamas is a tool of iran. They care nothing for the benefit of palestinian people, who are tools and cover for them.
Or they wouldn't have taken over gaza in a brutal military coup, and wouldn't have used all their power and funding to smuggle in rockets and mortar shells instead of building parks, residence, schools and so on.

Then you have to ask, how is it that the West Bank, another area ceded to palestinian control by Israel, ISN'T shooting rockets at civilians targets in Israel?

[AFKain]

i just want everyone who reads this to know that i love you and jesus loves you no matter what you believe, and no matter how you act, you will be forgiven in the eyes of the lord if you repent and try to make things better. we are mortals and we make mistakes. our father in heaven understands this and he is a kind god. that is what i believe

I just wanted to say "LOL".

It's too bad that Hamas Kills people and not only beats them up.

I think what Stoffi was trying to illustrate is that there is a big difference between the actions of Hamas (rockets) and Israel. The response is very disproportionate, in terms of civilian casualties and terror I think that Israel's actions are the worst act of terrorism.

Then you have to ask, how is it that the West Bank, another area ceded to palestinian control by Israel, ISN'T shooting rockets at civilians targets in Israel?

It could be because the west bank isn't under siege and being starved.

Edit:

They are not only hiding inside civilian population, they operate from withing the population (for example, they launch rockets from schools). According to international law, the responsibility for civilian deaths is theirs, because of this.

Forgot to ask about this, exactly where in "international law" is this stated? It sounds to me like something made up to lessen the burden that civilian casualties has on the inventor's mind.

If you strike a target knowing that there's a risk/certitude that civilians will be killed you decide that striking the target is worth the civilian casualties. Using a reasoning that says that civilian deaths aren't the responsibility of the one who actually does the aggression against them would mean that you could nuke gaza and still claim that it was hamas's fault...

[dicoe]

Lets make it a nationalpark, where desert animals can live while no people can.

War has been upon the area for 2000 years.... and it will continue for 2 more as long as there is religion.


i like desertfoxes, they have big ears.

[stoffi]

"women and children" is not a valid claim.

The terrorist organization known as HAMAS trains women to be suicide bombers. The news happily categorizes anyone under 18"children", except Hamas also trains 14-17 year olds as suicide bombers and front line fighters.
One HAMAS leader (who was killed by israel a couple of days ago) sent his own kid son to be a suicide bomber..



That is not to say that innocent civilians aren't hurt. they are, which is horrible and sad.
But when israeli civilians are hurt its because hamas fired a rocket with the intention of killing them. when palestinians do it's generally because hamas cynically used them as cover and camoflague.

Get it, hamas is a tool of iran. They care nothing for the benefit of palestinian people, who are tools and cover for them.
Or they wouldn't have taken over gaza in a brutal military coup, and wouldn't have used all their power and funding to smuggle in rockets and mortar shells instead of building parks, residence, schools and so on.

Then you have to ask, how is it that the West Bank, another area ceded to palestinian control by Israel, ISN'T shooting rockets at civilians targets in Israel?

You obviously know very little of Hamas. Hamas have built a huuuuge amount of schools and welfare institutions for the civilian population of palestine, that's part of the reason why they are so popular. But once something nice gets built, Israel bombs it away.
I suggest you get your facts straight before posting bs like this.


And according to your logic, any child COULD grow up to be a suicide bomber, and therefore must be killed.

Bombing Gaza won't stop the rockets, quite on the contrary.

And btw, it was Israel who made Hamas start firing rockets again, since Israel kept bombing Hamas in the shadows. Hamas got sick of this, and decided to respond. But your media won't talk much about that.

And injuring 1500 children/women and killing 100 kids vs a few rockets in the desert and a few killed is just plain wrong. The real terrorist here is Israel. Just today they bombed a market and killed 20 ppl. Even if there was a hamas leader in that market, Israel shoulldn't have bombed. Israel is a racist, apartheid state which believes their race is superior to others because they supposedly are chosen by a god not that many believe in.