Dear Forum Moderators; And Forum Patrons

[Discombobulator]

Now, before you get all up and arms and go waving the edit wand, or swinging the ban hammer... hear me out.

I've seen a lot of verbal scrapping, if you will, back and forth between certain key members of this forum with the moderation staff, as well as some tell-tale hints of frustration from you staffers as well, due to "Brimstone and Fire" attitude on the forums.

I'd like to express my own opinion on the matter, and hopefully ease tension between the mod staff, and the e-patrons - if you will - who post here.

First and foremost, in my eyes the people who are preaching the brimstone and fire message have every right to do so. So far, virtually every time Sean and Brian have announced a positive step in the works, it's turned out to be a giant leap backwards.

I'd like to enter into evidence the following exhibits:
http://forums.joltonline.com/showthr...EFORE-POSTING*

The actual re-write of Utopia from Mehul's "Outdated, and easily exploitable" code, to the "New Code" whos sole purpose was to improve server stability, while reducing exploits... we all see how well that's worked out.

Sean and Brian's apparent lack of communication with the community as a whole - both in-game, and via these forums.

And what, to me, is a slap in the face after all of this:

Like most of you, we feel that we have invested a lot into the game, and don't want to end its long tradition. However the game is at risk from the behavior of part of its own community. Since we are currently unable to properly police the game and forums, we hope the answer will come from you.

Those things alone, to me, are enough to get any dedicated community's proverbial panties in a bunch. Especially laying the blame for the game's current state of neglect, and the responsibility to police said sittuation at the feet of a community who has absolutely no means to do so.

These are things I feel that the moderation staff as a whole should bare in mind when addressing the users who are... upset... with the current state of events here.

However... on the flip side... something the community, as a whole, needs to understand is that if the moderation staff is going to be able to do ANYTHING to reverse the current state the game is in, they're going to require a significant level of constructive criticism from the community, and possibly some action from the more dedicated, veteran players who understand, and comprehend the game at a level outside that of their own little bubble.

It should also be emphasized that there's a fine line between your run of the mill Forum Troll spreading doom and gloom, and the legitimately pissed off player whos constructive criticism has run out, and is left with nothing but frustration. - In short, it's hard for the mods to sort through all the negativity, and it's even harder for them to discern which posts are legitimate frustrations being vented, and which posts are little nuggets left behind by the forum trolls in an attempt to make an already volatile situation explosive...


To summarize what most of you already know, but seem to be forgetting... The community's fed up with empty promises, and as far as most of us are concerned, what little bit of a glimmer of hope that's been outlined in Sean's last announcement is just that; another empty promise.. But this time it's not just a pretty silver lining around a white fluffy cloud... It's a faint glimmer around the edges of a hurricane. They're understandably upset, and this should be taken into heavy consideration when you're asking yourselves "why are these people being so obtuse!?"

Meanwhile, forum moderators are doing what the forum moderators have always done... Moderating, and attempting to lull the community back into the mindset that sean and brian might actually be able to salvage Utopia, and it's simply their job to do so.

To close...

Can't we all just... get along?

[aposai]

I hope we can, otherwise we are going to be left out of our game.

Well said by the way. The situation cannot be expressed any better.

[Thundergore]

A well worded and calm post. You will not find me saying a poster or player has no right to feel the way they do - 'tis nonsensical.

I do however focus on part of the quote you supplied (and it was raised in another thread) ''However the game is at risk from the behavior of part of its own community.'' From speaking with Brian and Sean upon my return, and believing their commitment to Utopia's future at this time (no matter how difficult) I assure you that this is aimed at scripters, cheaters, those who make problems within the game itself. The behaviour of some members of the forum community, while ... 'unique' in many respects (my tongue is firmly in cheek here), is not viewed as a factor in the current situation.

Having said that, my own long-term goals when (I am an optimist) we get past the current crisis, (and it *is* a crisis and it *will* be a tough fight) include forum improvements. This has long been my goal.However the forum reflects the in-game environment. We need stability in-game to begin a righteous and just crusade of sense and goodwill on the boards. It is after all common for newcomers - developer, poster, moderator, CM and everyone in-between - to face a harsh storm of words. This will have an effect on morale no matter how good and pure intentions are.

Just as you say, Discombobulator, we need an environment where Troll and Aggrieved Poster are more easily identifiable. It is a matter of baby steps.

If anything was unclear please ask. I'll explain (or indeed correct myself if I've erred) - I haven't had much coffee yet.

[Discombobulator]

First I'd like to thank you for your response, Thundergore.

Perhaps I mistook the message of the announcement, but to simplify what I took in from the last part of the message delivered: "The scripters are part of the community, the community's making the mess... and the community's going to have to come up with a way to fix it." Which would be completely acceptable, if we had a member of the community / an active community manager with the in-game moderation capabilities to do so. Basically, it was more or less the overtone of abandonment that the message set off that caught my attention.

I'm not above being wrong, however. It's happened to me before, and I'm sure it'll happen to me again. :)


Regarding these forums; In my experience, the opinions expressed on these forums are essentially a magnification of the sentiments expressed in actual game-play.

As far as an in-game checklist on what most players I've come into contact with seem to want fixed, it would, roughly, fall into order as follows:

1. Server strain increasing page load times; Mostly tied to the mass creation of scripted provinces. Getting rid of the scripts would kill two birds with one stone; easier said than done, I fear.
*One possible solution I've advocated would be to set the time you have to activate your province via e-mail from 10 days back to 3, so any province who leaves protection without activation would be automatically deleted. This probably won't solve the problem, but it would at least help remove a significant portion of the scripted provinces, which are no doubt causing server strain themselves, as well as causing slower ticks.

2. Ticking! Unfortunately, I don't see this one going anywhere... annoying as it is.

3. Any display bug (especially spell/op/attack results not being displayed) that inconveniences the player.

4. Getting rid of Cheaters / Fixing technical bugs, such as troops that have been nightmared not re-training in one lump 8 hours from the initial cast, but over time, as well as Amnesia destroying 100% books, instead of relearning X%

[Bishop]

personally i took that bit as an appeal to the scripters

[Discombobulator]

I mean absolutely no offense when I say: The notion that Sean and Brian would appeal to whoever is doing the scripting to stop on their own accord never crossed my mind... because to me, that notion is simply laughable.

[Bishop]

laughable or not, it is the situation we find ourselves in

[Patience]

Very nice post, Discombobulator. :D I'm with Thunder... I totally understand the frustration of the community and I'll be the last to ever say this situation has been handled well. But it is frustrating to have the same people posting the same complaints in every thread when their frustration has already been well noted (for months), and when it adds absolutely nothing but fuel to the fire. Thanks for appealing for calmer heads to prevail on BOTH sides. You should have been a diplomat. ;)

[Discombobulator]

There's great potential, and intelligence, on both sides of the debate - both from forum users / players, and moderators. I'm just hoping that both sides realize that if the game I've personally cherished for over a decade of my life - and im sure many people here feel the same way - is going to survive, that the answer isn't working against one another; but working together.

[aussiebob]

Thank you for your discombobulations.

[Flitters]

Wonderful post Discombobulator. It's not possible, for me personally, to agree more with what you have contributed.

I would like to add that some people are showing their discontent in a myriad of ways: Such as mass scripting, hacking, doom saying along with troll like behavior, quiting the game, etc. None of these are new.

p.s. You can't be discombobulated and post rationally. =P

[Thunder TA]

All im waiting for is TG to drop the ban hammer and start removing scrypts. Then things "might" lighten up here to a point. Anything positive game wise cant hurt.

[pmyraje]

I have to agree with Discombobulator because he is our kingdom's enforcer and he'll set the kingdom thugs on me if I disagree :-P

I am in a minority of somewhere close to 1 though, in general, in feeling that the community of a free online game has very little in the way of justification for anything other than constructive criticism, but I guess that is because I aim to have low expectations of most things. That way I am always more likely to be positively surprised than negatively.

The concept of loyalty to a free online game that people use to defend actions is a totally empty one to me though. A player who started playing last week is just as much a part of the game and has as valid a viewpoint as one who has played 10 years. I played the game for many years before quitting for a long time then returning. In both my spells in the game I play each day, log in each day because the game gives me enjoyment in the present. I don't build up some kind of buffer of debt that the game owes me - if the game works and provides a level of enjoyment in a given day that is comensurate to the time I spend playing it then that day is history when the next one comes along. Thus I am no different to a player who started yesterday in that Utopia owes me nothing, yet I very much want it to continue because it continues to provide enjoyment more than equal to the time I spend on it.

But yeah, just to keep on the good side of "Henchman K" since all my Zerks are out - I still agree 100% with Discombobulator! :P

[Discombobulator]

Ahh, but that's where the discombobulation comes in! How be rational, and yet still discombobulate!?

Seriously, though. Everyone should have valid input, and everyone's voice should be heard equally. But in a perfect world, Marxist values would truly be Utopian. No pun intended.

Generally speaking, the users who are vast wells of knowledge for this game live in their own bubble, and the new users who generally don't know squat live in theirs as well. Players who reside in top kingdoms are the same way. What's best for each player's style of play isn't always best for the game. New users should be the target audience, with enough emphasis on the play-style of the so-called "Elite" to keep them interested. Striking the right balance is never easy, especially when it comes to an elitist online community like Utopia's. This is one of the biggest reasons we all need to drop the self-serving attitude, and promote what's best for the game as a whole. Once the player base has been re-established, then you could move back to a more technical niche of development. But again, all that falls back under the Marxism remark stated previously... It's not a perfect world, and if everyone here really cared as much about Utopia as they claim, they'd drop the attitude and do something constructive.

[Aethiana]

pmyraje, I think what you say makes sense, in that essentially we pay nothing for the game, and we get enjoyment in return. It's like that story where a guy smelling the food of a store was ordered to pay the store owner the shadow of the cost for that food. I don't know if anyone else knows the story :(

People pay to play games too, what benefit does that gain them? Enjoyment of the game! Nothing substantial, anyway.

So I also don't think there is debt owing on any side. But loyalty is also freely given, as a conscious choice to stick with one person/ brand/ thing, regardless of the circumstance. So I can still choose to stick with/ by a game that I've played that I still enjoy!

Final Fantasy's my other weakness :(