Age 55 potential changes

[Azartyn]

ok Palem, you know what...maybe what is being said about Fay's being OP'd as a race is incorrect. How about what they have access to is OP'd. SPELLS that fays have access to are OP'd. Is that better? Fireball is overpowered, MS is overpowered(kills everything except wizards) NS is overpowered. Why should NS kill troops that aren't at home. How can something be hit when it isnt there? Why not limit what the fay has access to as well as an honor penalty(-30% honor since that seems to be the bonus you get on everything else). It seems that its only going to get worse next age if what I read that caps are going to be raised.

[plm-kun]

delay in posting final changes is OP!
its so obvious, u dont even have to run the numbers ! :P

[tiggis]

Saying something is over powered is fine if it is.
All it means is that it is too effected based on the options to counter it.

The fact that it is effective is assumed. The fact that is is designed to be effective is assumed.

[John Snowstorm]

ITT: palem gets mad that people keep pointing out that faery is OP so that it gets a nerf.

[Ahab]

Final changes please to save us from having to read this thread.

[khronosschoty]

Well after really thinking over these changes, which I more or less like, I think I would throw out there that I think Avian would be better as a A/m. I do like the concept of Avians as a thief, but, its not very practical.

So just to be clear: I'm suggesting giving bonuses to Avian that make it A/m and not A/t.

[Palem]

ok Palem, you know what...maybe what is being said about Fay's being OP'd as a race is incorrect. How about what they have access to is OP'd. SPELLS that fays have access to are OP'd. Is that better? Fireball is overpowered, MS is overpowered(kills everything except wizards) NS is overpowered.

I agree that FB is stronger than it should be.
Faeries don't have access to MS, but either way I'm not sure if I'd call it OP.
NS is by no means OP.

Why not limit what the fay has access to as well as an honor penalty(-30% honor since that seems to be the bonus you get on everything else). It seems that its only going to get worse next age if what I read that caps are going to be raised.

My views on honor are clear. I'd rather see it removed. It's a broken, stupid mechanic. But hey if they want to throw an honor penalty on Faery, whatever. The stupid faery honor whores should be penalized.

Saying something is over powered is fine if it is.
All it means is that it is too effected based on the options to counter it.

I agree that if something is OP, call it OP.

Faeries aren't OP.

ITT: palem gets mad that people keep pointing out that faery is OP so that it gets a nerf.

Then kindly explain to me how Faeries are OP jss. Because not one person has been able to do so.

Too much defense? Conquest+Bouncewaves
Too good at thievery? Halfling is better
Too good at magic? Elf is better
Unstopable? Hardly
Too good of honor whores and honor produces absolutely OP numbers? I'm happy to agree to that. Honor sucks, but that doesn't mean Faery is OP. It means honor is OP and broken.

[plm-kun]

the final proof of faery being Op is that TFC has not lost a war yet! :P

[reQi]

ok Palem, you know what...maybe what is being said about Fay's being OP'd as a race is incorrect. How about what they have access to is OP'd. SPELLS that fays have access to are OP'd. Is that better? Fireball is overpowered, MS is overpowered(kills everything except wizards) NS is overpowered. Why should NS kill troops that aren't at home. How can something be hit when it isnt there?

uhm...
FB is available to everyone. NS is available to everyone.
MS isnt even available to faeries unless they are Mystics. it is NOT a racial spell.
Faeries only have racial spells (+the ones everyone else has)

[khronosschoty]

MS is not too powerful and it does not need to be nerfed! If FB is OP -- it is not by much. T/M mages need to stop be targeted for nerf action. Of course I'm not against balance and if everyone gets nerfed in a balanced way: I do not necessarily make complaints. So what I am trying to articulate is: I am voicing my fear that people are tying to make T/M so weak that they just get trashed with little to no inconvenience to the attackers.

[Foul]

At 3000 acres a single spell of MS capable of destroying 400-600 elites and specs + equal amount of peasants each tic is balanced? MS alone ensures a province won't recover. It's absurdly powerful.

I don't mind having a spell like that in the game, but I would suggest increasing it's runecost by 300% while slightly lowering MV rune costs.

Anyway I love the proposed game mechanic changes. Miss a bit of flavour changes to races/personas though.

[Mal]

Would really like final changes so I can get started planning next age out.

[AceOfFrag]

I think 95% of players would say they could live with faery if they couldn't choose mystic, or if mystic was nerfed for faeries only; so they did not have access to MS spell in its present configuration- any other province has a weakness to be reasonably exploited and allows the team to take them down.

As a fae mystic for a number of ages. I can tell you I am nearly unkillable, by any non-SK.. .Your thieves can barely get through to ever steal my runes-4 tpa+ TD+ CS, your evles can't often if ever LS me between my own mods and RM, I am realistically unbreakable and if you chain me early in the war, I still have me dragon fodder ospecs for ambush and manna for LL, heck I don't mind getting land dropped a bit :) and suiciding on me opens most other players up for at least double if not triples. The 5-6 prewar massacres I am used to, but trust me my TB is + millions, and I am expecting it. I run 8 wpa, prior to war, then get fed troops and gc back to rebuild my thieves and can live with dspecs. Count and its mods are fairly reasonable in utopia.
- maybe no honor bonuses might slow me down.

[nooblet]

Faery... is... supposed... to... be... unkillable.

You have to take it up with the devs whether a race that's designed to be unkillable is good for the game. Until then there's no real argument on the matter of Faeries being breakable. If Faeries are nerfed slightly so that they are easily breakable, their value to a kingdom drops to practically nothing, unless they gain attack capabilities back - which would necessitate a stronger elite offense, probably 4/6, and swapping -generals for -10% population or some other penalty.

[Fallow]

Palem you ignore so many things.

Faery not OP? You continously say that honor is broken and so on, but no other race other can gain and keep a hold of honor as good as Faery... Yes there are other races on the honor charts too but 60%+ are Faery. There is a reason WHY they are able to get that honor and keep it, it is because compared to other races they are almost impossible to break on all fronts.... They have great DPA with their Elite which makes it so you have to suicide as an attacker to break them which almost noone does because it just isn't worth the hassle, that is seen EVERY war... Faery always go ignored because it just isn't worth trying to op them. They have awesome WPA and TPA, yes two other races have 20% better WPA and TPA but in almost 90% of cases they end up having the same TPA and WPA if not the Faery having more and with access to all spells giving the Faery even more defence with the likes of CS and RM etc, and hell even if either of those races did manage to get a higher TPA or WPA they will be out matched in the other weakness with Halfling having weaker WPA and Elf weaker TPA not to mention the fact their DPA would start to suffer then too!

Everyone keeps giving you examples why they are OP, YES you CAN break them but given how damn difficult it is no one ever bothers which (like I said) happens every war I have been in (5 this age)… Our Faeries are ignored and so are the other KDs Faeries because each and every time it is agreed they are simply too difficult to break on all fronts, so instead of waste our time and risk getting pummelled for suiciding, or for our T/Ms spending countless Stealth and Mana failing it is all simply directed at attackers/breakable provinces.

And screaming that honor needs to be changed isn't the answer, honor doesn't make any other race other than Faery super OP.