ask noobium

[noobium]

1. How would you distribute 1000 bpa amongst the first 4 sciences (alchemy, tools, population and farm)?

2. Given the stated multipliers of 0.65 for pop science and 0.5 for military science, is it right to say that the ideal ratio of pop science to military science is always 1 pop science : [(0.5/0.65) * % military]^2 troops, that is to say at 50% military troops (not including thieves and wizards), the ratio should 36 : 1 ?

1. If I had 1000 bpa, a large part of that is going to mil/crime/channeling. Those are the most valuable sciences by end-game, since their bonuses stay with your province regardless of how pumped you are.
The really important thing to do is know when to raise particular sciences, rather than giving someone a set ratio and telling them to stick to that no matter what. It also depends on whether you are playing in a growth kingdom, warring kingdom, or casual kingdom, and whether you're starting early age.
Finally, of course it depends on race and function, though all sciences are going to be useful for most provinces.

If I have no particular idea what I'm going for and I have 1000 bpa around YR6 or so (and assuming of course I'm in Generic Warring Kingdom), I'd probably have 150 bpa in everything except food, and 100 bpa in food. For a warring kingdom, econ sciences don't have much value after 200 bpa or so, and crime/channeling are important for every province (except non-Rogue Undead). If I'm Avian, Orc, or Undead, I'd get military science early and learn attack provs that would prioritize housing, assuming that is possible. If I'm Dwarf, Tools and Food have a lot more value than for anyone else, more than their racial attributes would suggest (because if you're playing Dwarf effectively, you're taking full advantage of BE manipulation). Earlier in the age, alchemy and housing have more value than later on, and by YR10-11 a warring kingdom should just go exclusively for mil/crime/channeling (and maybe tools). However, 1000 bpa at mid-age is about a good point to start levelling out your sciences.

If you can though, it is better to bank science books for crime and channeling science, and dump them only once you have a war. That way, you minimize how many books you lose, and you have the choice to not raise crime/channeling if there is no need to.

Also note that in order to compare your provinces' viability in the long term, total books is more important than bpa. Acres (at least at warring tier) are volatile, and 1000 bpa at 1k acres is no good if you win and grow. While you still need to pay attention to bpa if you grow lots, even if you're small you should be looking at 2.5mil to 3mil books by late age (and that's a relatively small level; but these days there are so many people who haven't learned how to science, and thus fewer learn targets. :( ) If you grow past 2000 acres you need more, and you would probably want 1000 bpa by late age if at all possible.

2. No. Mil science is effective at all times, housing science is only effective when your province is at or above its maximum population. Housing science is important for economic reasons more than overall military efficiency. Again, if I'm in Generic Warring Kingdom, I probably want equal investment in both, but if I'm Avian or Orc military science has an even higher priority. There are plenty of provinces that will pump housing for me, after all.

Usually, I get my housing books from war win science and learns, and spend most of my invested books on other categories. It depends on when though - after the first war win is a good time to get good alchemy/housing sciences, especially if your win came in YR1 or early YR2. Once you get about 80 bpa in housing, it's a good idea to level out the others before your next war, then use the second war win reward to jack up housing again. After that depends on where you want to go, whether you have time to raise science or want to go straight to warring again.

The early levels of science are the most important, and there is a lot of room for varied and interesting strategies in the early age.

Also - sweet Jesus, run at least active science from freeze time onward. If you run minimal science oop you are just shooting yourself in the foot. My preference is accelerated-intensive or better, but sometimes investing in troops and growth is more important.

[noobium]

What is the url to ask Realest?

rtfop

[JackRabbitSlim]

Another question on Halfer issues:

When a Halfer attacks a Dragon with Soldiers, and he has the spell Aggression cast, does the Soldier attacks count as 3 Offensive points, or 2?

The way the spell explanation sounds, it would be 3.
It says that once aggression is cast, all offensive actions happen with a +1 Offensive power and -1 Defensive power to the Soldier. So, to me, and I want this to be correct sooooo bad, it looks like the Soldiers would be at 3/1 instead of their normal 2/2. But I have asked a few players and have gotten both answers. I would like it from someone that has actually done it.

So can you please answer this question noobium??

[noobium]

Halfling soldiers always count at 2 (or 1?), otherwise aggressive soldiers for any race would count as 2pt. That would make sense anyway - might double-check the dragon slaying page next time I play a race with aggression.

[JackRabbitSlim]

I'm sorry Mate, but your answer has confused me even more. You said, "Halfling Soldiers always count as 2(or 1?), otherwise aggressive Soldiers for any race would count as 2pt." You are incorrect. Halfer Soldiers attack at 3 points when Aggression is cast. I know that to be true. This is from the Utopian Guide:

Aggression:
Available to: Halflings, Faeries
Effect: Turns all your soldiers into 2/0 (Halfling: 3/1) troops before modifiers.
Duration: max 24 days.
Cast Message: Our soldiers will fight with unique aggression for X days!
Mystic Advisor Message: Our soldiers will fight with unique aggression for X days!

My original question was about Halfling Soldiers Attacking a Dragon. I have been told they attack at 2 points normally and at 3 points, when Aggression is cast. But then I have been told that Aggression makes no difference when attacking a Dragon. I was hoping to get the correct answer from you. But if you did not know that Halfer Soldiers hit at 3 points when Aggression is cast, in normal combat, I doubt you would know the correct answer to my question.

Maybe there is someone reading this that would know the answer. I hope so. We are about to go into a War and face a Dragon and I was hoping to have the answer by then. If not, I guess I will simply attack the Dragon with 1 Soldier at first, with Aggression cast, and find out for myself. God I really hope Halfer gets the extra point when hitting Dragons! That will make this War go by so much better!

:o)

[ZenithSun]

y do u get so mad sometimes?

[DrKrieger]

Jack a Halfling with Agro who attacks a dragon with soldiers still count as 2 hp...

What i think noob was getting at is that if the halfers soldier did more damage with Agro then you'd expect agro to affect every race's soldiers when attacking dragon... which i assume it does not.

[Rampage]

Hi noobium! I'm quite new to Utopia, so I've been reading through the forums a lot and seem to find your comments and knowledge very helpful! What draft rate do you think is sustainable and efficient during war as an Undead Tactician in general? Branching on from this, what do you find is an acceptable BE and PPA with this rate?

[Persain]

Rampage, theres no set answer to BE, PPA, and DR its going to vary consantly, my kd sets DR to 70 % early age 80% late age on pure attackers.

@ noobium why do u dislike econ heavy setups like undead merchant when used kd wide.

[noobium]

Hi noobium! I'm quite new to Utopia, so I've been reading through the forums a lot and seem to find your comments and knowledge very helpful! What draft rate do you think is sustainable and efficient during war as an Undead Tactician in general? Branching on from this, what do you find is an acceptable BE and PPA with this rate?

In war, forget about static province sustainability unless you are a t/m or a bank. In war provinces are way volatile... with experience you can learn how to be sustainable and effect at any size (or at least, as much as possible). For an attacker though, your peasants are usually going to be garbage, especially as undead.

I would say then that your goal as an undead in war is to enter with as much drafted as possible, and enough gc banked to pay wages and fund dragon for the forseeable future. You gain more of an economic edge in war by destroying your enemies more than sustaining your own economy, at least during the first two days (and usually a lot longer). Building efficiency can be improved by building homes, or better using building rotation so that you have high BE when you start hitting into hostile. BTW, Undead works way better when they give button rather than receive, because you are in control of who and when you fight.

If you're idling as an undead, you are probably going to want to attack often for conversions, science, and to make use of that -75% losses bonus. The important thing is that you make sure you're always in a position to follow up attacks from others in your kingdom, so even with -75% losses, you will need to train new offspec in order to open/continue chains at your new size (if you use landgrabs). OOW building efficiency and ppa is not terribly relevant, because your undead doesn't need much money to keep doing what it does, and what you need is better acquired through plundering than keeping your DR low / building banks (or, feeding gc targets to your kingdom, who can steal for you).

So the answer is "as high as you can draft", even more than it is for other races.

I know a big stumbling block for new players is that they think they need maximized BE, but you would rather have the trained troops or wizards more in most cases. Homes are problematic without a kingdom-level economic plan, and even when building Homes the purpose is to maximize population/acre and raw power, rather than specifically aiming for maximum BE (though the BE boost is noticeable). In war, your building efficiency will usually recover even if you are chained, unless your BE was artificially high when you started.

The big difference then is whether you are playing for growth or playing in a kingdom that looks for war constantly, and usually the latter will be the case at the game's lower levels.

[noobium]

Rampage, theres no set answer to BE, PPA, and DR its going to vary consantly, my kd sets DR to 70 % early age 80% late age on pure attackers.

@ noobium why do u dislike econ heavy setups like undead merchant when used kd wide.

I don't dislike econ heavy setups at all. The problem is that Undead Merchant is not econ heavy, because Undead economy is crap. Dwarves are a much better econ race, whether they pick Merchant or not. Even Orc/Merchant is okay. Undeads face the problem of not only having vulnerable peasants and vulnerable troops, but running too many UD is bad anyway.

The really strong economic core of a warring kingdom is in it's t/ms anyway, given that Human is basically unplayable in warring kingdoms. If there is an economic pick for attacker, it's Dwarf/Cleric due to freebuild and sustainability outstripping the standard Merchant bonuses.

[UtopiaExpert]

but running too many UD is bad anyway.

Agreed. You need Orcs.

[Rampage]

Okay so continuing on from that topic and into Science: what is the category I should be prioritising here as an Attacker, given I started late in the age (Yr9-10)? I have put high amounts in Tools/Military (60-70 bpa) {you stated high BE wasn't that important}, and then even amounts in Housing, Crime and Channeling (15-25 bpa). These numbers are very diluted because I grew 400-500 acres in the last two days. Also how do our priorities change depending on the point in the age? I assume Food and Income are very good early in the age for Races other than Undead.

[neanderthal]

Agreed. You need Orcs.

It's funny. 8 of the top 10 kds on the war charts disagree. Others, yes they do have Orcs but they are secondary to Undeads. The vast majority at the top of the chart's heavy attackers are undead.

[UtopiaExpert]

It's funny. 8 of the top 10 kds on the war charts disagree. Others, yes they do have Orcs but they are secondary to Undeads. The vast majority at the top of the chart's heavy attackers are undead.

Just imagine how good they'd have been had they run Orcs instead of Undeads. Who cares about the war-charts anyways?