OME/ME Formula

[DeDLySMuRF]

So I was wanting to try and figure out if a Ruby Dragon would negate the 10% OME boost for Humans in war. I checked the guide, but I do not see where the -8% ME is calculated into the formula.

Does anyone know if the -8% is calculated into the Base ME, OME or Modified Offense portion?

[Zauper]

I don't know how the wiki describes it.

I believe it is calculated like this:

BASE ME (100+payFX+ruby+sci+gbp)*OME(generals+TGs+honor)

I'm fairly confident the wiki is wrong.

[Cry0]

Without running the numbers I generally consider ruby as a dragon to burn in order to break higher def provinces or run with a wave in order to maximize hits into a target.

If you are going against a KD where human attackers are the concern I would aim to stick an emerald on them.. the losses on that will kill their offense, especially if you consider how leveraged the offense of a human running high TG, ME science and possibly war personality is.

[noobium]

it is:

Base ME = WageME * science * Dragon * gbp
OME = (Base ME + TG + generals + honor) * fana
DME = (Base ME + Forts) * mp * fana * plague

Not sure how warrior's bonus is calculated (additive or multiplicative). Also not 100% on whether plague is multiplicative or additive, but I think it multiplies - should be easy to test.

Human's bonus is OME*1.1, which does not show in throne or council.

WageME is ranged between 93.6% and 107.6% (roughly), fading in over time. The details of this and GBP can be found in the wiki, but I am certain that those factors all multiply with each. Science is confirmed to multiply. (2)

You shouldn't look at dragons as negating bonuses or use them defensively anyway - no matter what, the human gets 10% more offense in war, and someone who isn't human does not get this bonus.

Ruby drake is good against humans anyway, though dragons should be more about playing to your own kingdom's advantages than compensating for disadvantages - i.e., don't send sapphire if you have weaker t/m power than whoever you're fighting, because the value of the dragon is severely limited. Humans don't have any really dramatic sustainability issues - arguably better sustain considering their soldiers and offspecs are effectively 10% stronger in war, and they have tog. Sapphire against humans would make sense if you have quality t/m power.

Emerald dragon is pretty **** in oop wars unless the war is already won and you're just trying to pad acres - in oop wars native economy and drafting are so much stronger and acres in the short term are pretty useless. Emerald as a defensive dragon in oop war isn't all that great so long as there are weak defense provinces. Gold is probably the most effective dragon for early wars, either because the target is in an economic build and you want to delay their funding and training and force a slay, or because they have few economic buildings and were relying on having war buildings to overpower their target. Gold is only effective if you know it's going to either be tanked, or slaying it makes the recipient too vulnerable.

edit:
wiki is wrong about a lot of things. i did not test science yet (no good opportunities to do so), but i should be able to test soon. i know for certain that generals, honor, and TG all add to OME, and do not multiply. This means that TG are more valuable for provinces with low wages, and less valuable for provinces with high honor, and less valuable for provinces that send multiple generals on an attack. if science adds rather than multiplies, then by late-age provinces with high military science should have less use for TG as well.
spells multiply OME or DME (known for certain), and dragon affects base ME. i assumed that all global ME modifiers (dragon, science, gbp, wagerate) multiply with each other.

[SillyRabbit]

The ruby dragon acts as a modifier to both OME and DME. It multiples your current OME/DME by a factor of 0.92.
TGs, honour, increased wages, military efficiency science, GBP, racial bonuses (like the human in war), the spell fanaticism, and ruby dragon are all modifiers to your OME. Forts and the spell MP are modifiers on your DME

It works like this | OME = base offensive efficiency * TG * honour * wages * sci * GBP * racial bonus * fanaticism * ruby dragon
I'll make up some numbers here, OME (129%) = 100 * 1.10 (10% TG) * 1.02 (lord) * 1.079 (200% wages for 48hr) * 1.05 (5% sci) * 1.10 (human in war) * 0.92 (ruby)
If you didn't factor in the ruby, OME would be 140%.
So while the ruby advertises a 8% drop in military efficiency, as you can see from the example, you would drop this provs efficiency from 140% to 129%.

Using addition generals are additive, once the multiplicative bonuses are calculated, +3% is added for each additional general. So in my above example with dragon active, sending 2x gens is 132 OME, 3x is 135 and 4x is 138% OME.

[DeDLySMuRF]

The ruby dragon acts as a modifier to both OME and DME. It multiples your current OME/DME by a factor of 0.92.
TGs, honour, increased wages, military efficiency science, GBP, racial bonuses (like the human in war), the spell fanaticism, and ruby dragon are all modifiers to your OME. Forts and the spell MP are modifiers on your DME

It works like this | OME = base offensive efficiency * TG * honour * wages * sci * GBP * racial bonus * fanaticism * ruby dragon
I'll make up some numbers here, OME (129%) = 100 * 1.10 (10% TG) * 1.02 (lord) * 1.079 (200% wages for 48hr) * 1.05 (5% sci) * 1.10 (human in war) * 0.92 (ruby)
If you didn't factor in the ruby, OME would be 140%.
So while the ruby advertises a 8% drop in military efficiency, as you can see from the example, you would drop this provs efficiency from 140% to 129%.

Using addition generals are additive, once the multiplicative bonuses are calculated, +3% is added for each additional general. So in my above example with dragon active, sending 2x gens is 132 OME, 3x is 135 and 4x is 138% OME.

This is how I calculated it as well. And while sending an Emerald may seem like the best option, the Ruby is the best trick against Humans and I'll explain why. By mid/late age, a Human/Sage should have pumped his ME and BE books. With the Sage bonus the Human/Sage should be able to get to about +35% ME and be able to run @85% BE fully drafted.


So lets take a look at 2 results: OME = base offensive efficiency * TG * honour * wages * sci * GBP * racial bonus * fanaticism * ruby dragon

Without Ruby: OME (202.3%) = 100 * 1.191 (15% TG @ 85% BE) * 1.06 (Viscount) * 1.079 (200% wages for 48hr) * 1.35 (35% sci) * 1.10 (human in war) * 1
With Ruby: OME (186.1%) = 100 * 1.191 (15% TG @ 85% BE) * 1.06 (Viscount) * 1.079 (200% wages for 48hr) * 1.35 (35% sci) * 1.10 (human in war) * 0.92 (ruby)

This Human just lost 16.1% OME from that Ruby. But that is not the only loss. By mid/late age, the Human/Sage should be running an all leet military going into war. Replacing lost off/def with specs. Because Ruby effects ME, it will also drop the Human's defense by at least 8%. In reality it will be alot higher because of the way ME books are calculated. It will be more closer to about 13% drop to DME. So now your looking at 16.1% drop in OME and about 13% drop to DME. So lets say that human still needs to be able to break a guy that would require him to send the offense he had before the ruby, so he has to make up for that 16.1% OME loss by sending more leetz. Now he has even less leetz at home for defense, which is compounded by the significant drop to DME even more. Now that Human who could have easily remained UB with that Emerald can now be easily chained.


The morale of the story is... You can combat an Emerald dragon as a Human/Sage by using Hospitals and retraining with specs during war. You have no way to make up for the huge loss you'll take from the -8% ME hit by the ruby because of how the formula's are calculated.

[bombdigie]

Wages and Military Science is added to forts or training grounds. Then all other bonuses/penalties are multiplied.

200% Wages (7.1%)
34.42% higher defensive efficiency
+7.0% Military Efficiency
5% Minor Protection

1.4952*1.05= 1.56996

Defensive Military Effectiveness 157.0%

Confirmed

[noobium]

Just tested after leaving wages at 200% for 36 hours without being hit - science is confirmed to multiply with base BE, for those who care. (Actually a rather substantial difference with high gbp.)

The only parts of what I wrote up there that need to be confirmed are Warrior's bonus (new this age) and Plague (haven't been arsed to check but should be easy enough). Everything else I have confirmed many times over.

Wages do not add or subtract to or from base ME.

[LoRD_SaMPuaN]

I don't know how the wiki describes it.

I believe it is calculated like this:

BASE ME (100+payFX+ruby+sci+gbp)*OME(generals+TGs+honor)

I'm fairly confident the wiki is wrong.

science is multiplicative with wages, we have tested that, i believe gbp is also multiplicative too - but we havent tested ruby yet, hadnt used it for far too long :(

ive corrected some of the formulas on the page, please let me know if it needs further correction.. warrior and human bonuses need confirmation - i believe warrior bonus is additive & speculation is human bonus is multiplicative..