Super Theif. Need Advice!

[Dustmaker]

Hello Utopians,

I never really got a clear response to my last thread.
What I am curious about and would love to hear other
people ideas too is.

-Building strategies in war and out of war
-Science build, (which places to focus)
-And adviseble DPA, WPA, TPA

At the moment I am out of war and running this build:

Homes 5%
Farms 7%
Banks 8%
TD 25%
Forts 20%
Guilds 25%
Tower 10%

Any tips, and please post a new build for me if you think you
can come up with a better one. Also in war.

Also my my DPA is around 45, my TPA is 6 and my WPA is 1. I am running 1000 acres, my goal is around 1800 acres.

In sciene I try run Food production, population and of course crime.

I am rather new as theif, so could use a lot of assistence. I hope some experience
theif will assst me or a person with a wast knowledge of the hame

warmest regards,

Dustmaker

[Clampy]

Firstly, I'm glad to see you getting excited about your province and your build. Thieving is great fun, although there is a lot to learn (magic is much simpler).

Where do I start? Unfortunately there's no such thing as a (useful) superthief (or supermage). A province really needs to be an attacker, a hybrid or a T/M. So you need to ask yourself if you'd rather be an attacker/thief or a thief/mage. If you're going attacker/thief, those D/T/Wpa numbers are fine, but you'll also need to pack a fair bit of OPA. If you go thief/mage you'll need much, much higher DPA and WPA.

Race and personality is a big thing to consider, I'm assuming you're leaning towards rogue, but not sure about race. I'm playing a halfling/rogue attacker/thief at the moment and... its... okay, but not stellar.

Buildings: What you've got there is roughly what you'd run as a thief/mage, though if an attacker, drop the forts, halve the guilds/towers and get yourself some training grounds/barracks/hospitals/etc. where appropriate for your build and activity.

Science: I recommend never neglecting any area of science and always run at least 'active' science except when in war. Lack of science seriously is the biggest thing that makes the bottom 3/4 provinces weak. Obviously focus on thievery (and channeling if thief/mage), but probably don't have more than 4 or 5 times as much in thievery as any other category.

Have some fun with it, try different things, don't just do propaganda in war and make sure you always log out with less than 10% stealth when in war.

[Folle]

No such thing as a usefull pure thief or mage.

You learn something new every day.

Bad advice is bad.

Dustmaker, tell what race/pers you are, and helping you is easier :)

[Dustmaker]

Thanks a lot for your time to write all these things Clampy. I will consider many of the things you wrote and give them a steady readthrough and think about them before I reply more to it. You have some vital keypoints I didnt knew about, so cheers for making them clear to me. I am still though confused about a few things, such an exact build for in wartimes and out of war. But thanks a lot man

[Dustmaker]

No such thing as a usefull pure thief or mage.

You learn something new every day.

Bad advice is bad.

Dustmaker, tell what race/pers you are, and helping you is easier :)

Hey Folle,

So you mean Clampy gave me bad advise or?
I am rather new but so ready to learn. :)

My race is Halfling and my pers is theif. I wanted to try be a pure theif, like super, but clampy told
me it is a bad idea for a KD as a team play? Or maybe I got him wrong.

What do you think? About building tactic, in war/out of war and many other aspects of being a theif?

thanks for your time too.

[topsy's revenge]

He's just pointing out that the idea that there isn't a useful super t or super m is a bit inaccurate. Most pure t or pure m will be able to op both t and m just because they needed to make enough tpa/wpa for defensive purposes to op core ok, but pure t or pure m is definitely very strong nowadays. That being said, all the titles are super fluid. Like a halfer/rogue can go in thinking "i am exclusively AW'ing mystics so that we get MS control and then AW'ing everyone else so that I have 100% peon control and then using my elite defense to attack and grow into my super safe wpa." By the end you still have TPA to prop/kidnap/aw, but you also have enough wpa to fb or even LL and you have enough defense/offense to attack phat targets. So are you a super t, a t/m or an a/t/m? It's just situational.

It is a bit different if you are fae/rogue versus halfer/rogue though(which is why folle was asking which race/pers you are).

[Folle]

You should lower TDs some, being rogue they have double effect. your 25% = 50%. Depending on your BE, 15-20% should be plenty. Getting more homes instead would mean increased BE and they work better, while supplying more pop space while at it.
While oow, you dont really need 6 rtpa. 4-5 would be plenty. Get more defense instead. 45 dpa is very low!
You should get your wpa up asap as well, 1 wpa is too easy to ET, leaving you rather useless.

Good for you would be something like:
3 rwpa
5 rtpa
80+ dpa

[pathetic sheep]

-Science build, (which places to focus)


In sciene I try run Food production, population and of course crime.

You need all of the sciences. Crime will be more valuable by far. However, the effect of a book is related to the square root of your books per acre. The effect of the first book, adding 3 more (4 total), or adding 5 to that (9 bpa total) is the same. Adding 21 books to 100 BPA also has the same effect as getting 1 book. Even if a category is more valuable to you none of the categories should ever be at zero.

If you get alchemy you can remove some of the banks. Military sci would allow you to remove some of the forts [Actually keep the forts and add a lot of brutes and slingers in addition to military sci as other posts suggest]. Channeling could allow you to reduce towers and also helps WPA. Tools increases the effect of all buildings. The only value of food sci is to reduce the number of farms. So all of the sciences will benefit your province.

You are assuming that higher TPA will always have a better effect. If you look at the thievery formula http://wiki.utopia-game.com/index.ph...every_Formulas you see each op has a maximum damage to the target and also a max damage per thief. There is some minimum auto-fail regardless of your TPA ratio. Higher crime science allows you to reduce the number of thieves you need. If you have a 4:1 TPA ratio and enough thieves to do max damage then that is enough.

If you really believe alchemy has no value to your province why did you build banks?

[orgz]

build 22 thieves / 11 peasants per acre.... roll halfer

[orgz]

55% homes 25% td

[orgz]

towers banks and farms are for noobs , merchants and dwarves

[s0830887]

Hey man. Some good answers here, but maybe the language is a little confusing if you are new to the game.

I am currently playing a Halfling/Rogue thief/mage. I am in war just now. These were my numbers going into war:

115dpa (12 def specs per acre, 9 elites per acre)
7tpa
5.5 wpa

My science breakdown is approximately:

10% income
10% BE
20% pop
5% food
10% military
20% channeling
25% thievery

My peace time build (for wizard pump to get wpa up):

40% homes
5% farms
55% guilds

And my war build:

30% homes
8% farms
15% forts
20% thieves dens
13% guilds
15% towers

All of this is just how my prov has ended up and what works for me. It isn't necessarily a universally successful strategy, and better players than me have better stats, but it has worked pretty well for me so far. I can answer some questions and stuff if you would like but right now I'm trying to avoid information overload...

[s0830887]

Also I assume it's obvious but if not, ignore orgz's comments. People complain about the game dying but then troll new guys who seem genuinely interested in the game, which is just asinine.

Dustmaker, if you're looking for a reasonably solid KD where you can learn the game, give me a shout and maybe we can bring you in. You seem pretty keen to learn and play, which is what we (and everyone else on the server!) looks for.

[khronosschoty]

Hey man. Some good answers here, but maybe the language is a little confusing if you are new to the game.

I am currently playing a Halfling/Rogue thief/mage. I am in war just now. These were my numbers going into war:

115dpa (12 def specs per acre, 9 elites per acre)
7tpa
5.5 wpa

My science breakdown is approximately:

10% income
10% BE
20% pop
5% food
10% military
20% channeling
25% thievery

My peace time build (for wizard pump to get wpa up):

40% homes
5% farms
55% guilds

And my war build:

30% homes
8% farms
15% forts
20% thieves dens
13% guilds
15% towers

All of this is just how my prov has ended up and what works for me. It isn't necessarily a universally successful strategy, and better players than me have better stats, but it has worked pretty well for me so far. I can answer some questions and stuff if you would like but right now I'm trying to avoid information overload...

Your Crime (thievery) science as a rogue is only 25%? That is very, very low. Your not really suggesting a rogue only run 25% Crime science bonus are you?

[loneshadowz]

Your Crime (thievery) science as a rogue is only 25%? That is very, very low. Your not really suggesting a rogue only run 25% Crime science bonus are you?

I believe that's the breakdown of the book not the science percentage.

like 100 books,
10 book income
10 book BE
20 book pop
5 book food
10 book military
20 book channeling
25 book thievery