The bottom is hot

[beans]

If that were true why didn't you just NOT break eoacf with divinity and Emeriti? Wouldn't that have served your purpose alot better?

What purpose would that be? We are a war kd and had no interest in idling the rest of the age. We didnt have an EOA CF with divinity to break and figured we would get revenge this age rather then wait till next age. Emeriti eoa cf was void bc they gave notice that they were going to raze us, so we dropped the cf. Only reason to cast sparta as deal breakers is if you dont like sparta, the facts just dont support it. Seeing how many people are saying we DB emeriti because we dropped the cf first instead of waiting for them to start hitting after they gave written notice that the deal was dead just proves that people just want to call spartans deal breakers whether or not its true.

All this BS is why I left UTO when the mega alliances took over the servers. Play time turned into BS diplo and argument time when those with power decided that they could deal how ever they wanted to but if others acted in the same way they would get burned. If dicks wants to pull in allies bc a kd they waved hit them back after their failed diplo fine. Hit into a legit war because wed rather war then get farmed by your allies, also fine. Just stop lying to yourselves about how cool and nice you are.

[Korp]

I got no problem with yall hitting into our war, but at least be honest with yourselves about what your doing. This is a legit war between two kds that would rather war each other then sit and feed top kds. Yall aint white knights protecting the honour of UTO, just a bunch of hypocrites patting each other on the back while feeding on smaller kds.

You havent been honest with yourself yet you demand everyone else to be honest, lol. Thats a true sign of hypocrite.

[xXxFoBxXx]

Finally found this stupid thread! I do not know why Panda is hitting in and The U is now threatening, but we are in war! The war is legit (SNATCH NEWS FOR YOURSELF)!!! This is BS and now you reminded me why I need to quit next age - been sitting on the fence...

Anri, you're still full of ****! Tell me how this is justifiable?

[beans]

You havent been honest with yourself yet you demand everyone else to be honest, lol. Thats a true sign of hypocrite.

honest about what? that letting xxx think we had an EOA CF even though they missed the deadline was a ****ty thing to do? well yeah it was. I was against the whole thing ever since they took the CF later then the deal allowed and we realized we could hit them this age. However a ****ty thing is not the same as a DB. I think my exact words were "we shouldn't sink down to their level." In no way do I think sparta is blameless, but giving some one a ****ty deal when your after revenge is not a DB and its not outside the norm for UTO even if it should be. To much damn high horsing in here for people to think clearly though.

I know a some of the white knights in here were involved with getting kds to break EOA CF deals with emirati last age for the AWAR. I also know that spartans refused to break their EOA CF with emirati.

[chewbakartik]

I don't know about any of you guys, but I play this game for the fun of the wars. This age has been screwed for us from the beginning because of the bug, and if you'll note on our kd has only managed to get 2 of them, which has made this age extremely boring. Last age we finished in the top 25 of kds for WW where we won either 5 of 7 or 6 of 8 (can't really remember exactly), and we were looking forward to the same this time around.

If a kd is going to approach us with a request for war with minimal hostile time so that we can have some fun, who are we to turn that down? How dare you guys stand up on your soap box and judge us for it either? The size diff between us and the spartans is 10k acres, which is extremely different than the 50k that the Pandas have been using to pummel us over the last few days. This kind of behaviour from you top kds strutting around like you own the whole game sickens me. I enjoy this game, and haven't shied away from actually spending $$ on it either, but I'm seriously on the fence about whether or not I want to come back next age and deal with this kind of BS.

No Pandas, we're not going to give you more free land. You are out of range for us to war, so we're not going to do it. Feel free to move on when you get tired of hitting. If you keep on though, we'll keep hitting back, but we're not going to give you the button. Again, feel free to keep on whining about it in the forums. That really seems to be what you're best at.

You guys need to take a serious look at how you're approaching your attitudes to this game if you're going to kill off all activity of this game. I've only been back for a couple ages now, after a hiatus of years, and was shocked to see how small it had gotten. So, if that's what you want to happen, keep up the good work. You've really shown all of the other guys how strong and powerful you are.

Sincerely,
A disgusted and soon to be ex Utopia player

[Korp]

honest about what? that letting xxx think we had an EOA CF even though they missed the deadline was a ****ty thing to do? well yeah it was. I was against the whole thing ever since they took the CF later then the deal allowed and we realized we could hit them this age. However a ****ty thing is not the same as a DB. I think my exact words were "we shouldn't sink down to their level." In no way do I think sparta is blameless, but giving some one a ****ty deal when your after revenge is not a DB and its not outside the norm for UTO even if it should be. To much damn high horsing in here for people to think clearly though.

I know a some of the white knights in here were involved with getting kds to break EOA CF deals with emirati last age for the AWAR. I also know that spartans refused to break their EOA CF with emirati.

Like trying to deny that the terms you tried to set with Divinity was a clear fake war. Or like the fact that Spartans harbor that piece of **** Bart. Or how Bart has countless times ****played in all possible ways. Karma is a *****, you reap what you sow etc. :)

[beans]

Like trying to deny that the terms you tried to set with Divinity was a clear fake war. Or like the fact that Spartans harbor that piece of **** Bart. Or how Bart has countless times ****played in all possible ways. Karma is a *****, you reap what you sow etc. :)

haha yeah I was actually telling Bart in KD chat that I agree with the bart's an asshole part of this thread. So now its time to hit into the wars of all the kds who have asshole monarchs, good to know!

[ape]

Sweden, look to glorious sweden... a king that was on the people side, not the lordship, the top. People are simply people, lords and dukes are simple men, too. Men will always be biased for their own self-interest. It is very difficult to get a functioning community where you mix that self-interest with social responsibilities. Nobody is doing anything consciously, but the lords, "tops", is bound to be corrupting themself, ever so slightly.

I truly think this private CF business it detrimental. Perhaps some kind of "bill of rights", that people playing this game would have to accept, should be implmented after all. Cause lets face it, ppl just aint swedish enuff to be able to trust their fellow man without falling prey for their own selfishness. Next problem: who will implement and decide when this big general contract, amendments, has been broken...

[TheRealKremlin]

Its a fake war by the definition of how fake wars have always been(using the -75% gains to avoid a differnt conflict). Exchanging hits or semi chaining a couple of people so u dont get deleted hardly makes it a real war.

As for what my kd wants ultimately i want spartans to change how they play. If that means they have to be farmed into the war tier so they are "Easy" to handle so be it.

That isn't my definition for a fake war :) If Pandas are justified in hitting in is another question. Certainly xxx is running from them and they WHERE hitting Pandas back. NONE of that means their war is fake though and using a war to avoid another conflict has nothing to do with said war being fake. Also it happens all the time, usually just less blatantly than here.

[TheRealKremlin]

Nothing fake about going to war to avoid getting fed on by bigger kds. Yall just need to own your actions and stop pretending to be saints.

If a war tier/ ghetto kd gets a shady diplo deal from kd in the top then they are told "to bad, gotta learn better diplo" but when it happens in reverse we are expected to honour the intent of the deal and should have pointed out dynasties diplo failure in the beginning for them. Then with emarati we get blasted for DB because we dropped a CF after they gave written notice that they were going to break an EOA CF and wave us? the hypocrisy here is astounding and amusing.

I got no problem with yall hitting into our war, but at least be honest with yourselves about what your doing. This is a legit war between two kds that would rather war each other then sit and feed top kds. Yall aint white knights protecting the honour of UTO, just a bunch of hypocrites patting each other on the back while feeding on smaller kds.

Protesting a bit much there.... Like I said,I've read the logs and IMO you straight up deal broke. No "clever diplo", just broke your word. From my reading of it the 7th "deadline" reads more as hits stopping by then. Sure it's gray but that's generally how Utopia has worked and if you wanted to be clever you needed to spell it out that if the CF wasn't accepted on the 7th then there was NO deal at all and it was just a blank CF. You didn't do that (or whoever was in charge of diplo for Spartans didn't do that).

[TheRealKremlin]

Play time turned into BS diplo

YOU are the one perpetrating this... not anyone else. If you really don't want "BS diplo" then why the HECK did try engage in "Bull*&*% diplo in the first place? You even admitted it earlier in the thread someplace...

[beans]

That isn't my definition for a fake war :) If Pandas are justified in hitting in is another question. Certainly 7:10 is running from them and they WHERE hitting Pandas back. NONE of that means their war is fake though and using a war to avoid another conflict has nothing to do with said war being fake. Also it happens all the time, usually just less blatantly than here.

Thats the definition of fake war when he is talking about some one he doesnt like. obviously it wouldnt be a fake war if a emeriti was warring some one to avoid getting fed on by a larger kd.

[TheRealKremlin]

Pandas decided to hit into the war for a bunch of reasons. They hit us 1h prior to the war having gone to 140 meter vs us. All diplomatic attempts was answered by suck our ***** and swallow our ****. Running never really works out.

Not really sure what else you guy's want from them -- wouldn't it make more sense to let them get their WW and then come after them afterwords? First of all that might actually get a war and it would likely be a fun war for you since they will likely be up around 130-140k acres depending. And you get to look good to the community. Win / Win in my opinion. I mean, what are you guy's trying to do?

Sure they hit you guy's back but lets be real, you are up a ton of land vs them. You've grown a ton and you took around a 10-12k hit from us.

[jo.t.reid]

Its a fake war by the definition of how fake wars have always been(using the -75% gains to avoid a differnt conflict). Exchanging hits or semi chaining a couple of people so u dont get deleted hardly makes it a real war.

From Spartan's perspective things went like this:

1. We ended an in-game CF with no terms (since the terms on which the EOA CF was proposed weren't met nor was there further discussion by Divinity).
2. The KD we waved barely retalled, went fort, and didn't make any moves that might make us think they were going to war us.
3. We approached another KD in the same range, asked them for war, and they did agreed.
4. The KD we waved wasn't prepared to pay the price for thier bad diplo, and thus called in allies to fight their war for them.
5. Both the KD that helped them (Emeriti) and them started hitting into a legit war.

Emeriti is just using this war as an excuse to get acres for their upcoming conflicts. Typical ABS-style of Emeriti.

Spartans have an official message for Emeriti for next age:

1. Always train thieves
2. Always run WTs
3. Do not hold more than 500 gc/acre on any prov at any time
4. Do not run lower than 70 dpa on your banks

Spartans have given Emeriti a chance to attone for their sins, an offer which they turned down. Our demands were quite reasonable for a Kingdom that dealbroke us:

1. Stop dealbreaking
2. Make a deal with us to give back all the land
3. Publicly apologize for dealbreaking us

These demands were turned down by Emeriti, leaving us with no other choice than to carry this conflict into the next age. Mind you, Spartans will not dealbreak Emeriti. In fact, Spartans will never in any way have any diplomatic contact with Emeriti other than the use of arms. Last age when the Awar was raging and we were on they Feyrplay side, Spartans were asked to help razing Emeriti. Spartans flat-out refused to do so as we had agreed an EoA CF and would not break that even for an Awar. Spartans were pressured by quite a few of the white knights voicing their opinions here now to break their CF, which we did not do.

[ape]

Protesting a bit much there.... Like I said,I've read the logs and IMO you straight up deal broke. No "clever diplo", just broke your word. From my reading of it the 7th "deadline" reads more as hits stopping by then. Sure it's gray but that's generally how Utopia has worked and if you wanted to be clever you needed to spell it out that if the CF wasn't accepted on the 7th then there was NO deal at all and it was just a blank CF. You didn't do that (or whoever was in charge of diplo for Spartans didn't do that).

This is worth to be emphasized. Although granted, beans said before he didnt agree to it. Quote, beans: "letting [Dicks] think we had an EOA CF even though they missed the deadline was a ****ty thing to do? well yeah it was. I was against the whole thing". I think you should face the music for that one, and accept that you did something foul if not technical DB (but the technicality aint the spirit of it, remember?).

The second alleged deadlbreak is just trying to justify the deed of the first DB, and the general previous ****tiness piled on this bart, as people seem to think. But breaking CF hours before someone says they will given a deal they wont be able to hold, is no dealbreak. Isnt it in that case also a dealbreak, an intent of dealbreak, from emeriti towards spartans, to threaten and itnentding to break eoacf?