Revamping the Honor system

[Wrekx]

I think the honour system is ok. I like being able to choose between land, war wins or honour as a kingdom. Otherwise as far as I'm concerned the playing field for honour is even.

But it will probably be fun to shake things up with a new system.

I'd reccomend putting more honour in circulation so honour provinces can more effectively grab it.

[Al3x]

My 2 Cents
1. Honor should be just a war bonus or a bonus gain in war/hostile. losing honor OOW is stupid there is no honor in random hits and losing 1 point for a SOT OOW is even more so.
2. Honor gain/lost should be based on resources lost/gained and capped.
3. More honor should be created than lost like the 2% land gain from the exploration pool.
4. No honor loss in the first 24hr EOWCF but you can in the second. You have the option to leave early if you want to keep your honor.
5. T/M ops amount gain is debatable as a easy spell my kill a province off as well a hard one keeping someone in check. Again this can also be based on mTPA/WPA ratios so you don't just LL/Prop a province with no protection.

In addition to this at the end of war your KD can chose an MVP(s) or similar where a province gets an addition amount of honor. This can be taken from the honor lost from the losing kingdom X% shared X% to each MVP of both KDs.

[jtwirkus7]

ow and no intel ops should ever be rewarded with honor :)

taking intel is a crucial thing for example a halfer can get totally accurate intel he should be rewarded for providign this crucial intel to his teammates as he/she is wasting there stealth to do so.

just to clarify i mean inside of war outside of war no honor would be gained/lost. the honor for this should be created and not taken from someone.

[Scavenger]

You'd think differently if you lost as many honor as me early age just from sot's. But this was fixed i think.

[Thehmmz]

There's alot of improvements that can be made to the honor system.

• There should be a basic standard honor gain (transparency for players)
  
  In example attacks:
  
  Player A (100k NW), Player B (75k NW), Player C (95k NW), Player D (115k NW), Player E (150k NW)
  - A attacks B (10 honor) (<80% of your NW)
  - A attacks C (50 honor) (80-99% of your NW)
  - A attacks D (100 honor) (100-120% of your NW)
  - A attacks E (75 honor) (>120% of your NW)
  
  
  That's just basic honor, additionally a % bonus or penalty to honor gains based on:
  - Ranks (peasant-prince) there's a % bonus to honor gain
  - Based on frequency of attacks the province had
  During war: none = ++% bonus | extreme = +% bonus
  Out of war: none = +% bonus | extreme = no bonus
  - Based on relations
  War = ++ % bonus
  Hostile = + % bonus
  None/unfriendly = no bonus
  
  you can further extend it, all it requires is putting a % bonus or a % penalty. A same sort of model could exist for T/M specialists
• The honor gain should be somewhat linear for specialist roles (A/T/M)
  
  So any specialist role should be able to gain a max certain amount of honor per day
• For intel ops honor gain should be only a fraction
  
  (e.g. NS gives 3 honor, spy on throne 0.5)
  So Intel specialists are still rewarded for their espionage
• Killing a dragon should be rewarded
  
  for example; 100 soldiers=10 honor, 100 specialists=15 honor
  I think setting the honor gains too high would make it more exploitable.
• The initial honor gain should be revamped in my opinion
  
  As soon as you start your province you can gain easy amounts of honor for doing basic stuff (voting for monarch, first construction, first training, posting on the kingdom forum), on top of that you gain honor by logging in once a day. There could be other things that will eventually give you 0-1800 honor.
  This would also make it much easier to filter the inactives OOP, lose the dead weight.
• And of course a steep curve of ranks, maybe even a few ranks added to make it more versatile

There's so many things I can think of, though the current honor system is not too bad (the real honor huggers
eventually get their titles) but there's always improvements that can be made!

[Bishop]

yup - it was fixed scavenger

[Al3x]

You'd think differently if you lost as many honor as me early age just from sot's. But this was fixed i think.

you lose honor but no one gains any there are two arguments

[Urkel]

1a) i like that honor gives an aim (honor charts) plus benefits to your province
1b) no dislikes about honor
2) make it as transparent as possible by giving us all information you have
3) difficult ops like meteors should give more honor than easy ops like storms; the honor you get with t/m ops shouldnt depend on the targettet provs size; ops on much bigger and much smaller provs should be more difficult (and this difficulty should NOT result in higher honor)
4) slightly, yes
5) yes, would be good to see more counts, marquis, or even some princes


here is one idea to change the honor system:
make a combination of the current honor system and a 'kd honor pool' based system!
this means for your ops/landgrabs you gain 50% of the current systems honor of your target and your kd gains the other 50% of the enemy kd.

example: war between 2 kds with 25 provs each
current system: prov a of kd A landgrabs prov b of kd B and gains 500 honor points
new system: prov a of kd A landgrabs prov b of kd B and gains 250 honor points PLUS all provinces of kd A gain additional 10 honor points each (equals 250) and all provinces of kd B lose 10 honor points each.

advantage:
- provs with very much honor dont lose that much honor any more
- there will be less peasants and more knights
- chaining will give more honor since chained provs will end up as knight
- honor is more equally distributed within your kd
--> you gain honor as a team not as a single province

disadvantage:
- less provs with very high honor
- maybe not that easy to implement for t/m ops since for every op the honor of all provs must be changed by a very small amount of honor

[TommyB]

Another problem is that doing the right thing for your kingdom rarely gives you the best honor.

And what is the problem with that ? You are already doing the right thing for the kingdom, why do you need another reward on top of having the better organized kingdom ?

I think what's wrong with honor is the name. It's not about being nice to elderly ladies or only doing your thief ops against people with the same TPA (LOL?). It's just another ressource in the game, maybe something to go for if you're not so much into land/networth.

GBP for honor makes sense if it isn't already implemented, it should be (at least) the same for honor and land. You cannot really expect someone to not lose most of his honor if he is being attacked 10 times AND all of those attacks are from people within networth range. Maybe check the penalty for bottom feeding but my impression is that you don't gain too much honor for hitting outside of your networth.

Honor for dragon killing etc. etc. is just a bad idea IMO. This is the same as above - you should be rewarded for doing the right thing etc. etc. If what you're doing is the right thing then it is a reward in itself, otherwise you're not doing it right! ;-) No, what really speaks against giving out these rewards is that it will be abused. Now you can fake war and gain honor at the same time.. why would anyone ever leave the fake war ?

Oh and please fix the honor loss from random ops OOW. At least taking a SoT for 1% stealth should not have an effect on honor at all - it is just too easy right now to target someone in the charts with 500 SoT / day to bring him down (I don't know if this happens but the fact that it is possible is bad enough).

[taibhse]

Created an account jsut to post here

I think honour should be tied to how you act more than anything else. The gains should be greater to make a difference too.
Good respectful players should be rewarded for thier good play with honour.


how to gain
attack players larger than you (or up to 80% your size)
op players larger than you(or up to 80% your size)

how to lose
attack smaller players
chain players
attack into a warring kd (out if you are in war and attack out of it)
op players less than half your size


Just off my head a few ways to do it, the main point is to push players to not all target one player, or easy targets.
nobody likes being chained to the ground, being mass opped or getting smashed by a massive enemy. If the gains from being a good honourable player were good it would stop this kind of action.


or course there are a lot of things to cover and it has to be done in a way that can't be abused easy but this is the sort of system I would be happy to see.

worth noting here you would not lose anything for getting hit.

[Landro]

* Killing a dragon should be rewarded too, for example; 100 soldiers=10 honor, 100 specialists=15 honor

Wow, so if I send 10K specs to slay the dragon I'd get 1500 honor? That 2 full honor ranks!
And where does this honor come from? I doubt people would launch dragons if they had to invest such a huge amount of honor in them.

[Landro]

Created an account jsut to post here

I think honour should be tied to how you act more than anything else. The gains should be greater to make a difference too.
Good respectful players should be rewarded for thier good play with honour.


how to gain
attack players larger than you (or up to 80% your size)
op players larger than you(or up to 80% your size)

how to lose
attack smaller players
chain players
attack into a warring kd (out if you are in war and attack out of it)
op players less than half your size


Just off my head a few ways to do it, the main point is to push players to not all target one player, or easy targets.
nobody likes being chained to the ground, being mass opped or getting smashed by a massive enemy. If the gains from being a good honourable player were good it would stop this kind of action.


or course there are a lot of things to cover and it has to be done in a way that can't be abused easy but this is the sort of system I would be happy to see.

You would limit war strategy to massacre waves followed by max grabbing. That would make for very long wars. Taking players out of the war is a very strong tactic but requires coordination and discipline. I feel there's a good balance between effort and reward there. And what if you're just bigger than everybody else? Why wouldn't you get honor for taking down the biggest threats to your team mates by hitting them down?

[Scavenger]

GBP for honor makes sense if it isn't already implemented,

It is. Very harsh even. Far more than acre gains.

[jtwirkus7]

Wow, so if I send 10K specs to slay the dragon I'd get 1500 honor? That 2 full honor ranks!
And where does this honor come from? I doubt people would launch dragons if they had to invest such a huge amount of honor in them.

why would you send 10k specs when you could easily send 50k soldiers according to that and get a total of 5000 honor and be a prince almost instantly would be a total advantage for the monarchs in the super kingdoms

[Thehmmz]

Wow, so if I send 10K specs to slay the dragon I'd get 1500 honor? That 2 full honor ranks!
And where does this honor come from? I doubt people would launch dragons if they had to invest such a huge amount of honor in them.

No I meant that's what you're able to get, I'll rephrase it

Killing a dragon should be rewarded too, for example; Sending a minimum of 100 soldiers=10 honor, Sending a minimum of 100 specialists=15 honor. This is rewarded only once a day

In my opinion, it's small things like this that gives a player a satisfied feeling doing the right thing for the kingdom, sacrificing his own army, while still gain a little honor.