Runes

[BOWSEI2]

Have we ever considered getting rid of runes?

Success rate and power are independent of rune consumption. It seems their only purpose is to force all casters to rather redundantly dedicate massive portions of land to rune production.

As far as conventional game design is concerned, the existence of runes seems unnecessary. We could get rid of this, and allow for more interesting and versatile builds.

Imagine that your vehicle has a gas tank, but this gas tank requires its own internal engine and separate gas tank, for it to function.

What if I told you, the internal engine could use gas from the main tank, rather than have a separate one? Crazy, right?

Runes are to utopia, what the second gas tank is, to said vehicle.

[The Moon]

Well jeeps i reckon runes are a fun and essential aspect of the game ... we already lost books!

[BOWSEI2]

Well jeeps i reckon runes are a fun and essential aspect of the game ... we already lost books!

Are they?

[The Moon]

I reckon ... your suggestion seems like taking castle pieces out of chess. They are meant to be there ... just IMO

[BOWSEI2]

I reckon ... your suggestion seems like taking castle pieces out of chess. They are meant to be there ... just IMO

But your logic could easily be used to say that more redundant processes could be added to the game, that simply create more work without providing more functionality or depth, and that the game would be better for it.

[MaximII]

It sort of makes sense in a small way. I mean, with spell casting you the wizzies themselves, mana, and the runes they need to cast the spells. They are the only part of this game that requires all three things to make their specific action (spell casting) actually work. You can have all the wizzies and mana you want, but without runes, they're useless (aside from defensive purposes). With thieves, all you need to do is have the thieves and stealth and you're set to go. Thievery doesnt require an additional resource to work, so why should spell casting?

Getting rid of runes definitely changes the game as a whole because TM's no longer need a highly desired resource to run their province - or their associated building. Imagine what a TM could do with 15 to 20% more building space....

[greendragon2000]

Remember the Dark Elves???

[brandonc204]

...

[Paradise]

With thieves, all you need to do is have the thieves and stealth and you're set to go. Thievery doesnt require an additional resource to work, so why should spell casting?

Magic and thievery are not the same, so you cannot compare. Plus please remember that you have WT to defend against thievery ops, but no buildings to defend against magic spells, so making magic only bounds to mana will be OP. That's why Dark Elf was removed.

[Elldallan]

Have we ever considered getting rid of runes?

Success rate and power are independent of rune consumption. It seems their only purpose is to force all casters to rather redundantly dedicate massive portions of land to rune production.

As far as conventional game design is concerned, the existence of runes seems unnecessary. We could get rid of this, and allow for more interesting and versatile builds.

Imagine that your vehicle has a gas tank, but this gas tank requires its own internal engine and separate gas tank, for it to function.

What if I told you, the internal engine could use gas from the main tank, rather than have a separate one? Crazy, right?

Runes are to utopia, what the second gas tank is, to said vehicle.

Runes are not a reduntant factor, they are a limiting factor!
They can be actively targeted to prevent the casting of spells and yes they force provinces to dedicate non-trivial part of their available lands to producing runes, that's the whole point. Runes are no more redundant than farms or generals are.

Without the need for runes chained attackers would be hilarious.

[chalsdk]

I need my magic stones!

Getting rid of em, will make wizzes the same role as thives.. but only getting it with guilds.. no go.

[MaximII]

Magic and thievery are not the same, so you cannot compare. Plus please remember that you have WT to defend against thievery ops, but no buildings to defend against magic spells, so making magic only bounds to mana will be OP. That's why Dark Elf was removed.

How are runes a limiting factor? Mana is a limiting factor. I can produce or steal as many runes as I need. If runes were the limiting factor, there wouldnt be no limits at all. Mana is the limiting factor because it doesnt matter how many runes I have, if I dont have any mana, they're useless.

[brandonc204]

...

[greaps]

By same logic why do we need farms. Lets keep runes, and farms. Runes are a form of currency, and a lot of variables open up when you need to produce and protect them.

[Zauper]

How are runes a limiting factor? Mana is a limiting factor. I can produce or steal as many runes as I need. If runes were the limiting factor, there wouldnt be no limits at all. Mana is the limiting factor because it doesnt matter how many runes I have, if I dont have any mana, they're useless.

Both runes and mana are limiting factors. Mana with runes can't be spent, runes without mana can't be spent. Mana regenerates at a flat rate, and can be influenced by outsiders (SW). Rune generation is based on land, and can be aided, robbed, or destroyed from out of your province -- all of which provide play/counterplay options.