Blackmail for cf's...

[knucksicus]

This is the most ridiculous derailing of a thread I've seen in a while. You Americans are funny.

back on topic:
HoH: did you ever think you were equal allies with the rest of ABS? of course they will box you out when they can.

Some days I even surprise myself.

[Elit]

Its all part from Proteus master plan. So far its not hard for me to see his moves in advance so i'm going to share it now:P
EOA Havoc is going to wave HoH and Rage is going to "retal" for it and wave Havoc with WS. This way Rage can win and put all blame on goodz :P

[Alazne]

When I checked a bit ago, Rage had a bit more land and HoH a bit more nw. Have they been attacking each other? If not, they are still in an alliance. Last I read in the forum, HoH was saying they were Absalom. Are you or are you not Absalom, Hoh? You've been all age long.

Edit: Now Rage has a bit more nw too.

[DHaran]

The off topic conversation has been aborted. Stay on topic or start a new thread on the appropriate board.

[Alazne]

But those of you that are blackmailed into donating acres or giving cf's, there's a very simple solution to it. Raze retals. Take a lesson from Mansoor.... If they hit you, raze them. They lose in the long run and they'll think twice about threatening you in the future. Sure, you lose acres, and you may drop in ranking... but hey, atleast you stood your ground and you didn't let them bully you.

I agree with all this part. From outside, it is clear to see that all those Agreements were no good at all for the kingdoms that signed them. No agreement! War all! :D

[KyGal]

How many times was HoH pricks to other kingdoms this age? Many.

Wow, many times? I really have to reevaulate myself... I apologize to Jamin all the time for snapping and being *****y, to which he says "You weren't"... I give more cf's, and am by far the crappiest diplomat in Utopia. It costs HoH a lot... But there were times this age when I did behave as a prick, I guess you could say...

1) First, when we refused to cf BeastBlood, unless they promised not to back to back war Rage, like they did last age
2) Again, when we forced AMA to cf Rage before we would give them a cf.
3) Again, we did wrong by Simians. But we apologized and we corrected that. And now Anri and Jamin are BFF's... (Scary thought)

Now, some issues that came up that perhaps I thought I was being nice, but wasn't?
4)We noticed Legacy, when they went crying to ABS like little girls, I reinstated that cf.
5) Melee, we noticed, then an hour later, Beast Blood noticed. I knew Melee wanted a final real war, and we weren't in war range. So I reinstated that notice to allow them to have a real war.
6) Cats, we hostiled with them, slowing our age. But the point was we were sick of them robbing us and refusing to cf. Although Elurin and I disagree on if we asked for a cf or not. But I know we have every age, so perhaps I hadn't bothered to this age.
7) We hostile warred Simians, that was their own choosing. We certainly didn't instigate it. But as Pete said, we don't back down either.
8) There was a kd we waved, twice... They never once asked for a cf until after that 2nd wave. But in those terms, I insisted on a cf for a non allied KD that had been taking mutliple hostiles for a week. So I guess that KD can say we were pricks for forcing them to cf another
9) There was an incident early age, where 1 of our guys hit Ezzerland... I suppose we were mean there. But I apologized, wartague and Ezzerland hugged it out.

The only other things that come to mind are the rare randoms we make into hostiles. Every KD does that. But if it helps you sleep better to call us pricks, then by all means. Hell if my 'pussy cat' reputation couldn't use a nice boost.

In the past 4, maybe 5 ages, we have fought our own battles. When someone breaks a deal with us, we kill that province without help. We don't eat waves. We don't back down from fights. And we are even willing to stunt our own growth to prove a point to those who think they can walk all over us... That's just who we are.

I'd be lying if I said the crown wasn't important. But it isn't the most important thing in this game. The people are. That's why we try to be fair with everyone and why we don't make enemies at every turn, because sometimes, friends are nice to have...

[goodz]

Its all part from Proteus master plan. So far its not hard for me to see his moves in advance so i'm going to share it now:P
EOA Havoc is going to wave HoH and Rage is going to "retal" for it and wave Havoc with WS. This way Rage can win and put all blame on goodz :P

Only reason I can think that we would ever eave how is if they broke an eoa nap with us. It seems very unlikely.

Seems they could wave you maybe elit ;)

[Persain]

It has nothing to do with winning the age. It's the fact that every KD we notice, has a 'we'll farm to Rage" or "If you notice us, Rage will farm us" clause If you want to wave a KD, do so
But don't tell them "We will only do it if it looks like our friends are going to gain your acres"

It's blackmail, what I've told you from day 1 was wrong to ever be allowed, plain and simple. Take a chance, call their bluff. Force them to farm out or fight you!

makes how pissy u were about dealing with me a bit less intolerable now huh...at least i made it clear i wanted a fair fight and was just gonna retal war if we couldn't put up a real battle. But either way i find it kinda funny though as this type of "Blackmail" is exactly what ends up happening when there is no competition in the top, It just took time to figure out its a good strategy.

It's a race for the top spot, with 3 ABS and HoH at the top. So yes, it's very competitive, and everyone is scrambling. That's the nature of the game. But the double standard of "You can't black mail us, how dare you"... flipped with "We will blackmail you and in doing so, we'll block our own 3 alliance mates, rather than the anti ABS" should never be accepted

Get some real competition and then maybe things things wont happen. But when Proteus announces that my "plan" to farm is "wont stand" what do u expect kds are going to do. The best idea is to purposely hurt your when u attack them via forcing ABS to double team and feeding acres to your closest competitor. Either that or mass reset. Next time u want acres kygal try feeding off of havoc.

FYI

BTW our sages would have pawned your sages, 2500-4500 bpa kd wide last age. 2500 bpa was our low end.

it was 3500-4500 when my kd took your intell last age. you only had 4-5 people under 3500 and they were all recent explores.

[Palem]

lol, these "blackmail" deals are a really wonderful consequence of alliances not caring about their allies.

If Abs+HoH really wanted to put a stop to these blackmail threats, they could simply identify the kds that are doing it, and gangbang them. Just a set a date, have everyone jump on and just obliterate them with 4 kds. Viola, threat neutralized.

However, that will never happen, because one of them is always in a position to benefit from such a deal, so why would they want to eliminate such a good thing? HoH even won a crown as a result of such things.

You know I <3 u kygal, but mean people and backstabbing and dirty play are part of the game, especially at the top. Making this thread won't accomplish anything. It won't stop blackmailing, in fact it will prolly promote it to kds that didn't think of doing that. Actions speak louder than words. If you want to do something about it, do something about it. I suggest HoH notices rage :)

[Ezzerland]

Silly Palem...

Noticing rage wouldn't benefit HoH. Noticing sanc/havoc might get a little further, guess it depends on how pumped hoh is. But hoh can't do that. If they noticed one kd, they'd be multi-hostiled. Instead, all they can do is vent.

These blackmail deals are nothing imo. Every kingdom in the top makes **** deals like this every day. Just right now we call them notice deals.

[Palem]

Silly Palem...

Noticing rage wouldn't benefit HoH. Noticing sanc/havoc might get a little further, guess it depends on how pumped hoh is. But hoh can't do that. If they noticed one kd, they'd be multi-hostiled. Instead, all they can do is vent.

If they get multi-hostiled they'll really have something to start a forum thread to vent about. I don't think Abs could afford to look that bad. The MA debacle was bad enough, but blatantly multi-hostiling your own ally/former ally would unquestionably put Abs as the bottom of the barrel in every utopians eyes. It would most definitely cost them crowns.

I think HoH could beat Rage if they actually warred, but it was just a 2 day slugfest and not a real war, Rage would definitely win out.

[Ezzerland]

I don't think Abs could afford to look that bad. The MA debacle was bad enough, but blatantly multi-hostiling your own ally/former ally would unquestionably put Abs as the bottom of the barrel in every utopians eyes. It would most definitely cost them crowns.

You got this part all wrong.

[Palem]

Multi-hostiling HoH would make Abs look good?

[flutterby]

Do you think that multi-hostiling will change how people already view Abs?

[AquaSeaFoam]

Kygal,

It seems like you feel entitled to win and that Rage and others should not try and outgrow you because in your mind you "deserve to win". You've had our backs just like we've always had your backs but that doesn't mean we don't have a right to try and win just like in the past when you were able to pass Rage when we were #1 when you farmed Simians. All kingdoms should try and win and you can't expect Rage to just let you win when you wouldn't do the same for us.

1) First, when we refused to cf BeastBlood, unless they promised not to back to back war Rage, like they did last age.

Yes, you had our backs there and it's appreciated, just like we've often had your backs. Certainly us fighting Beastblood (who was the strongest competition at the time) 5x in a row from last age to this age was helpful to our allies. In the end, you still did let them fight us 5x in a row though and after the 5th time they finally cf'd us without any influence from you. But the thought still counts and was appreciated.

2) Again, when we forced AMA to cf Rage before we would give them a cf.

I'm not aware of this, but if it is the case it did not work at all since we had to give AMA 2 free waves and they forced us into an eoa NAP that we didn't want when they caught us out of our beastblood war.

Now, some issues that came up that perhaps I thought I was being nice, but wasn't?
4)We noticed Legacy, when they went crying to ABS like little girls, I reinstated that cf.

I'm not clear on why you chose to reinstate your cf, but I told them they had to deal with you 1v1 however they saw best and Rage would not interfere so however you did deal with them was by your own choice.

5) Melee, we noticed, then an hour later, Beast Blood noticed. I knew Melee wanted a final real war, and we weren't in war range. So I reinstated that notice to allow them to have a real war.

Convenient how you leave out the part about you choosing to instead go after Mansoor to block Rage from fighting them. It'd have been hard for you to fight Mansoor and Melee both at the same time to block Rage from both.


You've been doing all you can to gain land wherever you can and to block Rage from gaining land as best as you can. Rage is doing the same as you. It's just completion. Rage admittedly has more advantages than you by having so much sci. It's hard to retal war against a kingdom with 50%+ war sci, so it's easier for us to come out ahead in our fights. We also had a spread that was positioned better for growth when we were smaller. The age isn't over and you still might win if your move on beastblood pays off. Time will tell.

Good luck.