there's your problemOriginally Posted by cRs
there's your problem
I would be inclined to agree with Flogger and Tetley here. Fluffy are the ones that weaseled their way out two (three?) times now. They tell us a date, which is before their cf with pyro ends, and lo and behold a tick before we are supposed to wave, they are in war. I certainly would not trust a word Fluffy has to say. Of course Pyro would want to war them if they could, I think anyone would in thier position.
Let me clarify a few things.
1) Fluffy is no more a friend/enemy than WSK is to me. If Fluffy was a friend they wont have waved me for 15% of my acres and been overbearing (in my opinion) in the negotiations for the CF back in year 7.
I eventually signed a Y12 Deal with Fluffy. I pushed for Y11 because I feared there might not be enough time in the age to play out the hostile and get our revenge, but Fluffy told me they do not want to stack CFs. This gives me the impression that we were the only ones who were going to engage them in Y12.
2) WSK was still part of our "group" back then in Y7 when Fluffy waved me and knew I was very upset with Fluffy with the way they did it and the way diplo was held, and my intentions of regrouping and seeking revenge.
3) Fast forward 3 weeks and that was Y10+, CP waved me, I pushed button, won the war, and ended at an effective land size that was about 11-12k smaller than WSK (meaning if I pooled up and WSK pooled up, I'd be 12k smaller). I knew WSK was actively looking for a fight, and so was I. And I knew Fluffy was probably going to be busy in a fight which might interfere with my noticing Fluffy and punishing them before age end. (They ended up warring TBB).
4) Hence I was "willing" to forgo the option to seek revenge on Fluffy in exchange for a proper fight where I can teach my new people how to pump and prepare and then take the opportunity to set the lineup for the new age. That's where the claims that CRS says we proposed to landdrop WSK cows in exchange for a war came about. I asked WSK, since you're effectively 12k bigger, how about give us 4-5k land, and we war each other in 1 week. Obviously the higher up you give the land to us, the less we can suffice with ending up taking. All I made clear was that had to be pool acres, I did not say that had to be cow acres. So I dont know where you got your claim I would only fight you if you landdrop your cows.
I offered the same proposal to Pandas but I knew it was going to be much harder to arrange with Pandas because I would have had to take much more land from Pandas to equalise and have a fight. They were about 20k larger and I asked if they were willing to give up 10k, which they declined. So my thoughts were WSK declined a good opportunity for both KDs to engage in a friendly and competitive fight and improve themselves. Given we were 12k smaller and had so many PKs after the Awar, I thought that was a very fair offer to ask for 4-5k acres and fight in a week.
5) Since that didn't work out, I said fine, now all I can do is to prepare for Fluffy and pray age doesnt end that soon. I kept close tabs on the Fluffy-TBB fight and during their EOWCF, I stayed up during possible periods where I thought they might leave EOWCF early (for example 60h mark, 72h mark, 84h mark) to see if there was a chance they left eowcf early. I also got the whole KD to alert me if they did so, just to be able to send my notice fair and square and take my fight/revenge. Fluffy ended up taking max EOWCF and I ended up issuing a notice at the same time as WSK.
6) So I asked Fluffy what's up, since they "said during our diplo" we were the only party to expire in Y12. Now there's a double notice. I asked Angels, do you actually want to war WSK? Most people and I believe WSK was aware too, knew that Angels was hospitalised with a serious illness and was under heavy medications. He told me he was in no shape to fight either me or WSK, but pointed out clearly I looked less threatening based on land spread and size. So being the nice guy that I was, I offered the proposal, how about I war WSK instead, if they are willing, and you can get some rest? I made this proposal to WSK while being 9k acres Kd-wide, and a 10k cow province down. I said this looks like a good chance for both kds to practise a good fight and you still have a pretty significant advantage, so why not spare Fluffy the burden and embarrassment of a farmwar and fight someone more prepared and willing to fight you? WSK declined and said we'll fight Fluffy and afterwards if you're willing I will fight you too. That to me was ridiculous and WSK just wanted to bully its way to a farmwar, and not "we dont do double deals". How is this a double deal?
7) We have acted in good faith to both WSK and Fluffy (at least for WSK up until the point I agreed to war Fluffy on Fluffy's terms). When you act in good faith sometimes, just sometimes, it leads the other party to want to deal with you more nicely. Fluffy thought we were more gentlemanly in the whole episode and asked if we would war them on their terms instead, being an instant hostile and button push on a set date.
This to me was giving up a huge part of my advantage since my advantage was mainly in my higher prepped provinces and gold stacks being able to play out a better hostile and winning the whole conflict by a larger margin, and not forgetting the fact that Fluffy had a KD full of humans while I had more than half my KD dwarves, elves and avians and orc. Pushing immediately instantly rewards them with extra Offense.
8) If a KD wanted to dodge another KD and wanted to fight me and I was looking for a fight as well, why would I say no if I wasn't very close with that KD? I would take the fight up. If it were BB planning to hostile KD X, and KD X wanted to dodge by fighting me, then I would say no. From my perspective, WSK lost me from the moment they said no to fighting me while being 9k bigger and 1 cow up.
If WSK wants to fight, there are plenty of options for sure as stated by other posters. I saw Pandas would be willing to tango. I would be willing to tango. I can even commit to taking Honor bonus if I win, and fight WSK 24h after my EOWCF (just so I can go to fort to train and swap builds rather than inside EOWCF without the bonuses).
PyroManiaCs Monarch
#Pyromaniacs
A sociopath can be defined as a person who has Antisocial Personality Disorder. This disorder is characterized by a disregard for the feelings of others, a lack of remorse or shame, manipulative behavior, unchecked egocentricity, and the ability to lie in order to achieve one's goals. Sociopaths can be dangerous at worst or simply very difficult to deal with, and it's important to know if you've found yourself with a sociopath, whether it's someone you're dating or an impossible coworker. If you want to know how to spot a sociopath, then you have to pay careful attention to what the person says or does.
JUST GONNA LEAVE THIS RIGHT HERE
Are you trying to tell us something?
The ones at work(yes multiples) are worse so this is an easy part of the game for me.
love that thick mahogany back with no belly carve or anything...pure thick wood ! The thing ROCK is made of !
________
Weed bowls
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...+say&FORM=VDRE
Asking another kd to give land to you before they war you is a little odd.
...
As regards the general issue, dodging is particularly frustrating in cases when you've agreed to war them, and is closer to a dealbreak... if fluffy said clearly they'd war WSK, it's pretty lame to war pyro 2 ticks ahead of time. Still, Pyro didn't break any deals. WSKs anger at pyro still seems misplaced.
The Jerks.
I see a lot of talk and hate, and im sure some of it is grounded and i dont blame WsK for being angry but let me clarify a few things.
Earlier age Flogger + BB threatened to PK fluffy for me posting on forum and noticing Panda+waving Pyro, bit of background to that.
We waved pyro as we had no cf deal and they were exploring past us during aggressive stance, yes awar had officially ended 8(9?) days earlier, 3 days after awar ended nesta came to me to ask for war, deal would be 1 week + 72hrs to prepare, i declined that offer as i had other plans which i told nesta, the kingdom i had in mind went hostile 4 days later (12hrs before we could officially notice them), and my kd had trained up, Pyro had gone from 69k to 81k while we were at 72k acres, so we waved them and yes me and nesta/pyro had been friendly previous ages but not to the extend of working together, i thought this wave was perfectly legit, but i dont blame pyro for being upset as i had previously turned their war offer down. (caught them on the bed so to speak), BB/Flogger and alliance wasnt happy with this, but Nesta and me agreed to a YR12+72hrs as we did not want to stack CFs (at this time we had none others).
Fast forward a bit
We noticed Panda 11hrs before they left EoWCF with Crazies, a deal which had been tried to be renegotiated, but cappo felt we had lied to get a CF during awar (which we hadnt but it was miscommunication, which is all cleared up with cappo). Flogger came and demanded i gave the 11hrs extra to Panda, i said i would give 4, in the end we dragged hostile both of us for 2 days so that was pointless anyway, WsK felt we had dodged them by picking to fight Panda who were more our size and a much better target for us at the time, WsK felt we had prearranged this with Panda which was not true, but WsK left alliance because of it. Flogger/BB threatened to PK/raze my KD for the notice on Panda despite noone from Panda complaining and i felt we had a nice war which we both enjoyed. At the start of this war is when WsK was renegotiated to YR12 too, i did that to leave me with options should we grow or get smaller, im sure people understand the reasoning behind this.
War with Panda ended and BB/Flogger wanted b2b with Panda or we needed to give 25k acres to Panda additionally to the war win bonus they got for EoACF from BB and Panda, I reluctantly agreed to 15k acres from the original 25k.
Now fast forward 4 days and Fluffy coming straight out of war with Panda(EoWCF) and noticing TBB, at this point TBB had grown a bit bigger then us in acres (TBB also part of BB alliance), Panda wanted 10k before war and 5k after but agreed to only take 4710, so we still owed 10290 to Panda, with Panda only taking the 4710 it left us equal with TBB in acres after exploring some pool, so we engaged them when 72hr notice ran out and hostile dragged a fair bit, we won the war in the hostile i felt, but they pressed button and war was on, we ended up winning but with me in hospital/intensive care, for most of the actual war.
I came home just as we left EoWCF with WsK and Pyro both noticing us, i agreed to war WsK and prepared for this, but Panda/alliance felt this would be a total farmout and therefore wanted their acres if we chose WsK leaving us unable to war either WsK or Pyro, Pyro offered WsK to take our spot which was declined, i renegotiated with Pyro, you can call it what you want, but from my point of view i was forced, by the acres Flogger/BB forced me to give to Panda, I dont blame Panda for wanting the acres or WsK for being pissed, WsK removed our top for Pyro, which cost us any possible chance we might have had, which fair enough from their point of view we probs deserved it.
Flogger pm'd me just yesterday when cRs posted logs:
Flogger: "you telling wsk u gonna get me next age makes me sad :("
Me: "I said i wont grow next age" (which Flogger had already stated he didnt want fluffy to do as we not material for growing in his/bb's eyes)
Me: spoke a bit about feeling like a pawn and said yes i was still angry...
Flogger: "I drink a lot, Just cause we yelled one day obv we didnt notice nor actually do anything vs Ya, So just strange to me to read those logs wsk leaked where ya were still mad at us"
I wont post the rest as it has little meaning to any of the things posted here, but yes i am still angry/mad, thats the story from my point of view.
Last edited by Aranfein; 13-08-2015 at 01:32.
War is what happens when language fails.
Everyone leave angels alone. He has had a rough Time being sick. It's a game get over it.
Angels, rest up and get better.
"having fun warring when you have whoring and number 1 as a goal is totally pointless..." - Korp
"while I heart shiester when we both play serious and are in the same kingdom, I hate shiester on the forums and pretty much disagree with everything he says. Even he knows this." - Flogger asking me out on a date
The devs have made a decision to kill competitive utopia and have thereby killed my interest with it.
Maybe this was orchestrated by Pyro and WSK all along... the drama is just a massive smoke screen to explain the 3 hits into the war, which have secured the victory for Pyro.
*x-files music plays*
The Jerks.
lol.. all of the KDs mentioned are all unable to crown. why so drama? i rather have a war fair and square rather than a war that has it's winner determined before it has even started. wsk should have just warred pyro.
<Black helicopters start circling tetlys house>
Also hope everything is better health wise, Angels.
So again flogger dictates how we run our kingdoms. Says who wars who. Who gives what and when. So maybe we change name to FloggerLady's Utopia. Because clearly no one can do anything with out his say so.
Angels I hope you do grow. I hope you pick better friends and maybe just maybe flogger won't be able to dictate who and how you war.
Sad times in utopia, friends. Very sad.
All for one and one for Chrystal!!
What does any of this have to do with you agreeing to war WSK, but secretly wanting to war pyro instead and never telling WSK and making them train up?
We spoke one day all age, when you noticed someone in their EoW I said I'd notice you in your EoW. Then you asked for EoA from us when talking to pandas after you lost that war and we said yes when pandas asked us. Did you get hospitalized for dementia? Where is this "massive powerplay" Don't notice someone in their end of war and I doubt you even hear a peep from us all age.
Last edited by flogger; 13-08-2015 at 04:35.
I don't think Flogster has any say over Mango's Merchants or CrankyJokers. Did he decide how much you farm out each age too? I wonder if he gets to pick how often Nick_mi starves each age, currently 4 (sorry to my source on not seeing your message for 2 weeks. I worked it into this post just for you)
"The Utopian voice of reason" ~Ben (And he's an official moderator)
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote