Automatic War Ending(What do you think?)

[JackRabbitSlim]

I thought I would restart a thread to allow people to voice their opinions on whether a Kingdom should get a War Win or a Mutual Peace after getting another Kingdom to 1/2 their Networth in a War. It seems like a very controversial issue within the Utopian gaming community. Many people had drawn the incorrect conclusion that, if you were able to beat a Kingdom bad enough to get their Networth to 1/2 of your Kingdoms, then you would get an automatic War Win on your record. I feel like this should be the case also. But the guide does NOT state that this will happen.

The Guide is fairly clear on the matter. It states that "There is only one way to win - if the opposite Kingdom withdraw from war." This can be found, in the Guide under the section, "Relations/Ending a War/Victory". I think the reason many people thought this was a way to get an automatic War Win was because of the placement of the text that actually explains what happens when 1/2 the other Kingdoms Networth is reached.

There are several sections under the sub-section "Ending a War".
There is:
1. MUTUAL PEACE with an explanation.
2. WITHDRAWAL with an explanation.
3. VICTORY with an explanation.
4. END-OF-WAR CEASEFIRE with an explanation.

According to everyone that has knowledge of the workings of the Auto-whatever that happens at 1/2 the NW of the other Kingdom, it seems that it is an Automatic Mutual Peace that comes about. I fully understand this. BUT, the problem I have, and I think it is what has caused alot of the confusion is, the explanation is listed under the section for "2. WITHDRAWAL", not under section "1. MUTUAL PEACE". So I think that is why many people, including myself at first, have drawn the conclusion that you will get an Automatic War Win. The solution is simple. Just move some stuff around in the Guide.

But I also think that the biggest point most people have is this. If you are able to beat a Kingdom down so that their NW is 1/2 of your Kingdoms NW, then you deserve a War Win, not a Mutual Peace. So I think more than just the location of the explanation needs to be changed. The entire outcome needs to be changed. It is only fair that after a Kingdom has fought hard enough to get another Kingdom down to 1/2 their NW, a War Win is in order.

I know this opens up a whole new can of worms for discussion concerning possible War Terms that can be drawn up PRIOR to the start of a War that would give a Victory to one side or the other automatically if they are reached. I think that may be for another thread entirely. I don' know.

[Palem]

I'm ok with the MP-ending to a NW-victory. It's yet another factor pushing people to war more qualified kds. You shouldn't get mega-rewarded for beating the hell out of a kd that you clearly had no business warring. If you're getting a NW-victory then you've gained a bunch of resources already. Take your winnings and go after a kd that will actually give you a fight.

[Minty]

At the same time you might come into the war on even conditions and still beat the crap out of them based on strategy. If the loosing kingdom clearly have lost fair and square but choose not to withdraw out of spite, the winning kd shouldn't get tricked out of their bonus.

[Palem]

Again, if your strategy is so far out of this galaxy that you nw-win against a kd, you need to change neighborhoods and start playing with the big boys that can actually match your strategy.

[Mormon]

NW wins definitely don't happen because one kd is just so amazingly better than their opponent, they happen because 1 kd is butthurt and doesn't want to withdraw. Allowing kd's to benefit from being mega butthurt doesn't sound ideal

[punk2001]

I agree with the war win.. Not mp. Like mormon said theirs no reason why the winning kd should be cheated out of the win bonus or the title of war win. If one kd is warring another which it had no business warring in the first place, the lesser kd should not agree to war or should not give the greater kd the war button.

[crease]

NW wins definitely don't happen because one kd is just so amazingly better than their opponent, they happen because 1 kd is butthurt and doesn't want to withdraw. Allowing kd's to benefit from being mega butthurt doesn't sound ideal

There is no winning from being forced to 50% of your opponents nw and getting an MP from a losing war. Its just spite. That being said, the winning kd can let the smaller kd sit on 60% nw and farm all the science and hnour it wants, you can raze some of your acres to do this, and take that as your victory bonus.

[Milkman]

Honestly I think that a warwin should be the reward. If you out perform your oponents to the point you hit them to the point that you hit them to 50% of your nw you're clearly the better kd and deserve the win. Also there are kingdoms out there who value the WW crown and can lose that race due to their oponents being butthurt and force an mp on them by getting hit to 50% of their nw.

[Bishop]

You already get a win.

[JackRabbitSlim]

I did not realize this had been fixed. Thank you for explaining it Bishop.