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Thread: Something other than thieves, wizards and military: shamans

  1. #1
    Post Fiend peppie's Avatar
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    Something other than thieves, wizards and military: shamans

    Self intro:
    Hi, im pep, ive played since december 2000, ive led a KD since 2002 (its still there), and im bored out of my skull with this game. Since, like, 2006. I also never thought id be posting a suggestion, but i figured it worth a shot with the new landlords.

    why this suggestion:
    more strategic depth. Every age you try to strike a balance between three things. Adding a fourth would spice things up. I picked shamans/rituals because of my limited imagination. I just kept thinking "what else can we have except military, wizards or thieves?"

    clarification
    the suggestion itself, and all the text below, is not as important as the why behind it: to have a number four thing to juggle as a Kingdom/province.

    mechanics

    • shamans work on KD acres, not province acres. a KD with 20,000 acres needs 20,000 shamans to unlock tier 1 shaman rituals, and 40,000 for tier 2, etc
    • tiers can have a variety of effects: duration boosts, new types of rituals unlocked, cheaper shamans, etc. A high tier could see two rituals per tick
    • new building, stone circles, to cut shaman training costs KD wide. If the KD has 20,000 acres, and has a total of 1000 (5%) stone circles, then KD wide shaman training costs will be lowered
    • KD appoints (or monarch appoints) an archdruid (or smt) to oversee the rituals. The pool of shamans can be distributed to three tasks: beneficial rituals, offensive rituals, and ritual defense. The monarch can never be the archdruid.
    • these three tasks still work on KD acres, the more shamans you appoint to a role, the more powerful the rituals (or less randomness?) This is meant to give KDs a reason to have more shamans than needed for a tier unlock. For instance, if a KD has 2 shamans per acre KD wide, they could allot 0.7 shamans per acre to beneficial rituals, 0.6 per acre to offensive rituals, and 0.6 per acre to defensive rituals
    • warwins could award proportional shaman credits to make scaling less painful
    • rituals target provinces in a quadrant of either nw and acres (selectable). If a KD has 20 provs, the archdruid can target the five biggest provs, the five smallest provs, or the two quartiles in between for rituals.
    • the rituals are cast on tick. The affected province(s) is/are randomly selected within the quartile. The archdruid has some control over what types of rituals are cast: offensive rituals can, for instance, target offense, defense, economy, thieves or wizards.
    • active rituals show on sot, much like dragons/riots/plague etc
    • shamans are intended as a tradeoff, so they will take population space. A balance needs to be struck between how effective you want your province to be at thievery/magery/attackery and how effective the KD wants to be at rituals.


    types of beneficial rituals

    • for the next twelve hours, the affected province has +50% income
    • for the next twelve hours, the affected province has -50% training costs
    • for the next eight hours, the affected province has +500% birthrate
    • for the next eight hours, the affected province has a ghost workforce, filling unfilled jobs
    • for the next four hours, the affected province's elites will have a raw +2 modifier to its defense stat
    • for the next four hours, the affected province is immune to ambush
    • for the next four hours, the affected province spends 1% stealth per thievery op

      and so on. Id suggest that beneficial rituals are grouped to work either on buildings/peasants, thievery/magic boosts or military boosts


    types of defense rituals

    • for the next 2 hours, the next offensive ritual cast on this province will fail
    • for the next 2 hours, the next offensive ritual cast on this province will be mirrored on a province in the opponent's largest quartile
    • for the next 2 hours, the next offensive ritual cast on this province will be transformed to a random beneficial ritual, but has a 75% chance to also benefit one of the opponent's provinces in the largest quartile

      one of the above modes would be selected. Tiers could increase duration, as would amount of shamans assigned


    types of offensive rituals

    • for the next 5 hours, the defensive value of the opponent's defense specs will be lowered by 2
    • for the next 4 hours, the opponent cannot use their thieves, and they will lose 3% stealth per tick
    • opponent loses 5% of its military
    • for the next 6 hours, the affected province will lose 5% BE per tick

      like mentioned before, offensive ritual groups could target offense, defense, economy, thieves/wizards <-- one of these would be selected.


    other thoughts

    - another possibility is to have rituals that screw around with mechanics: grant provinces spells, or disable spells. Take away racial bonuses, or give them. Have ritual only spells (clear sight, fog returns!) Theres a lot of flexibility
    - a new attack or thievery op could target opponent shamans (capturing or slaughtering them)
    - races can have new self spells (double the duration of beneficial rituals) or racial modifiers (offensive rituals have a 50% chance to be deflected to a different quartile). Or weaknesses: "defensive rituals cannot target this race"
    - i havent taken balancing in account, or potential abuses. I also didnt think up fancy ritual names. I havent thought of quartile prov count rounding. But im sure the idea in general can work.
    - alternatively, shamans can be called mangoes, although this will cause problems: does mpa mean military per acre, or mangoes per acre?

    summary
    pillars of this system:
    1) a fourth thing to balance other than mages/thieves/military
    2) some degree of randomness
    3) operates/scales on KD level
    Last edited by peppie; 12-03-2017 at 08:58.
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  2. #2
    Post Fiend
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    I like the idea...
    KD wide mechanics are on the list of proposed mechanics to think up.

    Some of the %s need altering (Yes I know this is a rough draft idea)
    Like for the next 4 hours opponent loses 5% of military (I think) is kinda steep.

    But on the whole, a new unit for kd mechanics, is a good twist to the general kd mechanics of thievery/magic proposals.

    I would add that maybe tiers could affect duration or variety of effect and numbers affect intensity, as it is with ops/spells.
    This way you could go into war knowing thier shaman power as a KD (Numbers) but maybe not thier tier/strat.

    Maybe you would have to invest in each tier to advance that particular set of rituals (Off thievery/magic/military) (Def thievery/magic/military). (Your kd strat)
    Last edited by BoBDuDe; 12-03-2017 at 08:23.

  3. #3
    Sir Postalot Pillz's Avatar
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    I like this suggestion.

    Nice work peppie

  4. #4
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    Not bad for a potato head.

  5. #5
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    Denied

  6. #6
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    Mangoes?!?
    Live long and prosper

  7. #7
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    It sounds like too much of a game changer to me, sorry.
    Live long and prosper

  8. #8
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    Seeing as KD-wide mechanics ideas were requested.
    This is very similar to the idea that provinces would have to commit thier thieves/wizards to produce a KD wide thief or mage effect.
    And having to donate stealth/mana/runes to sustain it.

    All mechanics are already in place for all 3 things he proposed:
    1. A New unit (Shaman per acre) (i.e. tpa/wpa)
    2. With its own KD wide coordinated effect (Rituals) (i.e. dragons)
    3. And levels for said KD-wide coordinated effect (Tiers) (i.e. dragon type).

    I dont see how this would be any more overly game-changing than a KD-wide straight-up op/spell would be.

  9. #9
    Post Fiend peppie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Moon of Earth View Post
    It sounds like too much of a game changer to me, sorry.
    the point of the suggestion is to change up the game :p
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  10. #10
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    Aye but you say you've been playing for seventeen years ... maybe just take an age off and come back fresher ...
    Live long and prosper

  11. #11
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    And wtf mangoes lol?
    Live long and prosper

  12. #12
    Post Fiend peppie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Moon of Earth View Post
    And wtf mangoes lol?
    [09:56:50] <TheMango> i'll support your idea if insteaed of calling them 'shamans', we call them 'mangoes'
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  13. #13
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    I like the idea to add KD mechanics. If developers agree with main idea, community will have to discuss percentages, affected areas and etc. So for now we should get more votes up and wait for dev answers

  14. #14
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    My questions/concerns:

    1. Given how much kingdom land fluctuates in war, this looks like it could potentially be unstable where 1 hour you have access to tier 3 rituals and the next hour you only have tier 1.
    2. This is mighty tempting for land dropping. Unless I'm just not understanding how the tiers and mechanics works, it seems like you'd get massive benefits from pumping shamans at higher levels and then dropping land and warring someone that's been prepping at that size.
    3. Depending on the tier levels, I'm concerned about the presence of banks (provs). They are already massively advantageous to a kingdom, but being able to stack most of your shaman for the kingdom into a few provinces while the rest of the kingdom can completely ignore the unit seems like it would just be god-mode. We should really be working away from things like bank dominance and land dropping.

  15. #15
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    Not seeing how 2 is different from how things are currently

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