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Thread: Capitalism Fails

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by chalsdk View Post
    Home from chuch now :-)

    Its been said Capitalism does not work - that is ? true - The generel wealth is prob. bigger in a capitalist place(US style with no limits or VERY few) , but the large corperations also own the govement and the idea that wealth goes down thou the contry is a big lie as well, as is the "american Dream/lie).

    Commonist goes not work ether, well unless there is an incoptoble man/female in charge. And even if you get someone like that, the odds for someone else with no morrals are huge(when the Current dictator dies).

    Ofc there is Fasism back, and given that its very unpopular for clear reasons, it does still have some strong sides. Not that I am saying it the way to go thou.


    But IF you mix Communist and Capitalism like its done in scandianvia you get a real strong economy and it will benefet all. Its a shame that most only ses 2 options. Since there are 4(might be more, I have just noot seen them jet).

    This model builds apon strong unions that are only allowed to stricke once eavery 4th year. The govement have no interest in min. pay or alike as others has allready commeted.
    This model will give all alot more wealth and generel be good too all, exept the ultra rich! but they do not neeeeeeed that much wealth in the first place ether.

    The less you earn(IE no job, bad job pay) the less tax you pay - but with the same rights to get fixed becourse you get hurt/get children og just pure unlucky from fired and get appendicitis..


    A few links that explains it alot better then I do with my non perfect english.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_in_Denmark
    http://www.tradingeconomics.com/denm...mployment-rate
    http://www.evm.dk/resources/oem/publ..._UK/kap13.html


    Ofc the big companyes and alike will tell its all lies and we are the soons of the devil becourse the will get taxed harder and will loose their ability to live like Kings & Barrons in the middel ages.

    PS: And as Fungi says - its all about haveing the biggest winning circle.
    And no denmark is not Perfect in any way - we have huge problems as well - but they are tiny alot of other contries, even thou we are smaler.
    Yeah, only you have forgotten that all the countries of Scandinavia are extremely rich in natural wealth like gold and have very small populations. The only reason your system works is b.c of this fact. Look at this, you are in the top 50s for gold production and like 100-200th place in population. You guys prolly have 4x as much gold per person as the average country. That is the only reason you can afford to spend +50% GPD on your silly gov't programs. I'm sure you guys would do well with any system considering the vast wealth per person you enjoy. That being said I think its laughable you thank socialism for your prosperity. I suspect that massive bureaucracy of yours loses more $ to corruption&waste than the entire GPD of Uzbekistan annually. This of coarse is not to suggest that Uzbekistan or another country is better than yours. I'm not in the business of doing that, My country holds no special place in my heart I'm only here to reply and defend capitalism.

    https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat...k/geos/sw.html
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...old_production
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._by_population
    Last edited by thephatman; 13-01-2013 at 01:20.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by thephatman View Post
    I think you will need more than a dismissive and poorly reasoned one liner to disprove the reasoned mind of Thomas Jefferson. I suspect he has read and written more on the subject than you and that your opinion is based on nothing, Feel free to correct me. I doubt Thomas Jefferson theories are about to be credibly challenged by the likes of you. Also You seem to think that the bank has lost something in this transaction. 1st off the bank generated the loan electronically and depending on the bank is guaranteed repayment by a larger bank connected to the FED in the event the loan goes bad. 2nd the bank likely collected monthly payments for years. 3rd Now they have the house and money, and the money they "lost"(even though they didnt have this sum prior to the creation of the loan and unless they are a small non-federally backed bank they will get the "lost" money back).... it seems they pressed a button, collected some fees and are now up a house. Not only will they sell it but likely loan the money for its purchase as well. What you seem to not be aware of is that many banks are "federally insured" banks. Which means they can never fail. Even if they commit fraud and hand out loans they know that will never be repaid the Gov't is obligated legally to step in and cover the losses of the bank through the federal reserve system. Essentially what happens is smaller banks are consumed into larger banks. In the event a large bank fails it is consumed by the fed more directly. This system was set up to prevent a run on the bank as used to happen preww2. However this system has simply delayed the inevitable failure of it's fiat currency and ensured the crash will be a global crisis when it arrives.

    Maybe you should get a fact straight b4 you form such strong opinions. Like I and many others have stated w/ evidence. We live in a planned economy. The banks and most other profitable institutions rely heavily on grants, subsidy, bail out, cost + contract etc. These are not capitalistic practices. Also Mr. "Fungi" Capitalism is clearly not a flawed system at least by comparison to all other systems its the best for the most. In America capitalize functioned admirably for about 100 years. Corporations were limited to specific charters the average man was rich enough to own land w.o loans/mortgage. It would be extremely difficult for you to find a period in history when the prosperity and social mobility of the common man was higher. This i believe is mostly thanks to the capitalist system. I'm sure many of you are fans of television and Micheal Moore and believe that we live in a capitalistic system today, or even that most of the world lives under capitalism. This is patently and demonstrably untrue. We and most of the world have had a socialist economy since the fall of WW2. The Gov't simply grew too large and expanded into too much of the market. Previously the Fed Gov't had made up a very small % of the workplace/market. Today it is difficult to find any major national institution who is not paid or subsidized in some way by the fed.

    As far as the world goes the World Bank, the WTO and the IMF manage the funding for most of the worlds infrastructure and public property. Just like banks in the US they have made it a practice to loan out huge sums to people who cannot pay it back. Not only do these countries end up hiring western construction firms to build the roads, power-plants, skyscrapers etc.. but when they can't pay back the IMF or World Bank they are forced to sell off and privatize all that infrastructure they got the loans to build to begin with. This is how most 3rd world municipal services have been privatized. Since 2008 and the collapse in the US this same model of privatizing public property is underway.

    I think the both of you should do some basic reading on the subject and stop taking ppl like Micheal Moore and Bill Oriely's opinion as truth. There is no capitalism in the world today. If you think otherwise you are too stupid to match reality with definitions.

    I see The world as ruled by a divided empire or sorts, not too dissimilar from Rome. Instead of powerful senators and protectors of Rome there are powerful corporations. The Eastern empire is ruled mostly by Russia/China and some what Japan and India. In the West the Empire is mostly controlled by USA England and Germany. All these nations and their friendly neighbors in the northern hemisphere are more or less allied and have agreed to plunder the southern hemisphere some what equally through the international banks and their own transnational corps. Though Ideologically unique East and West are slowly merging into one. Communism and Capitalism have already merged into the state planned economies shared by all nations even Moscow and Washington. Television and culture are becoming more and more similar, The Office for example was translated and recast into 13 different languages in different countries world wide. Im not sure what the word is for the governance of such a system. Maybe The Corptocratic Empire of Fascism or The Fascist Imperial Corptocracy? After all fascism is just socialism for corporations.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_B..._United_States
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitalism
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Tre..._of_Government
    http://www.wju.edu/academics/bus/iscm/dbiondi.pdf
    The banking industry is a tool. Like any tool, if you use it improperly, it can hurt you. When Thomas Jefferson said that, the world was considerably different. Also Thomas Jefferson WAS ADMITTEDLY a bit of a troublemaker. And one liners are just better communication, your post TLDR

  3. #48
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    capitalism... lets just say this.. 1% of the world is wealthy and well off while the rest of us struggle jsut for daily life, even less than 1% of the worlds population. Lets leave it at that, because this goes back waaay to far to talk about..

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killthemall View Post
    Political Science for Dummies

    DEMOCRAT

    You have two cows. Your neighbor has none. You feel guilty for being successful.
    You push for higher taxes so the government can provide cows for everyone.



    REPUBLICAN

    You have two cows. Your neighbor has none. So?



    SOCIALISM

    You have two cows. The government takes one and gives it to your neighbor.
    You form a cooperative to tell him how to manage his cow.



    COMMUNISM

    You have two cows. The government seizes both and provides you with milk.
    You wait in line for hours to get it. It is expensive and sour.



    CAPITALISM, AMERICAN STYLE

    You have two cows. You sell one, buy a bull, and build a herd of cows.



    BUREAUCRACY, AMERICAN STYLE

    You have two cows. Under the new farm program the government pays you to shoot one,
    milk the other, and then pour the milk down the drain.



    AMERICAN CORPORATION

    You have two cows. You sell one, lease it back to yourself and do an IPO on the 2nd one. You force the two cows to produce the milk of four cows. You are surprised when one cow drops dead. You spin an announcement to the analysts stating you have downsized and are reducing expenses. Your stock goes up.



    FRENCH CORPORATION

    You have two cows. You go on strike because you want three cows.
    You go to lunch and drink wine. Life is good.



    JAPANESE CORPORATION

    You have two cows. You redesign them so they are one-tenth the size of an ordinary cow and produce twenty times the milk. They learn to travel on unbelievably crowded trains.
    Most are at the top of their class at cow school.



    GERMAN CORPORATION

    You have two cows. You engineer them so they are all blond, drink lots of beer, give excellent quality milk, and run a hundred miles an hour. Unfortunately they also demand 13 weeks of vacation per year.



    ITALIAN CORPORATION

    You have two cows but you don't know where they are.
    You break for lunch. Life is good.



    RUSSIAN CORPORATION

    You have two cows. You drink some vodka. You count them and learn you have five cows. You drink some more vodka. You count them again and learn you have 42 cows. The Mafia shows up and takes over all cows you really have.



    TALIBAN CORPORATION

    You have all the cows in Afghanistan . Exactly two. You don't milk them because you cannot touch any creature's private parts. You get a $40 million grant from the US government to find alternatives to milk production but use the money to buy weapons.



    IRAQI CORPORATION

    You have two cows. They go into hiding. They send radio tapes of their mooing.



    POLISH CORPORATION

    You have two bulls. Employees are regularly maimed and killed attempting to milk them.



    BELGIAN CORPORATION

    You have one cow. The cow is schizophrenic. Sometimes the cow thinks he's French, other times he's Flemish. The Flemish cow won't share with the French cow. The French cow wants control of the Flemish cow's milk. The cow asks permission to be cut in half. The cow dies happy.



    FLORIDA CORPORATION

    You have a black cow and a brown cow. Everyone votes for the best looking one. Some of the people who actually like the brown one best accidentally vote for the black one. Some people vote for both. Some people vote for neither. Some people can't figure out how to vote at all. Finally, a bunch of guys from out-of-state tell you which one you think is the best looking cow.



    CALIFORNIA CORPORATION

    You have millions of cows. They make real California cheese.
    Only five speak English. Most are illegal.


    Our Tax System Explained Using the 'Beer' Language


    When pondering the question of mining super taxes and the structure of our tax system in general please refer to this explanation using the language of Beer!

    Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100.

    If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this;

    The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
    The fifth would pay $1
    The sixth would pay $3
    The seventh would pay $7
    The eighth would pay $12
    The ninth would pay $18
    The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59

    So, that's what they decided to do.

    The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve ball.

    "Since you are all such good customers," he said, "I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20". Drinks for the ten men would now cost just $80.

    The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes.

    So the first four men were unaffected.

    They would still drink for free. But what about the other six men - the paying customers?

    How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his fair share?

    They realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33.
    But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer.

    So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by a higher percentage the poorer he was, to follow the principle of the tax system they had been using,
    and he proceeded to work out the amounts he suggested that each should now pay.

    And so the fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% saving).

    The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33% saving).

    The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28% saving).

    The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% saving).

    The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% saving).

    The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% saving).

    Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But, once outside the bar, the men began to compare their savings.

    "I only got a dollar out of the $20 saving," declared the sixth man.

    He pointed to the tenth man, "but he got $10!"

    "Yeah, that's right," exclaimed the fifth man. "I only saved a dollar too. It's unfair that he got ten times more benefit than me!"

    "That's true!" shouted the seventh man. "Why should he get $10 back, when I got only $2? The wealthy get all the breaks!"

    "Wait a minute," yelled the first four men in unison, "we didn't get anything at all. This new tax system exploits the poor!"

    The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

    The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks, so the nine sat down and had their beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They didn't have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!

    And that, boys and girls, journalists and government ministers, is how our tax system works.

    The people who already pay the highest taxes will naturally get the most benefit from a tax reduction..

    Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore.

    In fact, they might start drinking overseas, where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.




    For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
    For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.


    some of things if found that explain alot in terms i understand better.

    i feel as though i lost some intelligence on this post

  5. #50
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    Capitalism has done more for the improvement of poor people's lives than any other known system.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Octaedron View Post
    Capitalism has done more for the improvement of poor people's lives than any other known system.
    Ezactly. If you deal with our banking system honestly and intelligently, you can prosper from it. If you take money from them and don't pay it back they will come out and take what you bought with it.
    Banks get rich from helping HONEST ppl. Ppl who are dishonest hurt banks, themselves, and all of us who pay taxes.
    With capitalism, you can start out the poor son of an immigrant, raised by your grandparents and become President.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kemia View Post
    i feel as though i lost some intelligence on this post
    then ur most likely an ***(censored by bishop), that post was pretty funny.
    Last edited by thephatman; 15-03-2013 at 11:24.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by thephatman View Post
    then ur most likely an ass, that post was pretty funny.
    Do i need to warn you again about your language and insulting other posters? Knock it off. You will not be given another opportunity to break the forums rules.
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    He insulted the former posters intelligence. Where is his warning? Or is it that curses are banned, Your rules should be clearly posted on the main forums page b.c i have no idea what they are or where they are.

  10. #55
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    Don't worry about other posters.
    http://forums.utopia-game.com/showth...ng-combination.
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    oh look i found you "Trolling" (posts only intended to stir up trouble)

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    btw the way that thread is positioned and titled it sounds like a guide for managing a kingdom. Never wanted your opinion on that subject.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by thephatman View Post
    oh look i found you "Trolling" (posts only intended to stir up trouble)
    You have been warned several times. Banned.
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  14. #59
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    Everything in society is to make capitalism survive and seem like it is working... every passing year Marxism is and will be proved the way to survive.

    The Government - Introduces laws which are kinder to corporations. In the UK they are making it easier now for employers to sack employees meaning the working class get even LESSER rights
    Police - They focus on the "low lives" of the working class say whom rob stuff from the corporations shops. It is proven that bankers and certain executives fiddling taxes or bending the law to favor themselves actually cause millions of $/? to get lost from the coffers but due to their bigger tax donations they let them slide
    Schools - The grade system was put in place to just encourage those in **** jobs to not question their roles within society when they got poor grades... they are where they are for failing
    The Media - Nothing to be said here. They are in someones pocket to squash any uprisings and people with no desire to learn the truth are puppets to these lies.

    I am actually reading a book atm called "3rd Degree" by James Patterson and it is an interesting read. It is about a murderer killing higher up executives in companies whereby they have caused mayhem and destruction in countries such as China / India whereby they work minimum wages and die due to deteriorating health for the riches of the western world. It states and it is true, the companies of the west make so much money that IF they were to use just 30% of there profits one year they'd stop starvation in the world for like 5-10 years. It is disgraceful when you think about how true that is.

    Also there is enough oil in the world to make us last for 30 years but the rate they are drilling it out is making it longer and by doing so can charge us ridiculous amounts of money.

    The greed of this world sickens me.
    Last edited by American Badass; 08-04-2013 at 10:12.

  15. #60
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    http://www.minds.com/blog/view/50666...ined-by-police

    The bank ordered the food to be loaded into dumpsters and hauled to a landfill instead of distributed. The people that gathered had to be restrained by police as they saw perfectly good food destroyed.
    Making hungry people watch while food gets destroyed..............

    America, F*ck yeah!
    Last edited by Landro; 08-04-2013 at 22:39.
    This is my province. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    My province is my best friend. It is my life. I must master it as I must master my life.
    My province, without me, is useless. Without my province, I am useless.
    I must attack hard with my province. I must attack harder than my enemy who is trying to pk me. I must pk him before he pk's me. I will...

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