Learn n' Plunder

[DonJuan]

If, per say, you wanted to "move up the charts" (which charts I assume you mean land/nw) you would need to gain land to more easily move up since we can say land produces more to NW than books of science or actual gc resource right?

Wouldn't it better serve a kingdom to have a mix of both land gains AND learn/plunder so that the kingdom can move into a Fort stance after a few days of Peace to rebuild on?

Especially if we want to say that typically kingdoms fresh out of war will have a unbalance of land sizes among big provs and small/chained provs...but instead of encouraging smaller attacker to grow in land OOW and come up to the KD Acre Median, they prefer to enforce no land gain policy or even lower kd acre median size (land drop) and staying among targets with poor science levels.

For less organized ghettos (unlike yours 2Utopian) it seems to me the wrong message to give and puts nubs, either learning the game or re-learning the game, in a position where they can be hit more often and will also slow their learning progression because of the losses.

[Palem]

Bro tell me how its skill finding a province with a lot of gold? How is that skillfull at all? All there is you hope you find a good plunder or you are using gold farms.

While it's not necessarily skill, tracking kingdoms in war and waiting for them to jump out so you can take their gc stocks isn't exactly luck.

[Korp]

While it's not necessarily skill, tracking kingdoms in war and waiting for them to jump out so you can take their gc stocks isn't exactly luck.

Yea, cause all provinces that gets ooeow are always loaded with millions and millions :P

[Palem]

They're more likely to have gc than a random province. It's the same idea as counting cards in blackjack. There's a reason casinos frown upon it lol

[Korp]

They're more likely to have gc than a random province.


You're basically saying that counting cards in blackjack isn't improving your odds lol

Yes, its more likely but no guarantee. 2utopia claimed there was no luck involved on skill, I am just saying there is no skills in Utopia that would guarantee you a good plunder since you are dependent on a lot of factors you cant control yourself. Hence, luck is involved as well.

[Palem]

Yes, but you can minimize the "luck" factor.

If I track kd wars, I will find more good plunders than someone that isn't.

Also, I changed my post :(

[2Utopian]

what palem mentions and other search techniques will help you find gc much more frequently then those who don't know how to look. It's a skill, it doesn't guarantee you always find a great pillage, it guarantees you find more good ones over the course of the age then unskilled players. @korp you are truly the crown prince of pedantry on these boards.

[Robar1980]

Bro tell me how its skill finding a province with a lot of gold? How is that skillfull at all? All there is you hope you find a good plunder or you are using gold farms.

There are ways to increase your chances If you look for plunders in the right way.
If you search the way palem does, it's highly possible you find a very decent plunder.

[Korp]

what palem mentions and other search techniques will help you find gc much more frequently then those who don't know how to look. It's a skill, it doesn't guarantee you always find a great pillage, it guarantees you find more good ones over the course of the age then unskilled players. @korp you are truly the crown prince of pedantry on these boards.

Yes, you know what to look for a potential good plunder, but there is no skill in the world that will gurantee that said provinces is having a ****load of gold. So, still a mixture of skill and luck.

[Guilty Conscience]

Korp we understand. You need luck when you lack skill.

[citadela01]

.plunders

.donate

[Robar1980]

Yes, you know what to look for a potential good plunder, but there is no skill in the world that will gurantee that said provinces is having a ****load of gold. So, still a mixture of skill and luck.

I rather think its bad luck when you don't find one than the other way around. When a kingdom drops out of eowcf there is a very high chance someone didn't train yet or there is someone just having too much money to spend. I've been using this technique for ages and ages and I always find provinces with millions to plunder. Only issue is the ever dropping number of kingdoms which means there isn't always a kingdom available dropping out of eowcf to search through. Another issue is your own size which could limit the options of course. But we don't wander around in the top 25 so we tend to have enough options.

[DonJuan]

I think its unfortunate trend to see that many newer players are actually discourage to grow in land because others instill their own fears from highly organized kingdoms...so they emphasize the learns and plunders more than actually gaining land.

Thus there are more options from provinces sizes 0 acres to 1200 acres than say among 1200+ acres. Ofc many Top Kingdoms don't always need plunder because the divide is so great in "status along the class line" that their players can just sit in OOW with 50% wages and 40% draft if they wanted to and bank GC and Science (if diplo is set up correctly).

There are a few ballsy people from more organized KD who will notice and plunder a top KD non-bank for 3-5m gold in one shot...but depending on the KD there may be repercussions for doing so and the trend looks to continue.

If anything I would like to change people's mindset of trying to slow growth to control/shape their factors of survivability to win their ghetto wars rather than try to find strength and power in size. Thats one problem that feeds into another one; Top Land KDs, who are almost invisible to the rest of the server except between themselves, use diplo'd CFs to control/shape their factors of survivability to win their top wars rather than try to find strength and power in imminent threats and pre-emptive strikes.

If there were more nubs that were less afraid to grow and compete...then top kds would be less inclined to diplo CF and always be on the ready....but thats a convo for another day!

[pathetic sheep]

I think its useless for kingdoms to encourage their players to exclusively learn or plunder OOW. I think the reasoning is misguided as typically the ghetto leaderships want the activity factor from their mates but do not want to them to grow fat and become a target.

Its obvious that science learns are redundant so early in the game tho I still see nubs swear up and down that they can get up to 700 bpa by age's end with pure learns.

Plunders are also a lil dicey but there may be a chance you can get lucky and find some inactive who is sitting on +1.5m...but again I still see nubs happy to see 600k GC in a plunder without even factoring the cost of replacing elites lost.

700 BPA in one week is a challenge. But if you also get hit and lose land it is not hard. 28 attacks averaging 25k books is 700,000 books. That is only double taps with each log in. You might get 4 or 5 hits when lucky other times just 1. You need a few plunders to replace lost military. When plunder is more abundant use rushed science.

It is probably better strategy for a new province to pump up a positive trade balance. If you learn attack you end up becoming a good learn target.

Learn attack has a base gain of 9.375%. So 11 learn attacks should get you to a typical level of science.

I think its unfortunate trend to see that many newer players are actually discourage to grow in land because others instill their own fears from highly organized kingdoms...so they emphasize the learns and plunders more than actually gaining land.

Rethink that. Suppose you want them at 1000 acres with "normal decent science". If (s)he tries to grow first then (s)he is stuck at 1000 acres with crap science and gets beaten up frequently. That will mean wasting your time retaliating and spending effort fixing the damage. Contrast that starting with learn attacks on provinces that were at 1000 acres for (insert current year) and are now abandoned or got chained in wars. After a few days of learns/plunders you have a good base of science and a solid trade surplus. (S)He can rocket form 400 or 500 acres to 1000 acres and fill in the acres with aid. It is a much better way to get into the game late in the age.

Some veteran players never get experience with this. It will not work year 0. It will work just fine now and will get better until age end.

[StratOcastle]

Some people are just good at stuff.

1- I've known a few plunder hawks, but one of my favorite type of players are SN decipherers.
2- I love heroic t/ms: t/ms ask what you need and get it.
3- and monarchs that give freedom to the right players.