Ask Realest Returns

[lastunicorn]

If the kingdom you are warring has a bank (not necessarily a pro bank) but you don't, how can you beat them?

[UtoCasual]

I will not dispute that Av is the best race when playing at a high level, if for no other reason than hit volume wins wars. However, at a casual level there are many players who have (either externally or self-imposed) time constraints that would limit them to say 2 hits a day (before / after work, after getting up / before going to sleep, etc).

Obviously such players / KDs are never going to challenge for significant honours, but so long as they are playing with people with equal constraints (i.e. they're not wrecking other peoples chances in the charts) and are smart enough to play against people with similar constraints (i.e. they don't loose every war by being constantly outhit by people who can put out more hits per capita) then I see no real problem with that; indeed they're a good source of 'feeding' in the upward flow of land.

My question, however, is whether Av is still the best race choice under such conditions, as the major benefit (speed and hence hit volume) is negated?

I assume that +AT could be selected when making hits to produce the desired return time with a handy % gains boost to the hits (as Max Gains would appear to be de rigueur based on your posts), but are there 'better' / equally effective alternatives under said conditions?


(On an entirely random aside, do you know what happened to Captain Obvious from the old swirve boards?)

[UtoCasual]

Apologies in advance for the double post, but it has just dawned on me that there were a plethora of no doubt ‘dumb’ questions I could ask to further my own limited understanding:

1) Given that we haven’t had land based gains for a long-ass time (and hence how much power you can fit into acres has been replaced by how much power you can fit in each nw point), how come most people still refer to OPA / DPA and not OPnw and DPnw? Is it just that per acre is a good enough approximation to get by, and that per net worth is too fluctuating and too much of a pain in the ass to calculate on a frequent basis?

2) What are suitable WPA / TPA (or Pnw) for a pure attacker? I’ve always (much to the ridicule of many) maintained a decent level (usually 3 or 4 mod) at the expense of some ppa / opa. I’ve never contended that it’s a good defence against pure t/ms (who will get through anyway) but it does keep the Hybrids off your back. I appreciate that you’re not pro-hybrid anyway, but there’s still plenty knocking about… So should I just accept that I’m wrong and living in the past (when I played most actively there was an abundance of Elf and Ud a/ms) or is there an argument to be made for having enough wizzies / thieves to be a deterrent against hybrids?

3) In terms of t/m’s do you prefer an actual hybrid t/m or someone who specialises much more heavily in one or the other? When I first started playing it seemed that ‘super’ (or even ‘uber’) thieves or mages (at least in the terminology of the KD I played in) were common, whereas actual mixed t/ms where in limited supply… Would it be reasonable to assume that t/ms are better against pure attackers due to the fact that you can be successful with lower mod numbers? And that conversely you need to be putting up much better mods when facing hybrids? Or is there an argument to be made for always focussing in one and then cramming in as much def as you can to account for the fact that pure attackers will be more likely to break you?

4) How come people get so touchy about ‘bottom-feeding’ and there is such a stigma about it, particularly in the mid to lower tier KDs? I get that being constantly hit by people who you can’t retal is somewhat soul destroying, but it would seem relatively obvious (even to me) that in order to allow for the game to function in a format where people can continue to grow throughout the age that land would have to flow from the bottom upwards; otherwise growth would stagnate at some point effectively creating a cap on what someone / a KD could achieve and thus allowing other KD’s to claw them back as the age progressed.

5) Raze or Mass tm’s during a Hostile (or even leave them alone)?

6) Taking into account the fact you don’t like chaining, but that it is still relatively common (at least at some levels of play) what is the best method for dealing with being chained? I suppose there a case to be made for not worrying about it as long as the KD as a whole is on top, but it often seems people don’t know how to recover from being chained or panic too much whilst being chained; so any insight would be much appreciated?

7) Banks at top levels seem to work well, but I’m guessing at lower levels of play they’d be a complete waste; would just be free resources for the various KD’s above them that could feed on them from what I see. Is there a case to be made for a middling warring KD to run one, or is it simply just a hideous waste of what could be another attacker?

8) Attackers getting their own intel or an active Halfer ‘wasting’ stealth on getting it all?

[Realest]

that's a lot of questions.

[lastunicorn]

I just asked one.

[Realest]

I'm lazy. I applaud the willingness to learn but ****, that huge wall of text is daunting.

[Meeni]

Realest, if lame kds and bad setups are farmed out of the top 10, how did fratzia almost win first last age as undead?

[UtoCasual]

I'm lazy. I applaud the willingness to learn but ****, that huge wall of text is daunting.

Well to be fair a lot of text is mostly to explain why I'm asking the question to avoid responses (not from you) of "STFU noob" or "you'll never win a crown like that". And likewise to encourage detailed responses, as the actual answer to the questions is less important than the reason why that is the answer (in terms of understanding the mechanic being more important than a one-word current response... teach a man to fish and all that)

Perhaps the below is a less intimidating version of the Q's:

1) If you can only log / hit twice a day is Av still best?

2) OPA / DPA or OPnw / DPnw

3) A decent TPA / WPA for an attacker? Is keeping 3 to 4 mod to deter Hybrids just a compete waste?

4) t/m's with (relative) lower mods of each and lower (relative) def or specialist thieves and mages with higher mods in one and higher def?

5) Bottom-feeding, why so much hate? Surely the flow of land from bottom to top is a necessary mechanic to ensure that people can grow all age?

6) Enemy tm's pre-war (or in a wave) - Raze, Mass, Learn or Ignore?

7) Chaining - How to best deal with being chained? (whilst it hapens and recovering once its happened)

8) Bank for mid- to lower- tier KD's; pointless waste of resources lost to bigger KD's or still useful against people in same range as you?

9) Attackers getting own intel vs tm's 'wasting' stealth to keep them updated?

[Vengeance]

I'm lazy. I applaud the willingness to learn but ****, that huge wall of text is daunting.

lol! He/She signed up just to ask as well ... I wouldn't be bothering trying to simply answer, i'd be answering and recruiting :P

[Realest]

I dont have a problem with recruitment. I tend to have more players than invites

[Ryshad]

Havent war wins always been land based? I think there was an age or so in there with the war meter that I think it was NW based but I have been wrong before, I mean ... I am divorced, but in general haven't wars always been about gaining acres to determine a winner?

What do you consider the most new player (easiest) to run attacking race/personality?

If you had a kingdom of 15 new (first time) players, 5 semi- new players an 5 vets, what would your kingdom make up be? Just pretend its a war kingdom

[Realest]

this is too much to read, im gonna start a new thread later, and setting some rules.

[Vengeance]

So you're not going to answer his questions?

[octobrev]

My father is getting old and sickly so please allow me to fill in.

1) If you can only log / hit twice a day is Av still best?
If you intend to be aggressive then avian is still perfectly viable. The 8/5 military is second only to orc and the attack time bonus compensates for the use of anon to prevent ambush. It has a significant economic boost with the 650gc drakes. If you intend to accept enemy waves and declare then dwarf is ideal since the defensive elite forces them to send out more offense, resulting in more plentiful initial chaining opportunities.

2) OPA / DPA or OPnw / DPnw
It would be nearly impossible to order your kingdom to train a specific OP/DPnw. Benchmarks are much more easily set as per acre, but you should consider the consequences of each races per nw capabilities at the start of the age and when deciding on your build/training orders.

3) A decent TPA / WPA for an attacker? Is keeping 3 to 4 mod to deter Hybrids just a compete waste?
3 to 4 sounds perfect. You wont be able to deter all ops without sacrificing more pop space than its worth but running 4 mod forces the enemy hybrids to run 20+ mod, costing them valuable military space. Halflings are nearly impossible to defend against because of the availability of compounding thievery modifiers, thus the need for watchtowers vs kds with a large number of them. There aren't any such modifiers for magic aside from the faery bonus so they need to run especially high raw wpa to be effective.

4) t/m's with (relative) lower mods of each and lower (relative) def or specialist thieves and mages with higher mods in one and higher def?
Think of T/M's as a utility province and don't expect too much out of them. A 7 defense elite is not going to be effective vs the inflated offense of current day attacker elites. Faeries are forced to outgrow their kingdoms to remain unbreakable in war, which works against the effectiveness of the ops since they are working mostly out of nw range. If you absolutely need ops, consider sacrificing a couple attackers for hybrids instead.

5) Bottom-feeding, why so much hate? Surely the flow of land from bottom to top is a necessary mechanic to ensure that people can grow all age?
It is a very necessary mechanic in a game centered around growth and interaction. People get mad because they invest heavily in exploring then end up absolutely defenseless as their acres are stripped away from them. They symbolically associate large provinces hitting little provinces with bullying or fighting unfairly.

6) Enemy tm's pre-war (or in a wave) - Raze, Mass, Learn or Ignore?
Ignore. Max gains. Unless you're honor whoring, you want the acres so the ops aren't really going to matter.

7) Chaining - How to best deal with being chained? (whilst it hapens and recovering once its happened)
I haven't been chained in years but if I remember correctly, your offense isn't going to leave until it gets home. Manage your population by first landlusting, then releasing defense and thieves to bring you under the 115% threshold as your army returns. Don't release until they are done hitting as they will just hit you more easily. Keep acres incoming constantly since they'll be able to continue hitting you with left over offense. Be online the tick before your army returns in case you need aid to pay wages.

8) Bank for mid- to lower- tier KD's; pointless waste of resources lost to bigger KD's or still useful against people in same range as you?
Unless you sign a legitimate top kingdom banker who can get the required CFs, it is 100% pointless to run a bank. You would be forced to sit on high draft which is useless for the economic benefits you're probably after. In turn, you could run a small orc province (like 300 acres) to plunder oop sized inactives throughout the age. Any half way decent target finder could fund a couple dragons before warstart.

9) Attackers getting own intel vs tm's 'wasting' stealth to keep them updated?
Attackers get their own intel. Way too obvious.

[octobrev]

Havent war wins always been land based? I think there was an age or so in there with the war meter that I think it was NW based but I have been wrong before, I mean ... I am divorced, but in general haven't wars always been about gaining acres to determine a winner?
It's all about the acres! If you lose a lot of networth in comparison to your opponent then you are put in a position where you stand to lose acres in the future so, in a sense, NW also matters and could prompt a withdraw.

What do you consider the most new player (easiest) to run attacking race/personality?
Undead as it cannot starve and it forces them to practice hitting and target finding to train elites.

If you had a kingdom of 15 new (first time) players, 5 semi- new players an 5 vets, what would your kingdom make up be? Just pretend its a war kingdom.
They should all be attackers. For ghettos, the kingdom that hits the most wins. If everybody is attacking you will tower over the other 15 prov kingdoms that are half T/Ms.