Why is BB hiding a bank in vacation mode in their war?

[Goodwitch]

it could also be the action of the province on his own. I have one like that right now that went into vacation mode just so we can't kill him.

[lame]

I think Bishop is too inactive now to action Vacation Mode in War. I wonder "Birdie" even report that. Anyway Good job BB n GL !

[Meep]

it could also be the action of the province on his own. I have one like that right now that went into vacation mode just so we can't kill him.

That would also be a violation of the rules both in your case and in the bbs prov case whether it's at the behest of the prov or the kd.

And provinces have been actioned within the past few ages for vac moding at eoa to protect their high honor from being hitx I do not see why this wouldnt also be applied in this case as the intent is blatant as hell

[Feint]

I think Bishop is too inactive now to action Vacation Mode in War. I wonder "Birdie" even report that. Anyway Good job BB n GL !

I didnt report because I am not aware that. Also, that orc princess went right into VM when BB decides to wave us and gave relations. So that we cannot op and rape that orc honor.

It was a planned action for sure.

Conflict started between us and escalate to war despite the huge NW gap is because I refuse to agree to an EOACF terms consisting of

1) My in range attackers will be hit by their orc princess to help them achieve the individual province crown
2) In return, BB will foster a good relationship with us and for next age as well. They even offer gc and acres for the hit on our attackers as compensation from other province.
3) I refuse and understand CF dont come for free. But I dont wish to have such shady deal so I retaliate. (Many been asking me why war BB, this is why)

[Goodwitch]

I agree that it would be a violation and if it were the case that province should be deleted. But if it were the case the rest of the kingdom shouldn't be punished.
Euro time zone is asleep for the most part so we won't really know anything till in a few hours.

[Feint]

Game Date

July 16 of YR13



Real Date

Thu, 10 Dec at 08:37 GMT+00:00



Sender

The Wealthy King Fopspeen of Spaarvarken ()



Recipient

The Wealthy King Flash of Lightning Bird ()



Subject

Re:CF






I don't know what world you live in, but it's called diplomacy.

Your KD asks mine for EOACF.
I said sure but under the condition we'd make a few hits before CFing. And if you wanted, we'd let you steal or something.

Nothing illegal in making agreements that are beneficial to one or both.

In any case, what does it matter if we'd be the one hitting or if it'd be x:x or x:x and whoever else might be hitting you?


> The Wealthy King Flash of Lightning Bird () said: > >

> > Yes. CF with terms like letting ur orc princess hit to achieve individual province crown. In exchange, you provide other resource like acres or gc from other province. Legit?

U are old enough. Stop lying to yourself.

> The Wealthy King Fopspeen of Spaarvarken () said: > > > > > > > > How exactly? By telling you we wont CF for free? What rules are we breaking?

And you can't hold us responsible for a NW based gains system (which has been broken for years).


> The Wealthy King Flash of Lightning Bird () said: > > > > > >

> > > > > > Your act equate to manipulating chart, equate to cheating. of course we dont agree.



> The Wealthy King Fopspeen of Spaarvarken () said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is no such thing as I insist on no CFing. Either the communication between you and your steward is bad or neither of you ever understood what I've been saying.
I only insisted I wouldn't CF for free. Is that so hard to understand if you consider what spot we're in?

Throwing threats at me doesn't really help your cause. Why can't you approach someone differently rather than having to sound offensive by starting with threats right away? You'd get a lot further by just being nice

> The Wealthy King Flash of Lightning Bird () said: > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Couple of hits. Yes, You already did 2. I dont need anything in return. If u insist no cf, then be it.

I dont like to threaten. We are just minions. But we do have our own style. CF already offered on the table. If you dont wish to accept, I am fine.



> The Wealthy King Fopspeen of Spaarvarken () said: > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I've been straight forward in my diplo with your steward about that we wouldn't CF for free. You guys wanted a free EOA CF whereas we asked for a couple hits in exchange since there isn't many targets. We were even prepared to refund some of your losses if that's what you wanted or cared for.


I was also told you don't respond to messages so I shouldn't bother to message you.


If you want we can talk civil and come to an agreement, but I refuse to bend for threats such as "we will hit X or Y if you dont do Z". So if you want to make a CF agreement, we can discuss the terms of it.




I'll be around most of the day, so just message me back if you want to talk/discuss in a civil way





> The Wealthy King Flash of Lightning Bird () said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I believe my steward has talked to you. Are you gonna accept the CF? It wont be fun if I retal on your orc princess. For the earlier 2 hits, I will just accept it.

[khronosschoty]

I'm not saying that he isn't abusing it, I'm more pointing out a serious flaw or contradiction in the system. The onus is obviously on someone else to actually prove he's abusing it, rather than it being on the person using it to prove they are using it legitimately. We shouldn't have a presumption of abuse. On the other hand, this makes it incredibly easy for people to abuse it as it's extremely difficult to prove such a thing. When's the last time devs actioned a prov for going into vm on its own?

Same thoughts / feelings here. "We shouldn't have a presumption of abuse." We shouldn't I agree, but weather we do or not is a different story; that said when it comes to enforcing rules we ought to assume there is no abuse unless it can be proven. If the the system is too easy to abuse perhaps suggest a change?

[Feint]

Protector told me this deal doesnt violate the game rules, It was just an agreement between both kingdoms. Thus I didnt think further to report. I just wanna war, showed my resilience. Finish with it. Utopia is a warring game. War to solve all conflict is what I believe. If they wish to persist after war, I am ok. I knew we will get farmed. But our kingdom stood strong and fight.

[lampost]

Same thoughts / feelings here. "We shouldn't have a presumption of abuse." We shouldn't I agree, but weather we do or not is a different story; that said when it comes to enforcing rules we ought to assume there is no abuse unless it can be proven. If the the system is too easy to abuse perhaps suggest a change?

I cant believe you are still following this line. A princess cow in the top 5 for honour going into vacation mode at 91 nw/acre just before a war when people in top kds NEVER go into vacation mode. Why do you guys blind yourself from what is infront of you? why are you willing to make a fool of yourself for protector?

Its as clear an abuse as any other time certain provinces have gone into vacation mode at eoa to protect themselves and action-ed for it.

[Aranfein]

Ah yes the good old protector enforcing rules but abusing them himself ... Again with the being a hypocritical eh prot? Once again you sure show me what is decent behaviour and what is not... good riddance we have you to bend the rules to suit your need.

[Meep]

Lol, that looks even worse for BB now.

So they wanted you to agree to let their orc hit you, and then when you refuse duck it into VM to protect it from you?

Looks like BLATANT vm abuse now and I see no reason that prov shouldn't be deleted.

[Kandy]

Same thoughts / feelings here. "We shouldn't have a presumption of abuse." We shouldn't I agree, but weather we do or not is a different story; that said when it comes to enforcing rules we ought to assume there is no abuse unless it can be proven. If the the system is too easy to abuse perhaps suggest a change?

Lol the prov didnt need to go on vacation when it was going to feed on a kd but when war is on the horizon, all of a sudden he had to go on vacation?

Yea, we totally shouldn't presume abuse lol

Dont forget kids, stealing from top kds is bad!! And Protector can do no wrong!!

[Goodwitch]

Feint they meant you could report the vacation mode in war, which could possibly be a rule infraction.
It is not against the rules to make deals about exchanges between kingdoms outside of war, though it may be considered shady. So you cannot report that. But you certainly don't have to like or agree to it.

Iampost there is nothing wrong with wanting to get all the facts before accusations are made. I am sure if someone questioned your kingdom's actions you would expect the same.

[Band of Horses]

I've been in the situation where you've gotta go suddenly and don't have time to find a sitter or the credits handy. Vacation mode is there for a reason, but this looks fishy as hell.

[era]

You're right, it's very common for top KDs to explore banks immediately before the person goes on vacation, and it's very common for top KDs to put provs on vacation immediately before wars.

Stop saying recently explored when he hasn't been exploring. He has been me dropping and hitting for his land. I don't even think he's used a single pool acre. Otherwise carry on the thread but please stop saying explored. That being said in order to keep his new low his science and wpa are probably atrocious and wouldn't fair well in a war against any TM.

#savethehonor #savetheland