KT vs HaLL

[Asmodeus]

to satisfy your curiosity ..
in the logs that path posted where Allanon is apologizing and feeling all crappy because Zauper played him.

<_> is me "Asmodeus"
path did that because i wasn't home yet.. to give specific permission to post my name.. but it's fine i don't care.

but while we're on the subject of those logs .. and Allanon is saying that Zauper told him to use him as a scapegoat.. so Allanon now you've retracted that apology from us.. are you now also telling me that the apology was fake? so yet that is MORE lies from you?

you guys can say 10,001 times that we agreed to give you a retal.. but that is also lies! lies! lies!

yes zauper and caid did ask for it alot! but Allanon you yourself tried to play the buffer on that going back and talking to them telling them to let it go .. you even referenced some other deal gone bad over someone who kept demanding a retal when they were told they weren't going to get one.
well now you can add this to your list.. because we never agreed to give them a damn retal..



and you oddessy folks and your logic really is funny to me..

here's the gist of it all

wether you say we broke NAP or you cancelled it or whatever..
one thing is plainly obvious.. You began hits on several HaLL Banks.
your kingdom also threw several hits at several different hall kingdoms.
and then you cry about double hostile? hehe.. you are the one that got yourself into that double hostile.. not us.

that's got to be the most idiotic complaint i've ever heard..

that's like me going and giving 6 hits to Rage .. 6 hits to Trinity 6 hits to Sanctuary .. and then complaining when all 3 of them wave me.

get real zauper and oddessy crew.

[Hurlin]

Hitting into fw without a reason is considered wrong.

why ?

I've never understood this .... if you're in a fake war you should be given the same protection and consideration as if you are in a real war ?

Why ?

Your fake warring

Personally I believe if it can be proven to be a fake war your open to whatever is available.

[stoffi]

why ?

I've never understood this .... if you're in a fake war you should be given the same protection and consideration as if you are in a real war ?

Why ?

Your fake warring

Personally I believe if it can be proven to be a fake war your open to what the **** ever is available.

Well, it depends. If you got a beef with that kd, it's okay. But hitting a bank just sitting in fw to pump def or pump a prov or whatever, will cause anger to occur. But on the other hand, banking is different that normal provs.
If a bank uses a fw to massively explore, I wouldn't mind hitting in.

But if the fakewarring kd has done nothing to upset the attacker and is doing nothing that can threaten the attacker, I would say hitting into fakewar is considered bad and will cause hatred and anger.




But yeah, like VT2 said, it seems this debate is over, finally.

[Hurlin]

So basically your saying because it has the word "war" tagged on the end of it then anyone can sit in a fake war and pump up their province in safety ......

It used to be if you where caught pumping in a fake war then you where basically
caught with your pants down ....... and an legitimate open target.

Only position of safety is within a real war or alliance war ...... if what your saying is the norm within certain playing levels of utopia ..... well that's just **** and I'm glad I don't play within that upper echelon of crappola

[Zauper]

you guys can say 10,001 times that we agreed to give you a retal.. but that is also lies! lies! lies!

From the logs I've been given:

[05:39] <&Allanon> first off is our concern over the "target" that was given. The agreement was if a viable alternative was offered, we would take that instead of a free retal. However, the target offered was neither viable, nor would have resulted in equal gains for land lost
[05:40] <&Allanon> also, no intel was offered to suggest that effort had been made into meeting these requirements
[05:40] <Darkmoore> Mr_Caid works fine for me.. he ist 1 meter from me
[05:40] <Darkmoore> you just need to show you are the boss
[05:40] <Darkmoore> well asmo did that intel part
[05:40] <Darkmoore> and I heared no complaints
[05:40] <Darkmoore> so not much I can say to that
[05:41] <@Mr_Caid> I asked for intel.
[05:41] <@Mr_Caid> He said no mana.
[05:41] <@Mr_Caid> ...
[05:41] <Darkmoore> well instead of waitint that many hours.. I have been here all the time talked with all of you
[05:41] <@zapanap> I had been under the impression that we were being given a retal.
[05:41] <Darkmoore> beside that.. that target is not the main problem
[05:41] <Darkmoore> that can be fixed
[05:42] <Darkmoore> more concerns?

Flat out. I said we were under the impression we were being given a retal, darkmoore says it can be fixed. You'll note that the ingame CF had been agreed on 5 hours earlier -- so clearly it wasn't an impediment.

yes zauper and caid did ask for it alot! but Allanon you yourself tried to play the buffer on that going back and talking to them telling them to let it go .. you even referenced some other deal gone bad over someone who kept demanding a retal when they were told they weren't going to get one.
well now you can add this to your list.. because we never agreed to give them a damn retal..

Looks clearcut to me.

wether you say we broke NAP or you cancelled it or whatever..
one thing is plainly obvious.. You began hits on several HaLL Banks.
your kingdom also threw several hits at several different hall kingdoms.
and then you cry about double hostile? hehe.. you are the one that got yourself into that double hostile.. not us.

When someone says they're going to GB you, of course you're going to hit them.

If HoH wants to retal, that's fine -- they're welcome to retal. However, it's another thing for them to wait until a week+ after they've been hit, when we're in hostile with another kingdom, and then retal.

My kingdom 'threw several hits at several hall kingdoms'. When you say that, do you mean that we retalled HoGA's several hits on us, which were made in retal for a hit we made on a different HaLL kingdom? p.s. guess you were lying when you said HaLL would not longer have one kingdom retal for another ;)

that's got to be the most idiotic complaint i've ever heard..

that's like me going and giving 6 hits to Rage .. 6 hits to Trinity 6 hits to Sanctuary .. and then complaining when all 3 of them wave me.

get real zauper and oddessy crew.

I wasn't aware we made 6 hits on any kingdom in your alliance, except for force and HoGA.

And, if you made 6 hits on one of them, and they went to FW, and then waved you a week later after you put 8 hits on another abs kd, you would complain.

Stoffi:
Players get upset whenever you hit them. There's nothing special about hitting them while they're in a FW that justifies alliance action.

[stoffi]

Hey Zauper.

You forgot to comment my logs that says you are lying, from Allanon's mouth. You got no case, you're only left with greed that slapped you in your face. If I were you, I'd ignore this thread and let it be, instead of trying to lie anymore. Utopia can see who you truly are now, greed is a vicious thing.

[Allanon KT]

Still doesn't explain how you can claim to not be targeting us when I have hits still incoming from 2:30 regularly, as well as 13:33 and 4:18 in my paper

[Zauper]

Hey Zauper.

You forgot to comment my logs that says you are lying, from Allanon's mouth. You got no case, you're only left with greed that slapped you in your face. If I were you, I'd ignore this thread and let it be, instead of trying to lie anymore. Utopia can see who you truly are now, greed is a vicious thing.

Hi Stoffi.

Allanon was lying to you guys to get a deal. That's why I don't bother looking at or commenting on your logs. I told him to do what it takes to make a deal and not risk his neck for me. He repeated that himself earlier in this thread.

I posted proof of the deal being broken by you guys above, and your response is to say 'oh, that must be a lie'? The log I posted I got from Allanon.

Glanced at your logs now. They just say that he asked me to wait before he hit. I admitted that he did. I explained why I hit anyways. Calling me a liar isn't actually refuting my arguments.

You also haven't refuted the simple fact:
If I were greedy, why wouldn't I have hit Fratzia? Topfeeding for 800a vs bottomfeeding for 200a.

[Raywre]

nah i think utopia just dont care lol

for me you all look like liar in this story Oo

Is it worth it to prove that someone is worts then other ...

[stoffi]

Hi Stoffi.

Allanon was lying to you guys to get a deal. That's why I don't bother looking at or commenting on your logs. I told him to do what it takes to make a deal and not risk his neck for me. He repeated that himself earlier in this thread.

I posted proof of the deal being broken by you guys above, and your response is to say 'oh, that must be a lie'? The log I posted I got from Allanon.

Glanced at your logs now. They just say that he asked me to wait before he hit. I admitted that he did. I explained why I hit anyways. Calling me a liar isn't actually refuting my arguments.

You also haven't refuted the simple fact:
If I were greedy, why wouldn't I have hit Fratzia? Topfeeding for 800a vs bottomfeeding for 200a.

The logs clearly state that there was a CF to break, you claim there never was a CF.
I got lots of logs that clearly state that a CF was in place.

Allanon broke the CF for whatever reason he had and he gave notice 48 hours before like one is supposed to. You however, got greedy and grabbed right away, targetting HaLL banks.


You can post a million arguments about who hit who and blah blah blah, but this is what it comes down to. You broke CF terms by hitting right away even though Allanon desperately tried to get you to honor CF rules, targetting HaLL as an alliance.

After you did this, you were/are free game. Lie all you want, facts will always slap you in the face like your greed does.
You got what you deserved and we hit your prov down. Try honoring CF deals next time, hold your greed back. Though you won't ever get a CF with any HaLL kd again. We don't CF liars and backstabbers.

[VT2]

I wish I was top enough to engage in this ******ry.

[Zauper]

The logs clearly state that there was a CF to break, you claim there never was a CF.
I got lots of logs that clearly state that a CF was in place.

Allanon broke the CF for whatever reason he had and he gave notice 48 hours before like one is supposed to. You however, got greedy and grabbed right away, targetting HaLL banks.

I never said there wasn't a CF in place.

I said:
HaLL broke the terms of the CF

You can post a million arguments about who hit who and blah blah blah, but this is what it comes down to. You broke CF terms by hitting right away even though Allanon desperately tried to get you to honor CF rules, targetting HaLL as an alliance.

HaLL broke the terms so I hit them. You say I broke the terms so you hit me. In saying this, you conceed you broke the terms first, which means there was no deal in place for me to break. :)

After you did this, you were/are free game. Lie all you want, facts will always slap you in the face like your greed does.

What fact? The fact that you broke the deal? What greed? Like I said -- greed would have been making the big hit, not the small hit.

btw, wtf are 'cf rules'. There were no terms for what to do if the CF is broken in the CF. That's why there are no 'rules'. It's not like we agreed to 24h notice in the CF.

You got what you deserved and we hit your prov down. Try honoring CF deals next time, hold your greed back. Though you won't ever get a CF with any HaLL kd again. We don't CF liars and backstabbers.

You just have them in your alliance?

I honor every deal any in my kingdom makes for me in good confidence. I don't honor deals after someone else breaks them.

Like I said -- I play with the golden rule. I treat people the way they treat me. Your alliance leader has broken deals with me in the past, given that your alliance had already broken the deal I saw no reason to be more generous that I already had been.

[stoffi]

You can tell a lie 100 times and it still won't be true, you'll still be a deal-breaker, a liar and greedy.


People, this is what happens when you get too greedy. It will slap you in your face.

[MrCaid]

Stoffi, if you can't find the decency to reply to an argument, then why are you even here? You just want to shout that people lie. You have no ground to support your claim since you don't even bother to weigh arguments.

In the teachings of the argument, this is considered a fallacy. All I can say is that you revolve to the fallacy of accident, irrelevant conclusions and solely go with the argumentum ad hominem.

Also, the whole "greedy" part is just a Non Sequitur. You assume one followed the other, where there is no reason to assume so.

-it's been a long night

[stoffi]

Stoffi, if you can't find the decency to reply to an argument, then why are you even here? You just want to shout that people lie. You have no ground to support your claim since you don't even bother to weigh arguments.

In the teachings of the argument, this is considered a fallacy. All I can say is that you revolve to the fallacy of accident, irrelevant conclusions and solely go with the argumentum ad hominem.

Also, the whole "greedy" part is just a Non Sequitur. You assume one followed the other, where there is no reason to assume so.

-it's been a long night

MrCaid, I have yet to see a shred of evidence for the CF not being a CF. The leader of your alliance felt it was a CF, HaLL felt it was a CF. Zauper also felt it was a CF, but lately he has come up with this nonsence to make his betrayal just.

All parts treated it as a NAP/CF. Zauper included, which I have logs that proves.

Please produce one single log that says otherwise.

You have no case.

Zauper even admitted that he broke the NAP because Darkmoore allegedly broke a NAP 99 ages ago. How can that be, when zauper claims he never broke a nap in other posts....


Anyways, I am done discussing with you. You burp out alot of lies without backing anything up.

As I have shown, Zauper's former alliance leader, Allanon, also feels Zauper broke the NAP because of greed. Both parts agree on this. There is nothing more to discuss really.

You are both just upset because you risked it all on 1 bad card and lost. Greed is a ***** and it will come slap you in the face for as long as you play.


Good day to you.