I'm sure that if homes are useful, then their usefullness would be somewhere BETWEEN having 0 homes and ALL homes . . . If Vines can provide some numbers, as mentioned by otokonoko, that'd be great, but please, for all of you detractors, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater, one extreme case shouldn't totally negate the possible use for homes.
Homes have a good usefulness beyond just BE.
But using homes goes very well with having GS. For attackers only.
Very important point here for any attacker.
I use homes more for Birth rate bonus rather than extra population, GS helps reduce the risk of overpop.
10-15% Homes is a good ammount, in war just let that ammount dwindle til ceasefire.
30% Homes can work, but it is impractical, like i mentioned before. You might have a good BE and Strong economy, to becoming overpopulated very quickly, unless your also running 45% GS????
30% could work if your planning a high defence superthief or supermage, who will be unbreakable for the n/w. This is the only semi-practical useage I can think of.
People running 0 homes have other weakness, usually a poor economy and bad BE, or low TPA and/or WPA.
I use this rule of thumb, 1.5GS to every home
so 10% home you will have 15%GS. It allows you to reduce ammount of land lost, inturn will reduce the risk of overpopulation.
Bishop.... It doesn't matter what race you are.... The sheer military size I have is more than a match for the offense of anyone in any kind of gains range.
Legions has it pinned - you're all thinking of the published bonuses of homes for population and birth rates. The huge BE boost that they give is really overlooked - having 52% homes gives me the BE to be able to comfortably split the remaing 48% across the necessary buildings with great effect.
I hear you talk about homes causing overpop when you get hit more than once but don't a hit that takes 20% of your land also take 20% of your pop regardless of wether you have homes or not?
Maybe the trick here is not to abuse the extra pop the homes give you by increasing your draft rate another 10-15%, just use the extra pop you get and be happy with it and the reduced jobs will help enough ith your BE%
In answer to the orc who wants to break you and overpop you well what if they hit you 1st? and what makess you think you can even break the prov with the increased homes at all since his military is also increased.
I think homes should be enhanced a bit more to make them more useful and not just optional.
"sheer military size" is all very well, but id like to see you stand up to three or four hits from 110 OPA orcs. Unless you're running 120 DPA? Which i massively doubt.Originally Posted by ViscountGrey
Armies home yes he has that.
That's nice, but I can still conquest you down at my leisure.
Catwalk's crusade for legalized cheating was a stunning success, with ghettos and low-tiered teams everywhere losing their wells of knowledge to better kingdoms in the process.
Step one: replace everything that works.
Step two: blame the predictable epic fail on outside forces.
Step three: keep the community informed that no progress has been made since the last update.
Step four: thank you for your patience.
24 raw defensive dudes per acre, known to you lesser players as 120 DPA, doesn't leave a whole lot of room left over for useful stuff, like thieves, wizards, peasants for stability, and offense.
It's really just a waste to tack on so much defense, because if I want to hurt you, I will - case in point; conquest.
Do note that, raw, each acre of built-up land gives 25 people to play with, and 32 if the acre of built-up land in question is a home.
The stoned viscount claims he has 24 of those as defensive dudes.
If it was possible for forts to give more than 37.5% defense - which, even at high BE - requires immense numbers of them - 50% of your land at 100% BE - this still wouldn't be believable, because we've been told the good viscount has 52% homes, which doesn't even leave enough acres left to get the max bonus at standard BE.
Don't get me started on how the homes make it possible, either, because it simply doesn't.
Just like vines and his UB3R1337!!!!! gnome, this is just stupidity.
Catwalk's crusade for legalized cheating was a stunning success, with ghettos and low-tiered teams everywhere losing their wells of knowledge to better kingdoms in the process.
Step one: replace everything that works.
Step two: blame the predictable epic fail on outside forces.
Step three: keep the community informed that no progress has been made since the last update.
Step four: thank you for your patience.
a small % of homes is fine, ie 10-15%
anymore is just a waste
yeah, you can get a nice BE, but running 50% is just stupid...
50% non-home buildings at 100% BE is less effective than 90% non-home buildings at 80% BE
Deliverance -> secrets -> anzac -> mercy -> rage -> "ghetto"
...armies home...
which makes him completely, utterly, one hundred percent useless. if he doesnt attack, wtf do i care if hes unbreakable? let him sit there and greed/storms/ms me all he wants.
Delryn I have posted my own provinces up before. The first time I did it people thought that it was a make believe province. They could not believe I could get numbers that high. In fact if I'm running an attacker I keep around 90-100dpa at home and an attacking force of 65-75opa. With full army at home I keep around 140dpa. I have posted province with these types of stats before however I will not longer do that. No hybrid is going to break one of my provinces. Geln0r the use of homes allow me to keep 90-100dpa at home while my military is out on an attack.
Player such as greenie have said that keeping 100dpa home when having an usable attack force of 75opa is impossible. Then I have posted province capable of doing what they said was impossible. You know what players such as greenie said? They said nothing. They kept their mouths shut because the proof was in fornt of their eyes. So they just waited untill those threads went away.
vines it is possible to make such a province and even with higher dpa opa numbers
but the province you posted wont worth anything it wont have a good tpa wpa ppa
plz post a link to your province i wanto take a look at it and see the tpa wpa etc
Vines, proof and actual numbers of a practical, not an idea of a theory.
You have alot of ideas about theories, most of them being impractical when put into application.
How about putting those numbers into perspective like, opnw and dpnw, tpa, wpa and pessies pa. Those numbers you have thrown up there lead me to believe you are running a poor economy with a standard opnw and dpnw provence with an over inflated provence networth.
If you fail to provide a link or 2, to prove that those numbers have a practical application, as I see it, it is just a theory of an idea.
Greenie, Undead can use upto 20% Homes, due to the half science bonus, it helps to cover weak points like wpa and tpa. I usually run 15% Homes on my Undead Heavy Hitter, and 20%GS. I still get overpoped, but not enough to stop me attacking or military leaving. I got Military starting to leave when I had 20% homes thought when hit a few times even with 20%GS running at 75-80BE.
vines' gnome
another one
hu/sage
there are his provs =)
and, all time favourite, vines maths: link another link
how much would you get hit?
5-6 hits on you in the space of an hour (taking at least 10% land each time) and you will be over popped =)
am suprised your BE is so low with 20% homes though...
Deliverance -> secrets -> anzac -> mercy -> rage -> "ghetto"
Homes can be outmatched in any way possible. obviously your goals are to be prepared in any situation, and outmatch your opponent. Homes doesnt do that.
its all about BE apparently. but homes seems to make sense only whenyou reach high acreage. like 3000-5000. homes then become a bit more understandable as of use. i always prefered 20% banks (which the money can be invested wisely into sci) and have 90-80% BE then 100% and 10% banks (assuming ur having only 10% homes)
let say you have.
2000 acres with 10% homes.
thats about enough to get you to 90-95% BE with no sci.
10% homes is: 1600 pop (which is not much considering its a stagerring 200 builds) if 70% of that goes military; it leave 30% (like VT2 says) to other duties which usually wizards take 6-9%, 20% of that will then go peasants.
20% of 1600 is: 320....thats just not enough to make any difference in ur income. your military draft AND wages will go up and probably just cost u as much for you extra 1280 troops will cost in draft and wages expenses, in which only 7600 offense points(if elf) will be given and 5120 def points maximum if elites.
homes on a gnome isnt more useful imho, every homes you spend on a gnome will cost you 50% of that in farms. and more farms just means more weaknesses. and then you add the issues ive just mentioned. and thats wihtout mentioning what VT2 and the others just mentioned.
show me a strat with homes and a proper counter to those no homes ppl (with race and pers) and ill show you a non home and a proper counter to homes ppl (with race and pers) all with numbers*!
sci can outmatch any homes bonus anyway!
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