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Thread: Multiclass Scientists + higher scientist rate

  1. #1
    Regular Kilim's Avatar
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    Post Multiclass Scientists + higher scientist rate

    One thing that strikes me as utterly bad with how scientists and science generation work this age is two things:

    1. The scientist generation is way too low.
    Even when running high amount of labs, there is hardly any progress at all.
    Also low amount of scientists also works against versatility, and the feeling of having a great province late game.
    If the rate stays put, then another way to help would be to double sci rate on base, labs and rev, but half book generation(and ofc the max books for level up).
    that way its easier to focus more on what you like, and spread things more easily out.

    2. That a scientists that learns all the traits and knowledge from one field, starts a new field of research, and then suddenly doesn't know anything about what he just spent years learning - logic's pls!
    My proposal here would be a multiclass system - like some MMO's etc. you gain level in the field you go to. so you could if you wanted master all 3 research fields.
    You could make a grace period(the scientist needs to find old notes and books he have done before). e.g. 12 hour grace period, 3-6 hours with no books, 6 hours with reduced books generated, then back to professor as he was before.

    this would mean alot to those that want to work for their science, optimize everything and give alot more versatility for the lords of the provinces.

    make it happen! :-D

    /Kilim

  2. #2
    Forum Fanatic khronosschoty's Avatar
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    Interesting idea, worth exploring for sure.
    #magi

  3. #3
    Post Fiend
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    I think it should be a Sage ability.
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  4. #4
    Regular Kilim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    I think it should be a Sage ability.
    so all other peoples scientist just get brain dmg when they shift field ? :-P
    Lore wise it makes sense that you still remember what you learned a year ago.
    If i learn to ride a bike, then learn to drive a car, then i don't need to relearn bike skills when going back to a bike.

    It could be a penalty for Undead personality. Rotten brain and all that, what you don't use, you forget. :-)

  5. #5
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    TBH, I like the current system, the current amount of scientists is ok, though the books might be a little um high. (or the science gains a little high)
    Last edited by RedPanda; 15-10-2018 at 16:56.
    A outerworld vagabond Elf traveling this world.
    From the world of Thardferr, herald of the Eldar Elven Kingdoms
    Elven Roles sense Age 63: Sage, Mystic, Rogue, Tactician, Cleric, Merchant, Heretic, War Hero, Warrior, Paladin, Undead,

  6. #6
    Post Demon Avenger's Avatar
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    Sure, let's make sci even more complicated.
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  7. #7
    Regular Kilim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avenger View Post
    Sure, let's make sci even more complicated.
    How is it more complicated, with bringing reason into the system ?
    if you learn something and do something else, do you unlearn it after ?

    my guess is no. hence implement multiclass, and make a short grace period for shifting to a previously learned field.
    where is the complexity in that ?

    also while were at it, how is the current system complex ? take your buildings. you build a stable, that stable generates horses.
    you get a scientist, he generates books - it really isn't complex.

  8. #8
    Post Demon Avenger's Avatar
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    Might as well take away re-assigning scientists with current age scaling. You have plenty of time to decide where your next one will be.
    Discord: Hex | IRC: Hextor / Avenger

  9. #9
    Regular Kilim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avenger View Post
    Might as well take away re-assigning scientists with current age scaling. You have plenty of time to decide where your next one will be.
    That makes no sense either. so without any training your a star physicist, and the next second your a natural born biochemist without training, or field experience.
    again, it would be nice if just a bit of utopia had a sense of reality. yes, there is elves, humans etc, but technology is still the same, you still go to school in all fantasy universes. you don't just magically learn stuff.

    so yeah, moving to a new field would require you to learn about that field, but moving back to the old field doesn't mean you need to relearn that.

  10. #10
    Post Fiend Niko's Avatar
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    I think RattleHead made a really elegant suggestion to point #1 of this thread, here: http://forums.utopia-game.com/showth...ist-Generation (there's also another tactical gem from smercjd in this thread)

    As for point #2, I think that sounds like a lot of fun. Dual-classing scientists! :D
    Last edited by Niko; 15-10-2018 at 18:44.
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  11. #11
    Post Demon Elldallan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kilim View Post
    so all other peoples scientist just get brain dmg when they shift field ? :-P
    Lol, Uhm no, but if somebody has spent 8-10 years learning something(which is roughly the time it takes to get your post doc), say Chemistry of Physics, they're not gonna be even remotely as knowledgeable about the finer points of tactics, maneuver and logistics or commanding a battalion of tanks.
    Sure scientists tends to be fairly smart people but that only goes so far.
    Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day, Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niko View Post
    I think RattleHead made a really elegant suggestion to point #1 of this thread, here: http://forums.utopia-game.com/showth...ist-Generation (there's also another tactical gem from smercjd in this thread)

    As for point #2, I think that sounds like a lot of fun. Dual-classing scientists! :D
    Ill take a read. sounds like more have come up with good solutions then :-P

    and yeah. Dual-classing scientists would shake things up a bit, and have a bit of realism to it aswell.



    Quote Originally Posted by Elldallan View Post
    Lol, Uhm no, but if somebody has spent 8-10 years learning something(which is roughly the time it takes to get your post doc), say Chemistry of Physics, they're not gonna be even remotely as knowledgeable about the finer points of tactics, maneuver and logistics or commanding a battalion of tanks.
    Sure scientists tends to be fairly smart people but that only goes so far.
    what you are describing isn't what im saying. im saying dual class as in if you learn one thing, you can get to learn another thing, but keep your knowledge of the first thing. what you are trying to say is that because they learn on thing they also learn another thing. this is not my point and not what i want.

    The point is if you take 8-10 years(from recruit to professor) learning one field, say chemistry of physics as you said. then take another 10 years(from recruit to professor) learning biochemestry, then you don't just unlearn chemistry of physics. yes you would need a brush-up, but thats what a grace period is for exactly for brush-up in an already known catagory.
    Last edited by Kilim; 15-10-2018 at 23:43. Reason: small addition

  13. #13
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    A lot of things don't really make sense in utopia. How is it possible for an army to INSTANTLY arrive at the enemy's lands, won the battle, but takes 12 days to march back? How is it possible for thieves to come out of their holes, burn enemy buildings and come back INSTANTLY?

  14. #14
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    No way a split discipline would be more effective than a single discipline.

    To gain something, you lose something. So maybe a scientists can get 2 disciplines but at a higher cost (ie more xp to promote to next level) and lose out on access to "professor level" but gains the ability to invest in 2 categories of science, only reserve the "professor level" for the Sage personality .
    A outerworld vagabond Elf traveling this world.
    From the world of Thardferr, herald of the Eldar Elven Kingdoms
    Elven Roles sense Age 63: Sage, Mystic, Rogue, Tactician, Cleric, Merchant, Heretic, War Hero, Warrior, Paladin, Undead,

  15. #15
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    Honestly it makes no sense that a scientist would switch fields. As it is, a "Military Scientist" somehow generates "science" that increases both siege and "valor." What? Same with Economists--somehow the same dude generates books that help with artisanship, housing, and production. Who is this dude? Did he study construction, public administration, and get an MBA with some Six-Sigma certifications?

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