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Thread: Respect

  1. #31
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    Strat.. just PM me if you have issues with things I said...
    Last edited by jmiedema; 16-12-2015 at 15:15.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loiso View Post
    Just a little comment, StratO

    IMHO, forum is the place where posters express their *personal* opinion first of all. Unless stated otherwise. No need to pick up words of one player and look on it in context of whole KD. More to say, maybe instead of making judgment about Kd basing on forum posts its worth to base it on how things look "in action"? Could u name me a Kd we bullied? Or maybe acted unfair to? If you want we can go step by step through conflict with ruthless (or actually any other in this age), check what was said and what was done...

    With all respect~
    While I do agree in principle that a players personal opinions and attitudes shouldn't reflect the opinions and attitudes of their kingdom as a whole, I think it's a bit naive to believe that it's not how players perceive it to be, especially players that are not involved in leadership/diplomacy.

    I think every kingdom has their own set of blowhards that can really rub people the wrong way if they're not in the kingdom. The kingdoms that are perceived as being "more respectful/nicer" kingdoms do a much better job at keeping those thoughts private. When you have players that are speaking out and acting like jerks, it reflects negatively on your kingdom, whether that's fair or not.


    That being said, FS has already apologized for any perceived mean-spiritedness, so meh

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoRD_SaMPuaN View Post
    mirana, im pretty sure we both wouldve behaved differently if we knew who each other was, and as for loiso, he is a russian mob after all :/ many ppl were angry because you went overboard with retals hiding behind declaration range, and theres been unpleasant war forum experience for both sides because of the leading events into war.. think we should move on admitting we both couldve done better things..
    no , I would not have(other than counting hostile points). I will gladly offer CFs after a random/retal situation or if asked for in a polite message. But unless agreed upon if there are hits after I send CF then I will take it back. Then it is up to opposing kingdom to send the CF. And since moving on is not an option at that point, we wave.

    As far as accusing someone for staying small to gain an advantage, growing big is just as big if not bigger of an advantage. If you choose to stay small you can't complain about someone growing big and vice versa. Made your bed go lay in it.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goodwitch View Post
    no , I would not have(other than counting hostile points).
    yeah i knew you made a mistake while passing us in meter, but your message to loiso made it look like you intended to do it & was in a threatening manner 'you cant declare us, you will suffer more, so eat it or stop it'.. we probably still couldve come to a cf agreement if you kept a nicer tone (or if i knew it was you)..

    i just hope this war with lost souls doesnt get brought up more and more - yes we warred a much smaller kd, yes we hit them & they gave us button, yes we declared and warred them..

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palem View Post
    While I do agree in principle that a players personal opinions and attitudes shouldn't reflect the opinions and attitudes of their kingdom as a whole, I think it's a bit naive to believe that it's not how players perceive it to be, especially players that are not involved in leadership/diplomacy.

    I think every kingdom has their own set of blowhards that can really rub people the wrong way if they're not in the kingdom. The kingdoms that are perceived as being "more respectful/nicer" kingdoms do a much better job at keeping those thoughts private. When you have players that are speaking out and acting like jerks, it reflects negatively on your kingdom, whether that's fair or not.


    That being said, FS has already apologized for any perceived mean-spiritedness, so meh
    This ^ but I also think jmiedema is a good person. I respect that his kingdom would defend his character. There's no reason to restate the issue.

    I won't abandon answering to this post. Tough love is tough.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bishop View Post
    Correct me then, instead of being a dick about it.
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  6. #36
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    @strato
    It seems to me things you have problem with is not what jmiedema said, but what you read from it. I dont think I have seen anyone from FS use word dodge.
    His analysis of the situation is pretty accurate tho, it IS easier to farm honor when smaller and sub 25. That is a fact.
    Him using word "chose" may not be politically correct at worst, but definitely not reason to go on some rants about lack of respect and bullying. His posts seem pretty reasonable and down to earth, definitely not disrespectful.

    @goodwitch
    After intial exchange of hits we hit you guys pretty hard, 10 learns or so. Your reply was even more excessive.
    At the time we declared we racked up 28 hits compared to your 48 (if i counted correctly). All of this happened over 48hs span. It is very unrealistic to expect KD so much larger and stronger to offer you CF in such situation.
    I am not denying you right to defend yourself by any means necessary ofc, simply pointing out resulting events were to be expected. I dont think you should feel griefed given the circumstances.
    Saying you were hiding behind declare range is poor wording I'd say, its just playing the game mechanics, same as pushing meter to 150. Not something to be offended at.

    @ruthless
    I am kinda sorry we gave you that CF now, twisting things how we walked away cause amnesias and such. You were at 147 points, unable to retal while were in position to freefarm you and secure honor crown while hiding behind hostile tag ... we choose not to. You should have the grace to recognize the situation and not talk crap at least.

  7. #37
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    I disagree citadela01 because mechanically speaking you just presented two examples in which you took honor with virtual impunity. I'm not judging that as wrong, simply pointing out that it has more to do with than just size and diplo.

    Now, if an organized kingdom with sound strategies came down they could farm honor/science/war wins quite easily. Does that happen? Yes.

    Even when great kingdoms throw the community a bone some are far too skilled to be matched in the ghetto. Consider CR in their war age. The best war kingdoms had to run.

    Now I've seen war from any number of aspects and the fact is the community at large is casual. Some in organized kingdoms may consider themselves casual but that's because they have routine and uniform experience.

    Because the game is slowly dying not all formerly reputable kingdoms can retain a quality roster. We have anomalies, like leaders who can raise up a great team from nothing, but that is rare. What we then have are leaders with good game knowledge who must work with what they can muster.

    Leadership quality can't be underestimated. You're kingdom as evidence here has a deep roster. I see you recruiting so I realize this is no walk in the park for you either. Other guys aren't as skilled in all aspects; they're doing what they can. You don't owe them leniency in game. I for one practice mercy, but I never expect it. You're not teaching lessons by farming, you're just pursuing your kingdoms goals.

    For me it ends with the slights. I'm not angry I simply want to shed light on elitism creeping into rhetoric. I'm currently reading Book of Job, so I'm checking my pride. I hold no ill will. Just remember that you present yourself as wanting to do deeper harm to the victim because they resisted. You can dial it back to stoic disregard.

    Thank you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bishop View Post
    Correct me then, instead of being a dick about it.
    love that thick mahogany back with no belly carve or anything...pure thick wood ! The thing ROCK is made of !
    ________
    Weed bowls

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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by StratOcastle View Post
    I disagree citadela01 because mechanically speaking you just presented two examples in which you took honor with virtual impunity. I'm not judging that as wrong, simply pointing out that it has more to do with than just size and diplo.

    Now, if an organized kingdom with sound strategies came down they could farm honor/science/war wins quite easily. Does that happen? Yes.

    Even when great kingdoms throw the community a bone some are far too skilled to be matched in the ghetto. Consider CR in their war age. The best war kingdoms had to run.

    Now I've seen war from any number of aspects and the fact is the community at large is casual. Some in organized kingdoms may consider themselves casual but that's because they have routine and uniform experience.

    Because the game is slowly dying not all formerly reputable kingdoms can retain a quality roster. We have anomalies, like leaders who can raise up a great team from nothing, but that is rare. What we then have are leaders with good game knowledge who must work with what they can muster.

    Leadership quality can't be underestimated. You're kingdom as evidence here has a deep roster. I see you recruiting so I realize this is no walk in the park for you either. Other guys aren't as skilled in all aspects; they're doing what they can. You don't owe them leniency in game. I for one practice mercy, but I never expect it. You're not teaching lessons by farming, you're just pursuing your kingdoms goals.

    For me it ends with the slights. I'm not angry I simply want to shed light on elitism creeping into rhetoric. I'm currently reading Book of Job, so I'm checking my pride. I hold no ill will. Just remember that you present yourself as wanting to do deeper harm to the victim because they resisted. You can dial it back to stoic disregard.

    Thank you.
    That is a lot of words to say w/o actually addressing points I made.
    We were not being disrespectful and did not bully them. We waved them and they choose to fight back, that is all.
    They had option to give up some of their honor in exchange for cf but they took different approach, nothing wrong with that.
    They fought for as long as game mechanics allowed them and ended up in loose/loose position, either give us war they would surely loose or limit themself to 12 hits a day while we farm them freely.

    The fact we gave them free CF at this point when they were out of option speak volumes about alleged bullying.

    The fact you still insist on presenting this entire affair as wanting to "deeper harm to the victim because they resisted" speaks volumes about your own reasoning in this.

    I guess if anything I should retract my earlier comments about regretting giving free CF to Ruthless.
    I realized they did not choose to play victim on forums, afaik they handled themselves with grace, unrelated forum warrior (namely you) took it upon himself to plead their case and I shouldnt judge them based on your actions.

  9. #39
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    Is Ruthless a person or KD?

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by citadela01 View Post

    @goodwitch
    After intial exchange of hits we hit you guys pretty hard, 10 learns or so. Your reply was even more excessive.
    At the time we declared we racked up 28 hits compared to your 48 (if i counted correctly). All of this happened over 48hs span. It is very unrealistic to expect KD so much larger and stronger to offer you CF in such situation.
    I am not denying you right to defend yourself by any means necessary ofc, simply pointing out resulting events were to be expected. I dont think you should feel griefed given the circumstances.
    Saying you were hiding behind declare range is poor wording I'd say, its just playing the game mechanics, same as pushing meter to 150. Not something to be offended at.
    See this is exactly the problem. We didn't like it but we didn't go to the forums. You and your mates keep bringing it up. I ignored the first 3 or 4 times our conflict was used in an argument. But enough is enough. Francis said he would hope it wouldn't get brought up again and I was willing to drop it...but here yet again you have to go on. It's bad enough you bottomfeed but I understand sometimes in your situation it's the only option I guess. But after you do bottomfeed you should definitely just let it go rather than twisting the knife.

    Sorry Francis, this was my last one on this subject out of respect for you. FS has no idea how lucky they are to have you.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lestat View Post
    Is Ruthless a person or KD?
    I prefer to think of it as a state of being.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lestat View Post
    Is Ruthless a person or KD?
    a kingdom..check rankings they are tagged

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goodwitch View Post
    See this is exactly the problem. We didn't like it but we didn't go to the forums. You and your mates keep bringing it up. I ignored the first 3 or 4 times our conflict was used in an argument. But enough is enough. Francis said he would hope it wouldn't get brought up again and I was willing to drop it...but here yet again you have to go on. It's bad enough you bottomfeed but I understand sometimes in your situation it's the only option I guess. But after you do bottomfeed you should definitely just let it go rather than twisting the knife.

    Sorry Francis, this was my last one on this subject out of respect for you. FS has no idea how lucky they are to have you.
    Other people keep bringing up average opponent size. There's no other way to defend it than to bring up how we got that.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zauper View Post
    I prefer to think of it as a state of being.
    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by Goodwitch View Post
    See this is exactly the problem. We didn't like it but we didn't go to the forums. You and your mates keep bringing it up. I ignored the first 3 or 4 times our conflict was used in an argument. But enough is enough. Francis said he would hope it wouldn't get brought up again and I was willing to drop it...but here yet again you have to go on. It's bad enough you bottomfeed but I understand sometimes in your situation it's the only option I guess. But after you do bottomfeed you should definitely just let it go rather than twisting the knife.

    Sorry Francis, this was my last one on this subject out of respect for you. FS has no idea how lucky they are to have you.
    Francis is actually one of the known hardliners in FS. Go figure. :p

  15. #45
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    Why do I have to keep addressing that I'm not questioning FSs in game action?

    @citadela01, it's the matter of implying that Ruthless was staying small with the purpose of predatory honor farming in the ghetto.

    The rest of the mechanical facts are irrelevant. What are you, in the top 10 land? And CFs with how many?

    ^ this is only one challenge. The idea of diplo naivety has merit but you do realize some chose otherwise. The overall kingdom good can be seen from more than a resource management standpoint. There is also morale. I know I'm in a good kingdom if they retaliate the bigs. It's about challenge.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bishop View Post
    Correct me then, instead of being a dick about it.
    love that thick mahogany back with no belly carve or anything...pure thick wood ! The thing ROCK is made of !
    ________
    Weed bowls

    http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...+say&FORM=VDRE

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