Trade Codes

[VT2]

People should be able to conver their abandoned provinces to move-codes.

[Mourhelm]

Trade codes are ****ing useless, I lost two accounts at the start of the age because I decided to do it legally and trade in some one using those silly things of coarse it all ****ed up and I lost the accounts.

With the info needed to legally trade an account why would you ?

The info needed is enough to make the account a Kingdom owned account and not take the risk of it ****ing up and loosing the account.

I wont ever legally trade an account again with this stupid system, I've traded 1000's of account over the last ten years and have only ever lost two .... two I did with this stupid legal system !

1. You need less info to trade an account legally. You only need the user name, location and trade code.
2. If you trade legally you can trade without worrying of getting the province deleted because you changed the country of the player. This gives you more flexibility when trading.
3. Your lack of technical skills doesn't mean that trade code are useless. It does mean that the mechanism is too complicated/confusing and should be simplified.
4. I, like many other kingdoms, traded this age without losing the accounts. This is not a general problem, but a specific problem with you and your kingdom.

---

That's exactly my point, only top kingdoms with long recruiting reach benefit from trade codes. And I think a top kd who can maintain the same 25 players deserves more than a top kd who has to use trade codes to fill existing provs. IMO if you can't maintain the 25 players, then you lose the province, and have to move in a new one and start over.

Legal trading (moves) is good for the game, taking over existing provinces is not.

You raise a good point, but your solution to change the trades into moves does more than just fix this problem (I already addressed why changing the trades into moves is not a good idea in the other links on the subject).

Solving the issue you present without changing the trades into moves is simple. Just reset the provinces after the trade.

[Hurlin]

[1]You need less info to trade an account legally. You only need the user name, location and trade code.

You need both party's to be in contact with each other.

One party needs to supply all the details of the account to OMAC for the other party to supply their details as well to OMAC to safely take control of the account.

When you add a third person into that recipe taking into account language barriers your doomed.

I can take all the info OMAC needs and have complete control of the account giving ownership to who and when ever I want safely.

[2]If you trade legally you can trade without worrying of getting the province deleted because you changed the country of the player. This gives you more flexibility when trading.

I never ever change country ...... most of the time I try to keep it same city ....... If I get a speed hump (ie less populated country for utopia such as a swiss account ....... or south african account ....) I transfer the account too another country that will fill my roster !

[3]Your lack of technical skills doesn't mean that trade code are useless. It does mean that the mechanism is too complicated/confusing and should be simplified.

Pfffft its got nothing to do with lack of technical skill I had both people in IRC the previous owner and the new one; talking to each other on the first day we could use the trade account option.
Both are English speakers, both Australians, so same language same time zone understanding what was needed and how to change over the accounts.
I was also in that channel monitoring to make sure it was done correctly and it still ****ed up .... they both emailed OMAC repeatedly with no response until OOP happened and the accounts where lost .....

[4]I, like many other kingdoms, traded this age without losing the accounts. This is not a general problem, but a specific problem with you and your kingdom.

I moved accounts ...... did the first three straight away with no issue at all .... trading ****ed up ...... if it wasn't a general problem why did rosilan post a message at the start of the age saying people with problems trading contact her ?

[Jobolob]

or Omac should just give out move codes instead. VT2 is right.

[VT2]

I demand that all my trades change into moves.

[Mourhelm]

You need both party's to be in contact with each other.

Exactly as in the old trades.

One party needs to supply all the details of the account to OMAC for the other party to supply their details as well to OMAC to safely take control of the account.

Wrong.
You need the one trading out to input the trade code and give his username and kingdom location to the one trading in.
The one trading in needs to input the username, kingdom location and trade code.

The fact that both need to have a master accounts is irrelevant to trading.

In the old trades, to trade you had to the take from the player trading out these details (at the very least):

1. Country
2. Username
3. Password

And these details if you wanted to be extra safe:

1. Email
2. City
3. Postal code
4. real name (as entered when he registered)
5. DOB

When you add a third person into that recipe taking into account language barriers your doomed.

Kingdoms who trade usually did that with the knowledge of their leader (who was the third person involved), so OMAC didn't add people to the process.

I can take all the info OMAC needs and have complete control of the account giving ownership to who and when ever I want safely.

I never ever change country ...... most of the time I try to keep it same city ....... If I get a speed hump (ie less populated country for utopia such as a swiss account ....... or south african account ....) I transfer the account too another country that will fill my roster !

You contradict yourself. You say you can switch owernership to whoever and whenever you want, but then say you only do it in the same city.

If you could have traded safely you would just do it regardless of where the players live.

Now you can really trade safely which means the trade codes are better.

Pfffft its got nothing to do with lack of technical skill I had both people in IRC the previous owner and the new one; talking to each other on the first day we could use the trade account option.
Both are English speakers, both Australians, so same language same time zone understanding what was needed and how to change over the accounts.
I was also in that channel monitoring to make sure it was done correctly and it still ****ed up .... they both emailed OMAC repeatedly with no response until OOP happened and the accounts where lost .....

Either you did something wrong because you lack the technical skills, or OMAC had a bug with the implementation of the trade mechanism.

As I said before - all it means is that the mechanism is too complicated/confusing and should be simplified.

I moved accounts ...... did the first three straight away with no issue at all .... trading ****ed up ...... if it wasn't a general problem why did rosilan post a message at the start of the age saying people with problems trading contact her ?

If there is a bug, it should be fixed. Trade codes shouldn't be changed into moves because of a bug.

[VT2]

It doesn't matter if legal trading is easier or safer than illegal trading, because moves are easier, safer, and smoother than both types of trades.

That's why we want moves, and not trades.

[Mourhelm]

VT2, I know why you want moves instead of trades. We discussed it in two other threads. I also told you why I think it's a bad idea.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=574844
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=574986

[VT2]

And I don't care if it's a bad idea or a good idea - neither do most others.
In fact, if it was possible to trade trades for moves, you could have all my trades for the low, low price of one of your moves.

What keeps that from being a realistic deal isn't so much the fact that it's not possible to trade one for the other, but the fact that you're most likely just as out of moves as I.

[Hurlin]

Exactly as in the old trades.




You contradict yourself. You say you can switch owernership to whoever and whenever you want, but then say you only do it in the same city.

I did not contradict myself I said if possible I try to keep it same city.

re read what I posted and do not put words in my mouth !

I can see replying to you is like banging my head against the wall ... I think trades are worthless and should be scraped for moves ... you don't we each have our own views .

Mine of corse are correct =)

I would love OMAC to do a quick head count and see how many Kingdoms have trade codes unused compared to move codes, I think we would see a huge difference.

[Jobolob]

The fact is Kingdoms like mine that have 22 provinces have no need for trades. NO ONE is leaving. I get unactivated provinces that get deleted before they are even oop. How does a trade help me? This is the problem to fill my Kingdom up I need moves. I cant ask these noob unactivated provinces to trade now can I?

F*@& The trade system regardless of whether it works or not they are LOTS of people out there that cannot use them at all.

[VT2]

I haven't been in a position where I feel the need to seriously consider usage of trade-codes this age.
It's got something to do with never having had a full roster of active players.

[Mourhelm]

And I don't care if it's a bad idea or a good idea - neither do most others.
In fact, if it was possible to trade trades for moves, you could have all my trades for the low, low price of one of your moves.

What keeps that from being a realistic deal isn't so much the fact that it's not possible to trade one for the other, but the fact that you're most likely just as out of moves as I.

I already responded to these kind of posts in the other threads.

I did not contradict myself I said if possible I try to keep it same city.

re read what I posted and do not put words in my mouth !

OK, you don't contradict yourself. Please explain why do you try to keep your trades in the same city instead of trading in the best player you can find?

I can see replying to you is like banging my head against the wall ... I think trades are worthless and should be scraped for moves ... you don't we each have our own views .

That was a great reply.

Mine of corse are correct =)

I would love OMAC to do a quick head count and see how many Kingdoms have trade codes unused compared to move codes, I think we would see a huge difference.

That was a stupid reply. Saying you are correct doesn't make you correct.

The fact that people have unused trade codes only means their kingdoms don't need to trade because none of their players are leaving at the moment.

Trades are not supposed to help your kingdom get a full crew! They are only there to maintain the number of players in a kingdom. Before trades were legalized, kingdoms were trading illegally to get the same effect.

Replacing randoms was only possible if you were able to get them to give you the account info. Now you need to ask them for less info and use the legal trades.

Only technicalities have changed.

I hope my explanation about trades and their purpose is clear.

[Mourhelm]

The fact is Kingdoms like mine that have 22 provinces have no need for trades. NO ONE is leaving. I get unactivated provinces that get deleted before they are even oop. How does a trade help me? This is the problem to fill my Kingdom up I need moves. I cant ask these noob unactivated provinces to trade now can I?

F*@& The trade system regardless of whether it works or not they are LOTS of people out there that cannot use them at all.

I'll quote myself since I see you don't read the other threads on the subject...

You are missing the point of the new trading system.

In the not so old days, kingdoms used illegal trades to keep their kingdoms filled with active players (once they got to 25 players). Before they got to 25 players they had to work to get people willing to give up their accounts to the kingdom.

Now, kingdoms can move a few players in so it'll be easier to build the kingdom. The point is not to make it possible to build a kingdom from scratch without any randoms or work. The building process of a kingdom is almost the same as before, only with less cheating involved (you can legally trade and move some players in).

The point of the trades is that kingdoms with 25 players can now keep their kingdom filled with active players without resorting to cheating (with illegal trades).

If you increase the amount of moves you will only make it harder for new players since they wont be able to find a reasonable kingdom to join.

If you reduce the amount of trades you'll only make kingdoms use the old way of illegal trading.

So, if you whine about the advantage that the top kingdoms get by being able to trade more easily, the only change to be made is to reduce the amount of trades.

PS
I'd love to get more moves so I could build my kingdom faster, but I just don't think increasing the amount of moves is the right thing to do.

[Mourhelm]

I haven't been in a position where I feel the need to seriously consider usage of trade-codes this age.
It's got something to do with never having had a full roster of active players.

Not having a full roster doesn't mean you can't use trades.

You never traded before (illegally) so you need some lessons about it.

I never convinced people to give me their account info, but I saw how it's done.

1. You start talking to a random and see if he responds (if he doesn't, kill him).
2. Assuming he's not a good player you want, you explain to him that you are trying to build a kingdom that will be able to compete.
3. You ask him for a trade (if he refuses, kill him)

You need some people skills to get people to agree for a trade.

If you'll tell someone that he's a ****ing idiot that can't play, I doubt he'll do anything for you.

If you want to know exactly how to approach a random, ask someone like Catwalk, who did it a few times himself.

Good luck!