Avians and -10% Gains

[Demascus]

Okay this is gonna br messy because I know what I'm thinking I just can't seem to figure out how to word it so please bear with me on this please.

The situation I'm thinking of is chaining down provinces in war with a core set of Avians. Start off with your avains chaining down your targets, but they have their -10% GAINS, but the military losses stay the same. Would this be a smart way to open your chain targets up for max gains for your littler guys?

Thought behind this is that the target will lose his regular amount of troops per hit, but will retain more land making him fat, opening him up to your smaller guys for big(ger) grabs, as well as helping push him down the chain line.

Is this kinda a smart idea or am I nucking futs?

[Persain]

The situation I'm thinking of is chaining down provinces in war with a core set of Avians.

follow you here,

Start off with your avains chaining down your targets, but they have their -10% GAINS, but the military losses stay the same.

and here, ie your chaining but each it is -10%, normal losses.

however

Would this be a smart way to open your chain targets up for max gains for your littler guys?

what are you trying to say here? that the people in YOUR kd that got chained should max gain instead of hitting chains?

[Palem]

He's thinking opening chains with avians will give getter gains for the lower end of the kd that finishes the chain.


Yes, it would do that but why would you want that? The bottom end of wars are filled with unsecured/unstable acres with provs that are usually sitting on 99% offense and everyone quad/quint tapping each other. Try and keep the acres at the top where they're safe imo.

[Demascus]

He's thinking opening chains with avians will give getter gains for the lower end of the kd that finishes the chain.

This.

But I play in a ghetto of ghettos where "effective" chaining doesn't happen. Its only half assed. It would work great if the second half of the KD would follow through. So that's where this whole thought process comes into play. But I do fully agree with Palem.

[Persain]

He's thinking opening chains with avians will give getter gains for the lower end of the kd that finishes the chain.

This.

ah... agreed with palem then, keep the acres safe at the top.


Another reason is that if your kd cant chain from say 2000->400 in 15 min but your typical chain takes a a few hours the more land you take to begin with the more defense will dessert and the better chance you have of double/triple tapping with your later hits.

[nooblet]

Palem is right.

Still, there is no good way around the gains penalty... your avians will make the same hits they would without it, regardless of their position in the kingdom charts. Avian has advantages at holding on their gains though, and that might give incentive to let Avians get first crack at a target over something like Orc, Undead, or Human, two of whom are very prone to Ambush without anonymity. In ghettoes ordering chains is often too problematic, especially if you have races with differing attack times as a war drags on, which is why a lot of stronger kingdoms just use all Avians... Avian doesn't go well with most attacker races...

I wouldn't worry too much about that and order hits strictly by networth, if I can do so at all.

[Demascus]

Fair enough, how about in this situation:

Ghetto bashing ghetto. Its the KDs first age together, you have about 6-7 experienced players who are rather active and teaching new players the ropes. Apparently in this situation you can't even begin tto expect to bring in chaining as a method of war. So you pretty much turn to max gains.

You have your 5 biggest attackers as your active players who are your Avians. Assuming these people don't have a problem setting alarm clocks to help the KD learn/grow, would it be an option for those 5 to run whatever small chain they can on a target, then, after those 5 hit the target within the same hour, open him up for max gains to the rest of the KD. Proceed to do that to 2-3 more provinces and then have the KD just top out with max gains.

Mind you, this isn't a top 50, but the bottom 50 were talking about, where most of our time is going into teaching/helping new players out (leading by example will take place in part of all of this too)

[Palem]

Discussing strategy for low end warring is pretty fruitless. At that level, 99% of wars come down to whichever kd is more active; which one can pump out more hits. Beyond that it doesn't really matter what you do besides being productive on some level.

[nooblet]

If your kingdom is too disorganized to chain right, better not to chain at all and maxgain everything.

I'd figure many kingdoms would do better if they maxgained all war instead of trying to chain.

[Realest]

^ that

[I_am_Spartacus]

^ above that

[E_Boko]

just feel like mentioning it, there is a minimum gain so regardless of being avian or whatever you always get that. i believe its 3% for march and 1% for learns in war.

[jenian]

For low end war kd max gains is the only reliable strategy... Chaining only works for extremely active kd.. Takes skill... Just give out three targets in nw and DOS range of.your nw spread and have them max gain...

[gergnub]

For low end war kd max gains is the only reliable strategy... Chaining only works for extremely active kd.. Takes skill... Just give out three targets in nw and DOS range of.your nw spread and have them max gain...

thats not max gaining, thats crappy chaining. just have everyone hit for best gains, very simple.

[Shifty11]

Well on the math scale of things, their (Avians) 10% reduced gains are offset by their 30% faster attacks.
So you essentially do 90% damage at 130% attack speed. So finding the lowest common denominator, in the time a non avian makes 10th attacks, avians make 13 attacks. Which is equivalent to 11.7 attacks of equal gains. In this particular scenario that is equivalent to 17% increased gains. Immediately you may gain less, but less can be taken from you since there isn't as much to retrieve.