I wish I could be as optimistic as you are :)
I wish I could be as optimistic as you are :)
Indeed. Seems kinda naive to me too. People with little to no understanding of the game won't go away and stop spouting stupid comments just because of forum structure. They will keep filling the threads up with their own opinions, and fail to argue why they should be considered valid. A forum is only as good as the users, and the users around here are not especially useful for the most part. I know people's jealousy would never allow them to accept the council of elders idea, but it's still better than this forum (tho none shall rule out the other)Originally Posted by Toadi
imo, it's far better to have a section dedicated to races for people to post in. It's much easier to compile legitimate ideas over 25 threads with 5-10 posts in them than one thread with the same amount of content. Developers are still a necessary involvement, imo, just the means of which they gather feedback I'll disagree with you on, mourhelm.
Edit:
Sean & Brian also asked in their last blog if anyone can see a downside to mid-age merger.
As a supporter of the idea for some time now, There is really only one downside. Similar to the downside of the ability to legally trade, it increases the ability to create "farm kingdoms"
What you must decide is, as developers, do the pro's outweigh the cons?
Further, what happens if two 20 or 25 prov kd's conjoin, where do the "lost" provinces/players go?
Something you really need to wrap your brains around is.. what is cheating, and what forms of cheating are more damaging than beneficial.
You will get a million arguments in every direction on that. You must decide the reality of it, as most people can only exaggerate.
Last edited by Ezzerland; 28-05-2009 at 19:54.
About my intel suggestion. Yes it should be optional. Might not even be only for monarchs but all in a KD. Good way for newcomers to learn different build strats also.
And about the quests thing. If that could be integrated with an order system that would be quite amusing.
Ezzerland
Who said anything that two 20-25 Kds can merge? Since the field is wide open it could be limited to KDs with less than X nbr of provs. The total nbr of provs in both KDs cant exceed 25. So then you can have a 18 KD join with a 8 KD and so on.
Cheating prevention/detection
"Simple" solution is pattern recognition. Track behaviors. Obvious cheating is a new prov has 1200 acres oop and no defense and get attacked right away is an oddity for example. I'm not that informed on the behavior on farms and farm KDs to make any suggestions on detection but I think others are.
first a quick math joke at 18+8 = 26, so that breaks your rule of can't be more than 25 :p
Anyway, I don't see a problem with the creation of new kingdoms if say 20 players from 2-3 different kingdoms wanted to "merge" together. This would be like some kind of conjoined 'defection' creating a new kingdom. While it doesn't have to be this way, and could be the way you said, I don't see any sense in the overall limitation. Similar to how I still think move codes are far too few.
as for cheating, I think you missed my meaning. I think they need to consider what cheating actually is, and weigh the damage "cheating" does compared to the benefits of "cheating" and find out what is actually beneficial to the game and what is not. Then they can start setting in real rules to uphold and find algorithms for player cheating behaviour
If implemented, only the monarch should be able to see the self intel of provinces in his kingdom. If everyone can see the info then people might create province to spy on other kingdoms.
Utopiapimp solves this with access levels for the users, but I doubt they'll want to get into that.
The whole point of limiting move and trade codes is to prevent such a thing. There are plenty discussions about the "lack" of move codes.
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=574844
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=574986
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=578089
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=579148
No need for a "non move code" kind of way to create kingdoms from scratch.
I'm well aware of the multiple discussions about move codes, thanks. That doesn't mean I shouldn't have my own opinion on it and need to refer to 4 million other peoples opinions.
Why is there no need for new kd generation? My logic behind the ability to create kingdoms is allowing for the nature of the game to expand. people's fear of farm kds is beyond me, tbh.
Farm Kingdoms are usually spotted pretty fast, and reported.
Doesnt mean that omac does anything about them. =)
Utopian 5 Sept 2005 - 5 Sept 2013
How about every WoL KD has to select one representative, from within their own KD, to represent them in this "Council of Elders"? This should probaply be done by a timelimited vote, done in a similar way to the monarch votings. Every player has one vote, the one with highest votes in the KD would be in the Council.Will this essentially lead to an elitist group of people being elected? On a separate concern, what about apathy? Would the average player feel far removed from the effects of the who gets voted in and who doesn’t? If so, what could we do about that?
This would ensure that all types of KD and playing style possible would be represented, and that no one group of players would be overrepresented (IE the relative few who hang around the forums all the time).
Just an idea, what do others think?
a council of elders will just turn into a popularity contest - its pretty much unworkable to vote people in.
Support email: utopiasupport@utopia-game.com <- please use this and don't just PM me| Account Deleted/Inactive | Utopia Facebook Page | #tactics <-- click to join IRC|PM DavidC for test server access
so don't vote. not like it isn't well known who the best players in the game are
I was going to suggest a similar thing although I would edit it a bit.
1) Let each KD vote for the person they feel best understands the game and would represent their views.
2) Take a random sample of these provinces, so you dont have too many, for indepth discussion in a private forum
3) Use all these provinces for a wider scale survey, ie polls and votes
Allow people to elect out of the scheme, in which case the KD cannont vote for them, to prevent nonparticipation. If someone selected for 2 leaves then have their KD vote for a new representative and fill the slot with a provinced picked at random again.
Voting from these forums would definately not be the way to go with selecting a council.
Then apparently we are not doing our best to help people understand the game. To me it is worse that people simply booing ideas away without trying to explain why they do not share an idea (I avoid terms like bad, crap because they are subjective). And even though many ideas are not suitable people could still work with (encourage) people (newbe's) by trying to turn a 'bad' idea into a workable solution.People with little to no understanding of the game won't go away and stop spouting stupid comments just because of forum structure. They will keep filling the threads up with their own opinions, and fail to argue why they should be considered valid.
If there 'had' to be a council
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I don't like the idea of a council - lotta things that don't need fixing will be fixed not necessarily to the good of the game. There's only one thing important - that ppl are having fun. Forums, leave pimp, Angel & AR the way they are - they're fine - they work - they give the game a sense of community. Is like saying let's have a different color dress.
Who cares? Forums are fine. I see nothing but bad coming from a "Council of Elders". But, if there had to be one, let everyone be represented. That's who plays the game.
Shaken not stirred.
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