KD Sizes:

[DonJuan]

I have 2 on my island so yes there are some 25 player KDs out there of course...and in no way am I saying they xlog to succeed but many sit for provinces until they fill up.

But you see the argument is that new kingdom production is being stagnated by older/established kingdoms' quest for 25 players...often kicking the same amount of people they recruit in the same age. Those guys end up joining another KDs in which that KD turns over other people who also suck/retire.

If the game stops adding random at 20, then max KD size should be 20...or else all has done is force newer KDs to compete for quality players...which will always be one-sided fight. If established KDs need players they should be able to have random players join and share the same pain that most of the server have to face.

[KuhaN]

lol @ 25 player kds.

[MrCurious]

I have 2 on my island so yes there are some 25 player KDs out there of course...and in no way am I saying they xlog to succeed but many sit for provinces until they fill up.

But you see the argument is that new kingdom production is being stagnated by older/established kingdoms' quest for 25 players...often kicking the same amount of people they recruit in the same age. Those guys end up joining another KDs in which that KD turns over other people who also suck/retire.

If the game stops adding random at 20, then max KD size should be 20...or else all has done is force newer KDs to compete for quality players...which will always be one-sided fight. If established KDs need players they should be able to have random players join and share the same pain that most of the server have to face.

We recruit within own ranks though. Veteran players returning from a break or someone you get referenced into your by other trusted members. Everyone can do this, but you have to be willing to work for it mate, dont just expect a 25 man kd to drop into your lap. It is about networking and building up a network of players you can use to maintain 25 players in the kd.

[Kern]

If the game stops adding random at 20, then max KD size should be 20...or else all has done is force newer KDs to compete for quality players...which will always be one-sided fight. If established KDs need players they should be able to have random players join and share the same pain that most of the server have to face.

The problem is, age after age, the devs don't seem to care about the "most of the server" that isn't the top 30 KDs or so. If you're in a ghetto, you're on your own. So long as the Abs, Bios, Simians, PewPew, etc etc of the Utopian world (or whoever else constantly strikes top 30 or 20) stay happy they're almost always perfectly fine with whatever goes down.

[Bishop]

The problem is, age after age, the devs don't seem to care about the "most of the server" that isn't the top 30 KDs or so. If you're in a ghetto, you're on your own. So long as the Abs, Bios, Simians, PewPew, etc etc of the Utopian world (or whoever else constantly strikes top 30 or 20) stay happy they're almost always perfectly fine with whatever goes down.

Funny. Abs, Bios, Simians, PewPew, etc etc think the opposite.

[Anri]

The problem is, age after age, the devs don't seem to care about the "most of the server" that isn't the top 30 KDs or so. If you're in a ghetto, you're on your own. So long as the Abs, Bios, Simians, PewPew, etc etc of the Utopian world (or whoever else constantly strikes top 30 or 20) stay happy they're almost always perfectly fine with whatever goes down.

I dont support this message at all cause i simply dont get it :)

[Kern]

It's just a general opinion I have than when suggestions are heard and raised, when comments are made, when changes are made, there is a general bias towards the top where everything is much more prominent, rather than towards the bottom where the ghettos are.

Of course, there are probably many reasons for it, one of which is that most of the active people on the boards are from the top KDs to begin with and so they're the ones that are heard the most. I'm probably not seeing everything Bishop and the other dev guys do for this game, so my opinion's probably quite biased. But I seem to perceive very little support for new players of this game, or ghetto players. I see the number of players in the game falling age by age, I see the game structure as heavily biased toward heavy activity if you actually want to compete in this game instead of just bumming around... which is not something that entry level or most ghetto players actually have time for. I see a game geared towards "elitism" and less towards the common player.

Maybe that's just me.

[Bishop]

It's just a general opinion I have than when suggestions are heard and raised, when comments are made, when changes are made, there is a general bias towards the top where everything is much more prominent, rather than towards the bottom where the ghettos are.

Of course, there are probably many reasons for it, one of which is that most of the active people on the boards are from the top KDs to begin with and so they're the ones that are heard the most. I'm probably not seeing everything Bishop and the other dev guys do for this game, so my opinion's probably quite biased. But I seem to perceive very little support for new players of this game, or ghetto players. I see the number of players in the game falling age by age, I see the game structure as heavily biased toward heavy activity if you actually want to compete in this game instead of just bumming around... which is not something that entry level or most ghetto players actually have time for. I see a game geared towards "elitism" and less towards the common player.

Maybe that's just me.

Its just you. The majority of changes recently are geared towards the majority of the players who do not play in the top kingdoms.

[Anri]

Its just you. The majority of changes recently are geared towards the majority of the players who do not play in the top kingdoms.

Agree on that. Problem is they dont understand it.

[goodz]

should disable exploring beyond 600 acres for kingdoms under 25 imo

[DonJuan]

Lets not get off topic here and talk about who benefits from the changes made...those issues arise from exploits from players. This is an imbalance in the game where the well-known is favored over the unknown.

We recruit within own ranks though. Veteran players returning from a break or someone you get referenced into your by other trusted members. Everyone can do this, but you have to be willing to work for it mate, dont just expect a 25 man kd to drop into your lap. It is about networking and building up a network of players you can use to maintain 25 players in the kd.

Lets also not make this about me and you. I've built decent KDs out of ghettos the hard way since years before Jerks were "Elite"....and even then it was easier to land good talent that randomly joined. Now good talent MUST be recruited to fill 25 players since randoms stop coming in after 20.

If 20 players is too small for some, I suggest a magic number of 21 players (20 Indians and 1 chief) or 22 Players (20 Indians and 2 cheifs)...Which should help monarchs even out KD race set ups. The excess players would produce tons of new talent to recruit or even create new kingdoms entirely.

[pyre]

Fill kingdoms to 25. As it stands, kingdoms with below 25 players will rarely if ever look to war anyone in a full KD. Peg everyone at the same level, maybe there will be less war dodging.

[Jotun]

The reason I looked into this was because at the end of the last age, my KD were discussing how many players we should have in our KD.

Make no mistake, my KD is a little ghetto with no bragging rights but in general it has a good team spirit and I like to think the people playing there have fun.
Last age was an ok one for us, with more wars than most other kd's and a fair share of wins. At the end of the age we had a couple of interested players asking to join us, so we had some discussions what would be the "right" size for our KD.

As it turns out, either you stick with being a ghetto or you go full 25 provinces. Going for anything in between just leaves you in the middleground. At least that was our point of view.

The reason I decided to share this, was sort of an input on the KD size debate - though I haven't really made up my mind about this myself.
I also think this reflects on the mindset on the majority of players. Even though there is an easy (and quick?) way of getting to 25 players/full kd, there seems to be little drive or motivation in the game to reach such a size.

[MrCurious]

Lets not get off topic here and talk about who benefits from the changes made...those issues arise from exploits from players. This is an imbalance in the game where the well-known is favored over the unknown.



Lets also not make this about me and you. I've built decent KDs out of ghettos the hard way since years before Jerks were "Elite"....and even then it was easier to land good talent that randomly joined. Now good talent MUST be recruited to fill 25 players since randoms stop coming in after 20.

If 20 players is too small for some, I suggest a magic number of 21 players (20 Indians and 1 chief) or 22 Players (20 Indians and 2 cheifs)...Which should help monarchs even out KD race set ups. The excess players would produce tons of new talent to recruit or even create new kingdoms entirely.

Who said this was between "you" and "me" <-- you just jumped at the chance of telling us how pro you are (or have been most likely?)
Stop jacking the thread Donny. Pwease :P

[newatthis]

different kind of war jotun ... been both of them, had same opinions like u once, but then got bored over some old routine n decided to move to to a kd with 25 provs kd .... u see, no matter how good u are n who u war wit,h ppl will never see u as number one in top waring kd if u're in ghetto ... even if u do reach number one ...

a year ago i had bad opinions against big kd as i saw them boring, bully, non stop pumping, explorer with NO war skill what so ever, bully, n many names n all ... then when i was a monarch in a ghetto with 10 active players then i realized that the joke was on me ... i only had 10 active players n still won 2 wars out of 4??? that's how easy winning wars is in ghetto !!! all i did was crazy land dropping, had mini bank to fund dragon as i didn't have any trusted t/m to do that, then i bragged about skill n waring strat ??? i was embarrassed ... the next age i joined 25 provs kd n i realized how little did i know ... i learned how to rebuild in 5 days without losing honor over land dropping, the power of land (no excessive land dropping or not at all), playing hybrid the right way, playing good HA without being suicidal, n many things ... i learn more in 1 age than i learned all my utopian career ...

as for waring, so far i saw no problem for 25 provs kd to find a war ... it's all up to u n how much wars are u targeting ... in fact last age stripper had 8 wars ... but takes skill to lead n being top waring kd with that size .... but once u got there, it will make u more proud someday ... but hey everyone has to start somewhere ... heck even wsk was 21-22 provs kd when we wared them, remember that jotun ???

maintain that number also hard ... i once joined a 25 provs kd with a really cool king ... a big fans of him but too bad he was so lacking in gaming skills, diplomacy skills, n with ghetto mentality ... so we lost a lot of wars n kd was badly hurt n many players was butt hurt over him ... by the end of age we only had 20 provs n this age i heard they play 22 provs kd ... good for him doe, coz like i said IMHO it takes certain skill n dedication to run 25 provs kd ....

the thing is, when we stay being a ghetto most prolly we get 1-3 exciting wars every age n the rest will be ghetto bashing or boring wars ... but when we're 25 provs kd, we will get exciting wars all the time ... as no ghetto with a right mind will war 25 provs kd ... in ghetto, to win lots of wars activity is almost all we need with some few basic knowledge about buildings n military .... i mean, let's be honest if we have 17 active attackers + 3 semi active t/m + another land dropping, we still can win many wars no matter what we do in ghetto ... in 25 provs kd, most of them are active players so skill plays big role ...

at least that's how i see it n what i experienced by far .... but again it all depends on ur goal, mission, teams, n most importantly what u see as FUN n what ur kd friends think ... without FUN n FRIENDS to have fun with, wars are just wars .... n this game will be boring no matter how u play it