Intentional farmouts

[Band of Horses]

Expendables had a "farm war" that we almost lost lol. Essentially what happened there was we were located in a kingdom number that gets targetted very often by lazy target searchers. One kingdom gave us a button through a variety of uniques (not just 1 player)... we explored, went to fort, trained, then declared. At the time there were only 8 or so provinces under my command. The rest were randoms. Once the war started, it was basically 8 on 20 or however many provs they had. A few good players stepped up, but the other kingdom was far more organized than we were, sadly.

I can hardly see the similarities between these two events.

Your hateful 8 farmed them feeding only your non controlled provs correct? What were the gains there? You had a ton of unbreakables. I don't think you came close to losing. My point is just that without intent a farm war doesn't mean it is an intentional farm war.

[Meep]

As to the point at hand. The increased bonus and incentive to create farm wars oop is a problem. The community cant just start razing *everything* that looks like a farm war, there has to be some sort of standard. Although if it is forbidden to war kds that have a single prov hitting your 8x that can also be exploited, instead of having rogue provs to create farm out wars we could have rogue provs griefing enemy kds.

reading godly's post the whole things sounds so fishy that if bishop did some IP checking he might find actionable cross logging or other actionable irregularities. A far easier solution then having the community act on this, which would set an extremely dangerous precedent of community control over what wars kds are allowed to pursue. Best possible result is that there was some game offense made and admins can handle this, rather then the community.

Beastblood already set that precedent, I'm just here for the same reason I called out the VM abuse last age, to remind them that fairplay works both ways.

[Pale]

In the previous instance you're referring to, wasn't it one well known kd farming out to another well known kd to go past someone else? I don't see the parallels between that situation and this one at all. Taking an easy oop war definitely can't be called illegal or unfair play. If I'm #2 and my buddy is #3, and my buddy farms out to me because he hates #1, that's a totally different situation than this one. We're comparing apples to oranges imo.

[Godly]

Your hateful 8 farmed them feeding only your non controlled provs correct? What were the gains there? You had a ton of unbreakables. I don't think you came close to losing. My point is just that without intent a farm war doesn't mean it is an intentional farm war.

Believe me when I say that we discussed WDing. We essentially had random mystics that were on 15% towers and would only login once a day that were their rune farms. They were able to keep MS on our bigs 24/7. We had to start massacring their T/Ms for them to WD.

Either way, how does it compare when it's an actual war (hits being traded) with a decision made by a good amount of players in the kingdom?

[Meep]

In the previous instance you're referring to, wasn't it one well known kd farming out to another well known kd to go past someone else? I don't see the parallels between that situation and this one at all. Taking an easy oop war definitely can't be called illegal or unfair play. If I'm #2 and my buddy is #3, and my buddy farms out to me because he hates #1, that's a totally different situation than this one. We're comparing apples to oranges imo.

I'm not the one who chose to label all farmouts, known to both participants or not, intentional or not as wrong.

I'm not the one who said that strong leadership would raze acres gained from farming, even if the benefiting KD had done nothing wrong.

This isn't an easy OOP war. An Easy OOP war is when my ghetto's undeads decided to wave BBs clerics instead of Pyro's sages 2 ages ago.

This is a blatant farmout.

[lampost]

How does Godly post without ever being online :p

[beans]

In the previous instance you're referring to, wasn't it one well known kd farming out to another well known kd to go past someone else? I don't see the parallels between that situation and this one at all. Taking an easy oop war definitely can't be called illegal or unfair play. If I'm #2 and my buddy is #3, and I farm out to #2 because I hate #1, that's a totally different situation than this one. We're comparing apples to oranges imo.

I agree. The actionable offense is the "conspiracy" part. If you are planting players in ghettos in a conspiracy to get farm out wars, that is actionable. If you conspire with a friend/ally kd to farm out for chart shaping that is actionable, if a farm out falls in your lap... well it's not sporting but I don't think the community should get involved in farm out wars that happen due to the normal events in uto (ie noobs being noobs).

[Anri]

I'm not the one who chose to label all farmouts, known to both participants or not, intentional or not as wrong.

I'm not the one who said that strong leadership would raze acres gained from farming, even if the benefiting KD had done nothing wrong.

This isn't an easy OOP war. An Easy OOP war is when my ghetto's undeads decided to wave BBs clerics instead of Pyro's sages 2 ages ago.

This is a blatant farmout.

Was there not two wars early last age that started out with 1 prov giving them meter to declare. I was thinking it was fishy back then and now its just getting silly to me.

[Band of Horses]

Believe me when I say that we discussed WDing. We essentially had random mystics that were on 15% towers and would only login once a day that were their rune farms. They were able to keep MS on our bigs 24/7.

Even so, how does it compare when it's an actual war (hits being traded) with a decision made by a good amount of players in the kingdom?

You make a good point(s). You're the farthest of my mentions from an intentional farm war. I do believe my other mentions though are fair and it begs the question of what is the difference between a farm war and an intentional farm war. I'll make some more: Pyro v Shinra, Sleepy v Outplayerz, Divinity v the kd they nw dropped to 50% to fight, BB v Fratzia

[Pale]

Was there not two wars early last age that started out with 1 prov giving them meter to declare. I was thinking it was fishy back then and now its just getting silly to me.

So every fishy situation we're just going to go on a witch hunt and gangbang everyone? Yeah that's smart (sarcasm)

[darkl1ght]

They had 2 people join so they could earn the free science and wizard production on them.

Essentially what happened is one prov hit them in consecutive waves OOP for a total of 8+ hits. The kingdom who gave the button subsequently went AFK.

There is some pretty reliable evidence that the person who did this is friends with Gamers Inc and actually used to play in that kingdom. I can't personally divulge the proof because I wasn't part of the conversation. Perhaps at some point someone will step forward and reveal the truth.

I don't think there is enough to action them in Bishop's eyes, but in my eyes it's a deliberate attempt to game the overpowered EOWCF bonus and should have significant consequences.

Honestly, if this isn't actioned, it sets off a very, very scary precedence. You can't continue to increase the WW bonus and sit back and let this kind of stuff happen.

thanks for the explanation

Im guessing BB starts with 22/23 provs to look noob, attract stray hits (button), and possibly plant people in other kds to give them the button, then get an easy war win

all legit/ethical of course. in the name of fair play

I really hope no one hit into their prep/hostile...

p.s. where is emereti to action them?

[Band of Horses]

I want to know where we draw the line. The definitive difference between intentional farm out and regular farm out. Because I agree an intentional farm out should be actioned either internally or via community. No double standards, black and white what is an intentional farm out.

If proof can be given that a player is ex bb and gave bb a button to get a farm war then it's easy. I've yet to see that. I'm still looking for someone to show the 8 hits let alone the person behind them.

[Meep]

I want to know where we draw the line. The definitive difference between intentional farm out and regular farm out. Because I agree an intentional farm out should be actioned either internally or via community. No double standards, black and white what is an intentional farm out.

If proof can be given that a player is ex bb and gave bb a button to get a farm war then it's easy. I've yet to see that. I'm still looking for someone to show the 8 hits let alone the person behind them.

I draw the line at when a KD bullies other KDs to withdraw from crown contention because someone farmed out to them, they should expect some comeuppance when they are the beneficiaries of a farmout.

I think that when a KD decides that they are to be the crusaders of fair play, they can expect their each and every action to be scrutinized.

[Pale]

That would require for you to prove that it's not fair play in the first place.

[Band of Horses]

I draw the line at when a KD bullies other KDs to withdraw from crown contention because someone farmed out to them, they should expect some comeuppance when they are the beneficiaries of a farmout.

I think that when a KD decides that they are to be the crusaders of fair play, they can expect their each and every action to be scrutinized.

That's not an answer to my request. Especially since you didn't call for it in other BB farm wars since then. You're being vindictive is all you've proven to me.