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Thread: Diplomacy Talk

  1. #1
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    Diplomacy Talk

    So I've recently started a new kd (you can read more about it in recruitment forum), it's my first time being a monarch so I'd like to get some advice with matters regarding diplomacy.

    Seeing as we're a casual warring kd catering to new players, I was thinking if it'd be a good idea to get into NAPs with every 25 prov kd in utopia. We basically want nothing to do with them while we are still struggling with setting our kd straight, and also I'd like for our new players to not be able to make the mistake of attacking into top kds unprovoked.

    The question I have is, would it really matter to the top kds and would they agree to our CF or would it just put us on their radar?

  2. #2
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    You want a free cf hahaha good luck. First donate a portion of your land to bb and your honor to fs, then they might consider cfing you for a few days.

  3. #3
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    Kosai has a good point.

    As long as your kingdom has something to offer (free land, free honor), everybody will take that.

    Consider that hitting into a viscount or count during peace (if you able to archieve that) is 100 honor. Also the learnings and trad marches will be many.

    Expect to be waved constantly by bigger kingdoms and after they take some 10-15% of your land will accept a CF... temporarly.

    But look at the bright side of the things: this should motivate your kingdom to become better and better. Or disband it :)

  4. #4
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    The top (large) kds largely won't care about CFing you for free, White.

    The only reason why they wouldn't is because they'll think that after a war you'd have provs in range to hit down.

  5. #5
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    Despite what some may say, I've generally found top kingdoms to be quite reasonable (when accounting for my own aggravating stubbornness). If you want a CF it's pretty easy to get if you're a ghetto with nothing in particular they want.

  6. #6
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    We are as ghetto as ghetto gets (15 inactives or so). With the state our kd is in right now, we honestly have nothing to offer in terms of land/honor. We might have some gold lying around, but I'd assume that 25 prov kds would be far out of their range at this point in age. Not that it matters since I'm actually asking this in anticipation for next age.

    In my head this is how it goes. At the start of a new age, I send CF to all 25 prov kds and ask for peace. We want to compete in 22 prov ghettos for now, I mean look at the state we are in. We just want an environment where our newbies won't accidentally hit into top kds, and where they'll be able to learn the game without the added pressure of being bullied. I don't expect us to be a threat to any provs or kds looking to crown (land/honor/ww), so they don't have to worry about keeping us down. Essentially, they have nothing to lose except the guarantee that no newbie prov from our kd is gonna harass them. Sure, we might grow a lil bigger and win some honor IF our kd does well warring, but it definitely won't be a threat to anyone looking to crown though. We are just one ghetto, albeit a ghetto willing to use diplo, so leave us be? Too naive?

  7. #7
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    Honestly use common sense when dealing with other kingdoms and you will be fine

  8. #8
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    It might be a good idea for you to contact those kingdoms that you want to CF pre-age or during freeze, at a time when you have nothing that they want. Most of the top kingdoms have Irc channels where you can get in touch with their leaders. I found top 10 kds to be fairly reasonable to deal with, when I was a monarch in a casual warring kd. Some were more difficult and wanted an acre deal that if we grew to big they would tax acres, which weren't a problem for us as we had no intentions to grow.

    I wouldn't count on getting all the CF's that you wish. There's too few kingdoms left and some won't CF unless it suits them at a certain point.

    Good luck new monarch.

  9. #9
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    Thanks Proceed, that sounds like a good plan. I've never had to deal with any sort of diplomacy, this should be fun :)

  10. #10
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    Getting blank cfs with many 25 man kds if you are not a 25 man kd should be fairly easy. Just let people know that all you are looking for is a blank cf with no commitment. Only jerk wad 25 man kds will hassle you since there are no strings attached. This leaves you open to them breaking cf with you to farm you, but they prob wouldnt do that unless you were an unusually good target for them. It does reduce the random stealing/farm hits that antagonize top vs bottom to each other.

    If your looking for naps with notices or eoa cfs, those come only after you are established enough to either have something that the kd wants (land/honour/sci) that you will part with in order to get the deal. Or even better, if you are scary enough that they will do a CF just to avoid problems. CFs with strings attached are not worth negotiating for with randomly, you want to target that kind of negotiations to kds who are likely to be a problem if you dont have a solid cf with them.

  11. #11
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    CFs in Utopia hold little value.

    You can cancel at any time, there is no mechanic that binds you to the CF.

    They are great for clearing relations. They allow a bigger KD to wave a small KD and then get a CF to clear relations so they smaller KD cannot run ops on them for the next 2 days.

    The value of a CF is in your ability to enforce it -- larger kds negotiate and get something in exchange for the CF and then it is an honor system to stick with it.

    I personally hate offering a CF to a larger KD that waves down to us. I usually take the stance that they gave us relations so it is our right to run ops until the relations go away. If the enemy KD wants to keep hitting, fine.

    We had it happen a few ages ago where some ****ty abs kd failed at growth crown, farmed out to someone and then waved down on us to punk us. We spent about 2 days doing retal learns for massive science w/o accepting a CF. Then someone else waved them and took them to war.

    When their war ended we still had button and pressed it while they were in pump build.. their kd disbanded shortly after.

    Leaving relations open is never a good thing. The CF benefits the aggressor.
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  12. #12
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    Though you would probably get the CFs I think your better course of action is explaining to your players who they can and cannot hit.
    If you don't hit the big kingdoms chances are they won't hit you.
    During the first 48 hours or so of game all bets are off pretty much and any cf you may have made is easily canceled if you are in range, which you will be. Later on as the field widens you won't get much if any heat from bigger kingdoms.

    So I suggest to pick your battles. First deal with your players, then with other kingdoms.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by beans View Post
    Getting blank cfs with many 25 man kds if you are not a 25 man kd should be fairly easy. Just let people know that all you are looking for is a blank cf with no commitment. Only jerk wad 25 man kds will hassle you since there are no strings attached. This leaves you open to them breaking cf with you to farm you, but they prob wouldnt do that unless you were an unusually good target for them. It does reduce the random stealing/farm hits that antagonize top vs bottom to each other.
    I think this pretty much sums up what I hope to achieve. I don't see it as a foolproof way of staying safe from 25 prov kds. But it does reduce the risk of random stealing/farm. In the meantime, we will also be explaining to our players who to hit and who to avoid hitting.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by White. View Post
    I think this pretty much sums up what I hope to achieve. I don't see it as a foolproof way of staying safe from 25 prov kds. But it does reduce the risk of random stealing/farm. In the meantime, we will also be explaining to our players who to hit and who to avoid hitting.
    But what happens when the changes show all kingdoms auto filling to 25?

  15. #15
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    The thing is, top KD's won't have much to gain from you. Doubtful that they will do much damage. If you get enough hits to generate relations, throw a CF. USUALLY the Monarch or stewart will take it right away, they don't want to be honor raped by a KD'S 1/3 their size.. If they don't, then cast a few harmless spells to get their attention. If they still don't, and keep attacking, when they get to hostile, go full on honor rape mode from fort. They won't be a top KD for long. Everyone they hit will want a piece of them. Just don't hit them with military except for ambushes. You have to be able to hold your own in the world of legends, just like in the real world.
    Last edited by Crazyguy; 01-01-2016 at 23:27. Reason: Typos
    Long live Mehul!

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