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Thread: Other Changes for next round???

  1. #1
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    Other Changes for next round???

    I see everyone all focused on the possible bringing back of avians...

    we also have the beta version out and been messing with that also, but what changes need to be looked at for next age???


    _________________________________________________________________



    I noticed many different flaws in the game last age, but I can't see why those would go untouched! As an example, we only had 13k average players last round, utopia needs to do some changing to attract old players and new ones alike.

    1.) Tick Time: Beta version is running at 30 min tick times with normal rules at applied, perhaps we can go to 30 min tick times and tamper with the gains of combat, loses, strength of opps a bit and get faster game play going?

    2.) Attacks: Attacks to this point need some changing, too much has been waved on acres and NW... well what about players that are just freaking awsume and push their acres to the limit??? I am talking about NWPA, is it possible for the game to allow a player 200knw on 1k acres to get a great gain on a 200knw player on 2k acres and not be retaled for great gains also?! last age, the players would both seem to loose about... 10-15% of their land, well in my eyes the one taking the greater risk should get the best deal, thus causing players to aim high rather than base utopia all on amount of players in a kd and how many of those are attackers. This would fix the acre exchange problem an cause players with good strats a super advantage to a player in an extreamly active kd.

    3.) Military Units: So much is focused around having more offense than df, there should be some kind of protection against suiciders or lesser agro developing from retaliating your own freaking attack. an orc on 20dpa could bottom feed off another player with 90 dpa for 15% of their land (bc of race gains and sci = wtf) and the player hit could double tap that orc, for only 20% of the land he was hit for (NW based attacks instead of acres/NWPA based attacks). I am simply saying that there is no reason why a player with double acres should get a good hit off on someone that has half the acres, not unless it is a raze, massacar, or plunder.

    4.) Attack Types: Bring back the +10% offense to attacks that are razes, massacars, or plunders. This would reduce the need for everyones elites having to be far better than specs or whatever, it would all players on the battlefield subject to being hit. Also, why should a player that is higher in NW not be able to get a good massacar off?! make it so that players could be hit hard in no traditional march attacks, and you will see players aiming for growth (be more active) bc they need to get that high NW and grow grow grow!

    5.) Science effects: what is the point of having science effect NW??? might as well make each 1000 gc be 10 nw so those who are sitting on the GC for dragons can get pwned in current attack formulas. Science effects should be to nothing but the gain of he who has gained them! In what way has science ever had a negitive effect on anything? I mean really, they will get more NW anyways from pop sci and what not, there is no sence in hurting good strats.

    6.) Opps and T/M: Opps and T/M need to be set to certain races and also only be effective by players who choose to play that way. There use to be big negitives that allowed for lesser need for a T/M to get extream amounts of WPA/TPA to do simple opps. Attacking races should still have their T/M abilities nurfed or T/M races need to have better buffs like gnomes 40-50% better TE. If DE where at 40-50% better ME or elfs at double spell strenth, how would that effect the game at that point???

    7.) Honor: Use to be that one race would be centered around the gaining of honor and it was a hybrid type race... not too sure how to bring this back into the game other than attacking gains honor and the honor gained from that player is doubled when the attacking player recives it... This would allow for higher honor generation since each day of war KILLS IT!!!




    _________________________________________________________________



    Just some general ideas, but I open this for whatever you got. Remember that it would be nice to bring back attention to utopia, not cause everyone to all be one race or class. what can we do to imporve the game, make it more fun, give to players who are active, make you more "solo able", bonus to playing your province well, adjust attacking and T/M?

  2. #2
    Needs to get out more VT2's Avatar
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    No to everything above.
    Catwalk's crusade for legalized cheating was a stunning success, with ghettos and low-tiered teams everywhere losing their wells of knowledge to better kingdoms in the process.

    Step one: replace everything that works.
    Step two: blame the predictable epic fail on outside forces.
    Step three: keep the community informed that no progress has been made since the last update.
    Step four: thank you for your patience.

  3. #3
    Enthusiast UtopiaOfGreed's Avatar
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    No.

    Edit: Damn, you beat me to it VT2.

  4. #4
    Post Demon UnknownGhost's Avatar
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    fail
    #sinners <---click to join

  5. #5
    Needs to get out more DHaran's Avatar
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    This whole thread is moronic.

    I am simply saying that there is no reason why a player with double acres should get a good hit off on someone that has half the acres, not unless it is a raze, massacar, or plunder.
    Haha, go hit a province half your size, and tell me how many acres you get. Go away please.

    I didn't even bother reading past that, clearly there is idiocy at work here.
    S E C R E T S

  6. #6
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    @ Dharan

    30% gains + 30% gains in sci (all you need is 300bba and 20% libs)

    no matter how you look at it, that is overkill right there... be like contracting the plauge in every attack from undead or if you attack someone that has the plauge, you get it from them. You see the point to this thread was to invoke new ideas... I say why not bring back some of the old ones? Utopia went from good balance, to great, to personalities, to races being taken away, to extream unbalance, to loosing players from 50,000 to 10,000 and now we are moving back towards good balance again.

    Problem:
    -Nobody cares to grow really
    -Everyone "Has" to work as a kd, use to be that it was in the best intrest but with the way the attacking formula works now, it screws you over for being a dominating player
    -Everyone has to go attacker these days, wtf even have opps or T/M'ing races?
    -Bit easy to go hybrid these days???
    -Sciences has been wtf since it became a huge impact on NW, what is the point?
    -Everyone gets to cast major spells, anom, MS, MV, and what not needs to be race/class specific
    -Bring back bonus for Raze/Massacar/Plunder
    -Why is it that now we have so many elites at 10 pts or more???


    So many things have happend since the start of Utopia, adding all these things do make things complicated, but for once ask yourself... why have the attacking formula that there is, why have sci count for NW, why make every race hybrid able, why not make provos still able to roll solo (use to be able to).

    Then ask yourself how that particular thing came about? How was suiciding fixed, when was orcs overkill before, are we falling into the same rut as before?

    ___________________________________________________________________________


    People, 9 times out of 10 there is a reason for things.

    Ages ago, there was a player that power explored and had her whole kd fed her aid and casted paradice on her... she got to be so big that nobody could even get close, 10 mill nw and the closest was 500k nw... she then aided out to her whole kd, and brought them up to her level and that was that. Top kd, untouchable. What came out of that???

    -Aid tax and limits
    -no more self spells casting elfs
    -attacking formula changed to take NW into account, not so heavily on the acres or difference in acres


    __________________________________________________________________________


    So, with that said, there are some kinks that could use some mending. Don't want to change anything for next round? post your reason.

  7. #7
    Needs to get out more DHaran's Avatar
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    30% gains + 30% gains in sci (all you need is 300bba and 20% libs)
    There are caps on gains. And if you are running 20% Libs on an Orc you need to be shot.

    Once again, i didn't read past that because clearly there is idiocy at work here.
    S E C R E T S

  8. #8
    Enthusiast UtopiaOfGreed's Avatar
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    Orions. Do yourself a favor. Create a new username. None of us will ever take the username you're currently using seriously ever again.

  9. #9
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    Orions: there's a reason why it's a beta. It's just for testing.

    Funny reminder on why you can no longer cast self spells on other people. Imho casting everything except Dise would have been awesome.

  10. #10
    Forum Addict Dolgil's Avatar
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    1) Most players are not hyper-active. Game should really focus more on the two a day login people. That's your bread and butter Utopia player.

    2) Getting high NWPA means pumping. Pumping = boring.

    3) Not sure what you are really talking about here, but, with the current relations system, double tapping a suicider is a good way to get into a war you do not want. Simple thing to do here is narrow the range that can war from 50% of net worth to 10%.

    4) Fail to see how this would cause specs to be used. High NWPA and can't attack? You are doing something wrong. Also see 2). You can not grow in acres and keep high NWPA. If you want to grow, grow, grow!, then you want net worth gains.

    5) Before you wanted high NWPA and now you are trying to lower it. Make up your mind.

    6) Type casting races shrinks diversity of province strategies = boring.

    7) Honor hunting gets done anyway. We really do not need a repeat of the HoDF strategy. Could do away with honor lose in the CF period and lesser losses in war if not removed entirely. It doesn't prevent fake wars and just punishes real wars.
    Dolgil Rosethorn
    If it's broke, fix it.
    If it's not, don't.
    If you do not like the results, change your methods.
    Quit making the same old mistakes. Make new ones.

  11. #11
    I like to post KuhaN's Avatar
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    There are no changes, it's Jolt Gaming. Is this your first time coming back to Utopia? Seriously?

    Btw, I hope they don't put any of your horrid suggestions into play.
    Last edited by KuhaN; 18-10-2009 at 08:02.

  12. #12
    News Correspondent Mad_Scottish's Avatar
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    Your point on the lack of ops is a bit rediculous, any player worth his salt is playing a hybrid race anyway and any kd with half a brain runs a mix of a/ts and a/ms for the exact reason of being able to op. It allows people to main good OPAs whilst laying down the ops.

    There are races that are specific to opping, Elf, DE, gnome with human which can play a decent a/t. Rest attack. But you can still have an orc as an a/t which is hiliarous but it does happen.

  13. #13
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    I ran a Orc A/t myself, along with part of my kingdom a while back. We thought "ah what the heck". It's fun, people don't expect it. They gasp in disbelief when they see a NS run come from a bunch of orcies, followed by triple taps :P

    Where do you find the room for TPA on a Orc? Def is for nubs.

    To Dolgil's points (not exactly meant at you, more towards the mindset on those points I think I'm getting from this topic, just that you made it into a nice list of points that I can react to):

    1) The game should be interesting for people on the top AND for people on the bottom. You don't want to focus on either part. The top gives people something to aim for. Without a top 50 this would not be much of a game. People don't "JUST" play, they play to get better at it than other people. The goal: Charts. It's what GAMES are about. Fighting the curve, having a challenge.

    2) Human/Mer, Human/Sage, Orc/WH, Elf/Mer, etc, all easy to get pumped while maintaining offensive game play. A "pump" might last 2-3 days sometimes, but that's also a choice you could not make. Back in the old days science pumping could take a week or more, we've definitely improved there.

    3) 10% is insane. That means most of the top 20 can't even war with eachother. It means that kingdoms just a TAD bigger than you can hit you all they want without having to fear you pushing the button. The same goes around the other way, let's say you have a bunch of Orc/WH going ape**** against a bigger kd. They can get away with it since their gains are superhigh and they gain A LOT of elites. The bigger kingdom can't do much back since they can't go to war with them.

    4) Land based gains = You are big, some guy same acres is fat, you take his acres.
    NW based gains = You are big, some guy more acres has the same networth, you take his acres. I think networth gains are a slightly bigger challenge, but I don't really care. It makes it easier to chain if a guy has a LOT of elites out, hence his networth stays up.

    5) Nothing here.

    6) Agreed.

    7) Agreed. Complex, but I'd say a 3-4% honor drop per month in wars that lack attacks would be a improvement. Kinda sucks if you are at FW and you have to make 5 plunders a day on the other kd. /learn /whatever hit you want. Also: Honor drop during EOWCF is just dumb. The war is DONE, so you should not lose precious honor that you just gained beating a kd.

    Though we will not get any changes this age, it's never "bad" to talk about things =)

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orions View Post
    Problem:
    -Nobody cares to grow really
    -Everyone "Has" to work as a kd, use to be that it was in the best intrest but with the way the attacking formula works now, it screws you over for being a dominating player
    -Everyone has to go attacker these days, wtf even have opps or T/M'ing races?
    -Bit easy to go hybrid these days???
    -Sciences has been wtf since it became a huge impact on NW, what is the point?
    -Everyone gets to cast major spells, anom, MS, MV, and what not needs to be race/class specific
    -Bring back bonus for Raze/Massacar/Plunder
    -Why is it that now we have so many elites at 10 pts or more???


    I fail to see the point in your first argument, your in ghetto and manage to get yourself to 2x the size of the next largest player you clearly aren't playing as a team in a team game, so obviously you open yourself up to being hit.

    Also you say that the game used to be more balanced and also that you want to lock certain races into roles, such as only attacker or only T/M and then complain that it's too easy to go hybrid these days. Aspects that you can affect people outside your KD are Attacking/Thievery/Mage.....to make the game balanced shouldn't you want every province to have a decent shot at each aspect? Hence hybrids, you can still play T/M if you want but hybrids are for the most part more useful again the choice is up to you not a change that's severely needed in the game.

    I just contribute this to diversity, there are more options and combination that play into ways you want to not only develop your own province but also how it fits into your KDs plans.

    Does diversity lead to imbalance? Possibly because some people will run much better strategies than other people, but the onus isn't on the game, its on the choices you as a player make. Locking certain personalities and races (more than they are now) into roles would be a step backwards.

    Finally, tbh it just sounds like your complaining from the point of view of some guy stuck in a ghetto who wants to grow super large all by himself, but always gets bottom fed because you've grown into range for the smaller prov's in SKDs to farm out.
    If that's the case, get a better KD or try to play WITH your KD (if its possible) and try to stay similar in size. Or go petition OMAC to bring back fairy with 1/8 elites and land based gains so everyone can turtle all age and be super happy at 1mil+ NW every age w/o doing any real strats.

    In conclusion, more or less no to everything except (7 which should be adjusted.
    Last edited by Coke; 18-10-2009 at 11:22. Reason: clarification

  15. #15
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    1.) Tick time, "Wave time at 2nd 1st yr 45 aye try to figure out when to be here before we wave!"
    It's perfect as it is.

    2.) The only thing about attacks that imo should be changed is the gaining percent
    100knw vs 200knw = 50% size difference for the bottomfeeder compared to 100% for the top feeder.
    Honestly i think they should reverse that gain forumla so it benefits to hit up instead of down :P.

    3.) Try using def/nw and off/nw and understand that gains are nw based nowadays.

    4.) Adding 10% ome to massacres & razes since you dont gain anything on them would be nice.

    5.) To find a balance. If someone put 5,000bpa in to thier human province with 30% libs
    57.8% Income
    58.4% Building Effectiveness
    0% Population Limits
    330.2% Food Production
    81.7% Gains in Combat
    350.3% Thievery Effectiveness
    350.3% Magic Effectiveness & Rune Production
    0nw on science GG.

    6.) No.

    7.) Attacks in war regenerats new honor.

    Looks like you played t/m last age and wants to imporve changes for ur own sake only.

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