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Thread: homes

  1. #31
    Forum Fanatic E_Boko's Avatar
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    ok you can run 60 opa without a high home strat. you just need to not suck and train enough leets for the most part.

    if ppl feel like losers because they are in a crappy kingdom, there are plenty of kingdoms that are looking for players at higher levels of activity. they just need to look in the recruiting thread here or go to #recruiting in IRC. kingdoms are willing to teach and be patient with new ppl. hell im still looking for one more player and sinners and stoners and hung3r, and vice n virtue, and canwe, and starcraft...not hard to find a good kingdom where you wont be bored and suck

    you can attack and do ops without homes. you know what enables attacking and ops better? guilds, TD, TG, rax, towers, libs, stables, dungeons, hospitals, GS, forts, ect...

    high homes is infinitely better for ghetto players that want to STAY on the bottom, with no aspiration for greatness or wanting to achieve something more with their gaming. whats the point of beating up crappy players all age? who gives a flying fark if you have 7 war wins against kingdoms with 5 active ppl and 15 inactive players?!?! war and beat up RPG, NGNG, bodega, an abs kingdom, fluffies, jerks, the apes and then come back with 7 war wins and brag about it. this is why we dont rank WW.

    wtf does my private life have to do with your sucky strat? im not close minded if thats what you are going for. i dont hate homes, i just hate that you want other ppl to follow your underachieving advice because it works on the worst play level we have. not everyone is content staying on the bottom.
    Icy 4 8

  2. #32
    Forum Fanatic gergnub's Avatar
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    now now E_Boko, why would someone want to get better in this game and try to achieve higher ranks and goals. That would be stupid. Rather just use 50% homes and be the king of the darkest ghetto.

  3. #33
    Veteran gojete's Avatar
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    damnit reducing post again
    Ok , see you dont understand what i mean that you bring your personal life to the game, and not stick to discussing strategies.

    This is a fact that high homes works with 80% of the server. Why do you want to force everyone to "want to get better" "to achieve greatness "

    First of all those terms you use so much, have a meaning to you, a specific meaning, greatness for you might not be the same for someone else.

    I really truly understand what you mean man, im just having a very hard time trying to make myself understood here by what i mean.

    When i say you bring your pesonal life and private issues into the game. IS because in your world, your world defined as everything you know . You have been put into your head , that you have to be something, that you have to be better, that you have to achieve, that you cant just be a nobody, you have to have a car, you have to have a house perhaps.

    Whatever is it that you do in real life, you are bringing it to the game. A game that is purely fictional, that the only thing that you get out of it are the feelings that you get when you play.

    It seems like you are striving towards the feeling of "achieving greatness". Can you isolate that feeling ? see how it feels ? Thats all you are getting , right ?
    Well what if others dont care about that feeling at all.
    Can you achieve what you call greatness, without that feeling ?

    Is it being better than the rest all you want, because how it makes you feel? Why do you want to be better at the game, and be better than others.

    See in life, of course the better paid your job is, maybe the better off you are. But relating real life into a mental thing like utopia. Do you see the wrongness of it ?
    Last edited by gojete; 25-07-2011 at 14:25.
    - Get the best out of your gameplay, go 45% homes minimum .
    -Successfully tested over 13 war wins in a row and many that number of non war conflicts .
    7 out f 7 war wins age 50 guarantees.
    High homes = good

  4. #34
    Forum Fanatic E_Boko's Avatar
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    because he wonders why we beat down on his ridiculous strat when we are in the strategy section. its my civic duty to tell other ppl why high homes is crap and if you want to do something with your game to not listen to him.

    its like playing a game without any upgrades or new equipment and staying level 1. yes you can do it and it can be fun and challenging but you arent going to break damage limit like that. youre gonna be running from random creatures left and right which is all he is doing. hes hiding in the damn ghettos cause he knows his strat would fail on a mid level kingdom.

    i will not let him drag down more noobs with him. not when i need a damn player still... btw FiH is still recruiting 1 more player...lol
    Icy 4 8

  5. #35
    Forum Fanatic gergnub's Avatar
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    gojete is like vines. ignore both.

  6. #36
    Veteran gojete's Avatar
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    see how you ridicule in your posts and overall everything you are writing is being done not with a feeling of friendliness and meaning well, but with negative emotions like making fun of people because they dont think like you and so on ?

    This is also what im saying about bringing your personal life about it. Being this a strategy and mathematical game. How hard is it to understand that if you use high homes , and you dont have much experience of the game, you can instantly have better results in a quick manner without struggling and being able to compete againsat 80% of the server ?

    This are just numbers man . you are the one bringing in that you yourself want to fight against only 5% of the server, because it makes you feel like you want goals and are good and superior. What you are writing is nothing but an ego trip
    - Get the best out of your gameplay, go 45% homes minimum .
    -Successfully tested over 13 war wins in a row and many that number of non war conflicts .
    7 out f 7 war wins age 50 guarantees.
    High homes = good

  7. #37
    Enthusiast Al3x's Avatar
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    "But you see 80% of the players in utopi as inferior, as not worth living nor even breathing."
    this is simply not true. also 80% of the server isn't inactive or in an inactive kingdom.

    It's people not listening to good advice and using it or taking it on board. Not one person has said high home stat is good, the most ever anyone has really said is 20% but you refuse to listen. You could be a good player even a great one because you has ambition but you stop yourself from achieving by not adapting or evolving the way you play the game.
    people here try giving advice on how to better your province. Last age MY province was made better by a guy in my kingdom by changing the build about. I still didn't have >10% homes. I am trusted to be the monarch I still get things wrong but I say when I do.

    yes high home stats work in some builds but have excessive % of any building is not a good stat. (i would never say more than~20% of anything unless pumping)

    All you have to do to be in my kingdom (one of those mentioned by boko) is attack twice a day in war. once before you got to school/work one after, I am sorry this is not hard and there are many more kingdoms out there wanting the same.
    Last edited by Al3x; 25-07-2011 at 14:40.
    all the master (can I change this back yet bishop)

    Quote Originally Posted by gojete View Post
    Most of the free time I used was to write crap here in the forums.

  8. #38
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    Having run numbers in theory - homes are not optimal for most provinces. However, they are close to optimal, so the lost "power" using them will be small. All these calcs on provs similar to what I run, optimizing for static military. (Don't bother with the static optimization rants - I'll note for you right now that many believe it a worthless measure. I only claim it is a useful guideline, requiring dynamic considerations and "experience". But it's all I can calculate on directly.)

    My opinion: I suspect a high homes strat will work quite well for many "getto" players - those that aren't really getting the game. The extra pop is blindingly easy to make use of. Having such a large chunk of land locked up in homes also forces you to focus the rest of the buildings down to essentials - aka, no 15% farms or 10% mills or any junk like that.
    However - a good player can do better. TG/Forts is usually stronger, and homes do hit a bit of a DBE effect (naturally, I know the coded DBE doesn't apply) where to many get weaker. Since good BE science lessens their impact, a good player is expected to find them worse as well - a true getto player won't push science as hard as a more skilled player.

    In short - the numbers I've always come up with say homes are mildly sub-optimal. I'm good enough that doesn't cut it, so I keep them at a low % (I use 5-10% as a "fast convert" so I rebuild less between pump and war - one of those pesky dynamic considerations I can't model.) But for a lot of the server, mildly sub-optimal is an improvement, and so high homes represents progress of a sort. (And a very simple way to achieve it.) I believe advising someone to try it *when framed as: easy but only acceptable, not best* is a reasonable thing to do.

    gojete probably moved from weak strats into high homes, which is why he sees such an improvement. Many of the other posters are already using even better tuned builds, so they see a fall off. Given that it looks (to me) like gojete *is* listening and learning, even while spouting some fairly silly statements at times... I'm prone to just aiming to let time and experience prove it to him. Although I also offer they following: once your build is done with high homes - post all the info up here, and I'll rebuild it with a 0 homes strats and beat your military numbers. (Of course to be fair I'll hold everything else constant that I can.) Mind you... I'll be optimizing MPNW, not MPA. (Which, oddly enough, most of the anti-homes crowd will argue is wrong... even though homes *are* clearly better of OPA/DPA!)
    it's vs. its is ambiguous - from now on I'm attempting to use the proper possessive it's, and the contraction 'tis. (Its will just be the plural.)

    Think Different

  9. #39
    Game Support Bishop's Avatar
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    The static part is critical Ethan - you are not static in war.
    Support email: utopiasupport@utopia-game.com <- please use this and don't just PM me| Account Deleted/Inactive | Utopia Facebook Page | #tactics <-- click to join IRC|
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  10. #40
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    A long running debate - my argument, in short, is that - assuming things like hospitals, gs, etc. are constant - starting stronger in war means staying stronger in war. Don't care much how you got stronger to start with. I know many disagree with this theory - and I know that things like a chain "bypass" the normal losses and requires by its nature a dynamic analysis - but I've found it to be a good guild so far.

    Edit: The long running debate I refer to is the "static strength" vs. "dynamic factors", myself vs. Bishop et. all. Not the homes argument. Sorry for the confusion.
    Last edited by Ethan; 25-07-2011 at 17:03.
    it's vs. its is ambiguous - from now on I'm attempting to use the proper possessive it's, and the contraction 'tis. (Its will just be the plural.)

    Think Different

  11. #41
    Forum Fanatic E_Boko's Avatar
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    why play a game like this non noncompetitive? the environment screams competition here.

    /me runs numbers for gojete.
    Icy 4 8

  12. #42
    Needs to get out more DHaran's Avatar
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    Some people will just never understand....
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  13. #43
    Enthusiast Al3x's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethan View Post
    my argument, in short, is that - assuming things like hospitals, gs, etc. are constant - starting stronger in war means staying stronger in war.
    This I agree with however if they are running a much larger % of homes they are less likely to have the same number of GS/hospital etc.
    all the master (can I change this back yet bishop)

    Quote Originally Posted by gojete View Post
    Most of the free time I used was to write crap here in the forums.

  14. #44
    Needs to get out more DHaran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethan View Post
    A long running debate - my argument, in short, is that - assuming things like hospitals, gs, etc. are constant - starting stronger in war means staying stronger in war.
    If the debate is high homes vs not high homes, how can the rest of a strat be constant?? Come on man, use some common sense. High homes strats are not good, period.
    S E C R E T S

  15. #45
    Veteran gojete's Avatar
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    High homes are not static strats, i tested them in and out war and they work great in kingdoms outside the top 100.

    What does competition mean really ?
    wanting to be a top 1 kd, its too much effort, its too much time, fuk that man i just want to have fun. Ive been the best player in a few real strategy games already, won tornaments, played againt the best many times .

    It doesnt really mean anything ,you can have the same excitement in a ghetto than winning a crown its all in the head . Its just a subjective experience .

    There are certain races and personalities that work better for high homes than others, and it depends with your gameplay.

    An avian cleric, would be the perfect choice for a heavy attacker, due to the bonuses , same as an undead tactitian . with undead you can be running 70% homes in the ghetto and 30% barracks with a super ubber opa and do a great job, or 40% homes, 25% guard stations, 25% barracks and 10% WT and feel the power.

    The strat might be stupid to most of you, but unless you try it , why flame man , really, most of us dont care about being top 100. And this strat would allow you to kick ass and have a lot of fun in the ghetto, so why not ? If it lets you kick butt against 80% of the server, how is it wrong ?

    A fairy tm would benefit from high homes incredibly.

    When the armies are so big, modifiers from training grounds or forts are not needed , not even from science for that matter . But for a fairy i would run 8% forts maybe with 115% BE.

    One focuses more in bonuses that help you in war. Like for example barracks, guard stations , hospitals are the buildings to have, arms when you pump .
    You dont use stables, training gorunds, forts, dungeons, etc. And you still achieve good numbers, and can attack and are competitive in this level. And you have income and can afford 200% wages as well.

    High homes are easy to do and deliver . Way more user friendly and instant action than spending ages in boredom trying to learn the game . Why suffer if you can kick butt from start ?
    - Get the best out of your gameplay, go 45% homes minimum .
    -Successfully tested over 13 war wins in a row and many that number of non war conflicts .
    7 out f 7 war wins age 50 guarantees.
    High homes = good

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