Anything interesting happening?

[WhenWeCollide]

We are being punished for respawning. Had we sent all the aid out and not respawned, there'd be no action.

"Its not a rule violation to respawn." -Bishop

This^

This is where it becomes a problem. It was fine, as long as prov's didn't reset.

[crease]

why do people still think warring on 400 acres is a good idea?

It proves once and for all who is better? All the everyone starts at 400 acres **** is decided here and now!

[noobium]

It proves once and for all who is better? All the everyone starts at 400 acres **** is decided here and now!

It decides who is more able to fight a war of pure activity and no thinking, I guess.

I think it is silly as all hell that kingdoms forgot how to fight early wars and forgot how to plan growth strats all of the sudden.

I'm not a whorer and didn't spend time thinking about every angle, but I would think 25 active and functional provinces are better than 23 slightly-more-functional provinces and 2 reset provinces, assuming no war or hostile.

[crease]

It decides who is more able to fight a war of pure activity and no thinking, I guess.

I think it is silly as all hell that kingdoms forgot how to fight early wars and forgot how to plan growth strats all of the sudden.

I'm not a whorer and didn't spend time thinking about every angle, but I would think 25 active and functional provinces are better than 23 slightly-more-functional provinces and 2 reset provinces, assuming no war or hostile.

*eyes roll*

[Drixx]

I'm not a whorer and didn't spend time thinking about every angle, but I would think 25 active and functional provinces are better than 23 slightly-more-functional provinces and 2 reset provinces, assuming no war or hostile.

Since pyros was on like 4k def kingdomwide, I don't think Havoc knew it was them or expected them to press war. I also think Havoc obviously didn't think they were abusing becuase they reset those provs in war, accepting the 72 hour protection instead of 24 hour (which came from my suggestion to fix resetting in war).

For RBL, our strategy was predicted on having 4x 1600a provs 48 hours oop, and someone waved us at just the right time to stop it. It only became problematic for us because of the sudden change in stance on resetting provinces, and rather than be viewed as cheaters, we just reset our whole kd (at our cost) and we'll play from there.

I think the whole "cheater cheater" stuff is quite a bit overblown in this thread. CR acted within what were the defined rules at the time. They were punished ex post facto, which I disagree with but I'm not the one who decides the rules nor am I the one who decides whether they should be enforced ex post facto or not. Last age they let a much larger abuse go without fixing it or actioning it at all, so I find it a little odd that 2 provs aiding for a slight military advantage for several other provs was met with such a harsh response, especially given that rationally it is much more abusive to do what was being discussed in the thread last age where Bishop said resetting was not abuse.

[jjofdenmark]

So ... what say you Elit? .. is this a 150 page topic?

[Lurking Ghost]

We are being punished for respawning. Had we sent all the aid out and not respawned, there'd be no action.

"Its not a rule violation to respawn." -Bishop

You were being punished for creating resources. I don't think it's any more complicated than that.
Respawning is just a sideeffect of creating the resources.

If one gave u a button "create gold, military, acres" and told you not to press it, would you still have done it ?

[Godly]

Lurking, it's not free. It comes at a cost.

In our ideal scenario, we gain resources per 24 hrs lost on a prov. It's a good tradeoff that I think is worth it.

After they changed the rules without informing us, we gain resources per 5 days lost on a prov. Pretty much garbage deal. We didn't even complain. We just took it as "**** happens."

That should be punishment enough. We had more disadvantage going into fight with Pyro than advantage. I would have gladly traded those resources for having 2 more provs. This wasn't enough for Pyro to win because they're just really bad at utopia so they had to file a complaint.

Now that we post quotes from Bishop claiming that resetting is not a violation of the rules, he just disappears and pleads the fifth and says things like "those two scenarios are completely different." lol. Yes. In one scenario the guy reset and you said there is no violation for resetting. In this scenario we reset.. oh wait.

The rest of you fools are just bandwagoning like you know anything about utopia and/or are biased. Anyone with a brain can understand that 5 days delay for starting a prov is sufficient deterrent for resetting in protection. There isn't any additional action required. They made the change full well knowing that whoever tried would be monumentally screwed. Now they want to kick dirt on us while we're down.

If we're going to start actioning things under the "spirit of the rules" clause, and the only foundation for actioning things are what Bishop says are actionable, shouldn't the things that Bishop says to be not actionable be.. not actionable?

"Its not a rule violation to respawn." -Bishop 2014

[Anri]

Like i said. Another sad day for utopia. Soon comes a baby, 5 ages old named cJ to give his expertise with underlined and bolded text. Someone like Bishop might listen and sanction another kd.

Stupidly amazing

gg utopia

[American Badass]

You were being punished for creating resources. I don't think it's any more complicated than that.
Respawning is just a sideeffect of creating the resources.

If one gave u a button "create gold, military, acres" and told you not to press it, would you still have done it ?

So why last age when that province in war was abusing aiding resources out before resetting, did that kingdom not receive similar punishments as those dealt out here?

[Godly]

Furthermore, if I release all of my military now and aid it to someone else, then I wait the perfectly legal period of time of 24 hrs to reset, will I be actioned? Or is this only actionable because the aid was done 1 hour OOP? What happens if I just decide.. hey.. I don't want to play X race anymore? Actioning this type of stuff is so dangerous because it just opens up the flood gates of "is this actionable?" questions.

OR should we just say? Hey .. the guy has to wait 24 hrs to reset, then another 72 hrs in protection. I think that's sufficient deterrent enough to cause people to not try to abuse it.

OMFG would we be geniuses or what!?

[Anri]

Furthermore, if I release all of my military now and aid it to someone else, then I wait the perfectly legal period of time of 24 hrs to reset, will I be actioned? Or is this only actionable because the aid was done 1 hour OOP? What happens if I just decide.. hey.. I don't want to play X race anymore? Actioning this type of stuff is so dangerous because it just opens up the flood gates of "is this actionable?" questions.

OR should we just say? Hey .. the guy has to wait 24 hrs to reset, then another 72 hrs in protection. I think that's sufficient deterrent enough to cause people to not try to abuse it.

OMFG would we be geniuses or what!?

You never know. It might be 23h one age instead of 24h. Bishop is a nice guy but should never been allowed to play god with this game.

[noobium]

I agree that actioning resets is petty bs, and that the problem should be solved by reasonable mechanic changes instead of aribtrary patches. Still doesn't change that it is a rather inane strategy in the first place.

[Godly]

noobium, it's a tradeoff. I think it's worth the 8k soldiers for 24 hrs of losing a prov. They made the correct code change to prevent this from happening in the future. Do you honestly think after people found out about the penalties (not the Bishoping but the aid/reset cooldown) that people would do it now that it's 5 days? Actioning this was such a huge overstep of boundaries and was completely unnecessary.

[Dark Knight]

Furthermore, if I release all of my military now and aid it to someone else, then I wait the perfectly legal period of time of 24 hrs to reset, will I be actioned? Or is this only actionable because the aid was done 1 hour OOP? What happens if I just decide.. hey.. I don't want to play X race anymore? Actioning this type of stuff is so dangerous because it just opens up the flood gates of "is this actionable?" questions.

OR should we just say? Hey .. the guy has to wait 24 hrs to reset, then another 72 hrs in protection. I think that's sufficient deterrent enough to cause people to not try to abuse it.

OMFG would we be geniuses or what!?

Give ya ass a rest mate!