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Thread: Revamped Honor and Science system

  1. #1
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    Revamped Honor and Science system

    I propose the following changes to honor and science:

    Honor:

    New ranks (ranks vs honor up for discussion):

    Peasant: 0-500
    Knight (first bonus rank): 501-1000
    Lord: 1001-1500
    Baron: 1501-2000
    Great Baron: 2001-2500
    Viscount: 2501-3000
    Count: 3001-3500
    Marquis: 3501-4000
    Duke: 4001-4750 (double bonuses from this rank onward)
    Grand Duke: 4751-5500
    Prince: 5501-6500
    Crown Prince: 6501-7500

    Adds up to 7 + 8 = 15 total ranks. For each rank you choose 1 of the below categories to dedicate it to.

    (numbers up for discussion):

    OME - 3% per rank
    Attack speed - 2% per rank
    Attack gains - 1.5% per rank
    OWPA - 10% per rank
    OTPA - 10% per rank
    DWPA - 10% per rank
    DTPA - 10% per rank

    So at Crown Prince you could have +20% battle gains, -30% attack speed or 150% offensive wpa. You can only assign the bonuses once, you cannot change them afterwards unless you lose the rank and re-gain it.

    Science:

    SAME:

    Alchemy - Income (30% at 30 scientists)
    Tools - BE (25% at 50 scientists)
    Housing - Population (20% at 50 scientists)
    Production - Food and Runes (100% at 30 scientists)

    CHANGED:

    Crime - Thievery damage (20% at 30 scientists)
    Channeling - Spell Damage (20% at 30 scientists)
    Military - DME (20% at 40 scientists)


    Reasons:

    1. Give more players in the game something new to strive for and further tweak their province in the manner they CHOOSE (at the moment honor is mostly a non-existent/irrelevant mechanics for the large majority of players in the game).
    2. Separate science from honor bonus-wise. At the moment honor has too much overlap with science, which especially in the wpa/tpa department leads to huge discrepancies between "TMs" and "attackers", especially with increased ops damage and reduced difficulty.
    3. Change!

    Note:

    Numbers aren't final and can be tweaked. I am aware that in current mechanics a DE/Mystic could get like +100% spell damage --> these balancing things should be addressed.

  2. #2
    Moderator umajon911's Avatar
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    Not sure I really like it. It makes it seem as if the top play can get even shadier and honor whore a bit more. They will wave a kd 50% their nw, kd will CF up, top runs away with land, and honor, boosting themselves even THAT much more, without taking retals. I don't see an issue the way the honor system is at this moment, other than Anon hitting taking honor.
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    Quote Originally Posted by umajon911 View Post
    Not sure I really like it. It makes it seem as if the top play can get even shadier and honor whore a bit more. They will wave a kd 50% their nw, kd will CF up, top runs away with land, and honor, boosting themselves even THAT much more, without taking retals. I don't see an issue the way the honor system is at this moment, other than Anon hitting taking honor.
    Not sure what you mean.

    Currently honor gives you:

    +2% income
    +1% population
    +2% OME
    +3% OWPA
    +3% OTPA

    I intend to replace that with a stronger before in 1 category. The numbers might be changed a tad. Sure, Crown Prince would give you +45% OME, but how likely are you to reach that?

  4. #4
    Forum Fanatic khronosschoty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by umajon911 View Post
    Not sure I really like it. It makes it seem as if the top play can get even shadier and honor whore a bit more. They will wave a kd 50% their nw, kd will CF up, top runs away with land, and honor, boosting themselves even THAT much more, without taking retals. I don't see an issue the way the honor system is at this moment, other than Anon hitting taking honor.
    Agreed.
    #magi

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    Moderator umajon911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bart of Sparta View Post
    Sure, Crown Prince would give you +45% OME, but how likely are you to reach that?
    Run a Orc/WH core, or any WH core. I don't like seeing the word "Crown Prince" possibly due to the fact that it relates towards that other game starting with a "M".

    IMO Honor is a pain to get, and something you can lose very quickly. Maybe just add a GBP factor to honor so it makes it harder for you to lose?
    “The only person you are destined to become is the person you decide to be.”
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  6. #6
    Forum Fanatic khronosschoty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by umajon911 View Post
    Run a Orc/WH core, or any WH core. I don't like seeing the word "Crown Prince" possibly due to the fact that it relates towards that other game starting with a "M".

    IMO Honor is a pain to get, and something you can lose very quickly. Maybe just add a GBP factor to honor so it makes it harder for you to lose?
    I like that idea.
    #magi

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    Quote Originally Posted by umajon911 View Post
    Run a Orc/WH core, or any WH core. I don't like seeing the word "Crown Prince" possibly due to the fact that it relates towards that other game starting with a "M".

    IMO Honor is a pain to get, and something you can lose very quickly. Maybe just add a GBP factor to honor so it makes it harder for you to lose?
    What I tried to show is that current honor mechanics also give SIGNIFICANT bonuses. A prince mystic has +33% offensive wpa, and the 11% extra population if translated to extra raw wpa (about 3 pop space, so say from 6 raw to 9 raw) also translated to about +100% wpa. And then on top you also have +33% tpa (main former halfer bonus), +22% income (nearly the entire human bonus) and +22% offense (better than warrior main bonus).

    Anyways, let's not talk numbers just yet, but let's first talk about the suggestion. To move forward in this game you first propose a qualitative change, then once you agree on its desirability you can tweak the numbers to make it balanced (reduce bonuses, remove honor bonus from WH etc etc).

    Do you disagree with:

    1. honor becoming a more strategic part of the game (based on choice, not standard bonuses)?
    2. Separating the honor and sci bonuses to prevent stacking and give each a more unique touch?

  8. #8
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    Hmm, i'm actually going to disagree that honor should be part of strategic gameplay, i'm not sure people should get the choice of what bonus honor gives. I like that it gives multiple benefits. It shouldn't really be like science where you select which category to place the bonus in - it's just make it an extension to science rather than separating it.

    I like the idea of it giving different bonuses to science, though. But i'm not sure on that return speed. As the age of avians is still fresh in the mind and having played a attack-speed-stacking combo in the other game, where Utopia is at with its attack speed is fine.


    Actually, it might be cool if the honor categories changed every age to fit with what the game designers decided were the themes of the age.

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