Age 71 Proposed Changes Suggestions

[Pyrr]

So these final changes are the last ones?

I dont really care what the changes are, we all need to adapt.

But after first final changes we put in some time discussing what setup, total waste of our time now it seems. No disrespect, but be very clear in what you are putting up. I am happy to help with that from now on if you want input.


To clarify: Elfs have -35% Military Casualties
So now, they can attack with -35% losses?

[The Moon of Earth]

It is common practise to have proposed changes and then final changes and release them one after the other ... yes i read the Elf ability as -35% losses for attacks suffered and attacks made...

[Glimi]

But after first final changes we put in some time discussing what setup, total waste of our time now it seems. No disrespect, but be very clear in what you are putting up. I am happy to help with that from now on if you want input.

How was this any different than all previous ages?

Proposed changes > forum discussion > Updated proposed changes > forum discussion > final changes that may or may not be the same as proposed.

[Pyrr]

How was this any different than all previous ages?

Proposed changes > forum discussion > Updated proposed changes > forum discussion > final changes that may or may not be the same as proposed.

Difference was >>> potential + potential + final + final.

[Pyrr]

Reason why I am being a pain is:

First Final change >>> UDs had conversion on attacks.

Would might them pretty strong... Giving history of Elfs, I doubt they intended to have Elfs have -35% off loss on attacks.

[Bishop]

Elf is both.

[Pyrr]

Bishop > you created a new elf. Interesting

[Pyrr]

And I am still a pain:


Avians -10% Spell Success
Elfs +35% Spell Success (WPA)


+15% Resource Losses when attacked for orcs
Some people here needs definition on Resources. I think it is plunder gains (gc, runes, food), but I need to make sure, ie no acres or anything else

[Bo To]

And I am still a pain:


Avians -10% Spell Success
Elfs +35% Spell Success (WPA)

Avians don't have -10% spell success(which is wpa). Humans have it.

+15% Resource Losses when attacked for orcs
Some people here needs definition on Resources. I think it is plunder gains (gc, runes, food), but I need to make sure, ie no acres or anything else

It's everything - runes, gc, food, scientists, land and honor(ambush gain should be excluded though).

[Zauper]

How was this any different than all previous ages?

Proposed changes > forum discussion > Updated proposed changes > forum discussion > final changes that may or may not be the same as proposed.

Difference was >>> potential + potential + final + final.

The final changes didn't change.

[Selephant]

The final changes didn't change.

Actually they did, repeatedly. Or rather, they were edited. Which is by definition, a change.

[Zauper]

Actually they did, repeatedly. Or rather, they were edited. Which is by definition, a change.

A clarification is not a change.

If you want to be pedantic, I'd say the text of the changes shared with players may have changed, but the changes themselves did not. Thus, no change to the changes.

[OldPlayerback]

Suggestions are not the same as the doom and gloom you are trying to preach. You think we aren't getting new players because of mechanics....I think it's because of lack of effort. Zynga made millions from facebook games....I think Utopia would benefit from that integration as well...even without mechanic changes.

I am afraid I have to share a different view. Facebook games are rich in graphics, the contents are short and the gameplay are repetitive. Simply say it sells on cuties and graphics. Utopia is far more greater, I am always confident in what I said.

Find me how many facebook games that last 15 years, along with its fan helping to create multiple third party programs. Utopia has the potential to keep loyal players who keep returning, there is a reason why, but how many of us know why is it? There are some of us taking a rest and some of us come back to play, don't be fooled by the current player base, the real player base is actually greater.

The need to change the current warring mechanism is because there is only one way to win the war, which is chain-to-win. And the reason why chain can win the war because the aiding, interaction, and support system between provs are limited. Given such as I mentioned before, if troops from a large prov can be stationed in a smaller prov in act of defense, and you perform a chain and you win the war, then I will agree it is great team work you have proven in your kd.

But the point is, it is not only your kd is able to chain to win, everyone of us can. When everyone of us can, naturally the answer is not because your kd has greater team work, the answer itself pointed to the flaws of the mechanism. It is the mechanism that allows every kds to be able to chain to win.

My primary reason why chaining should be stopped is because the current players cannot subject to heavy losses which they spent weeks or months to build it. If even old players such as you cannot get it what I mean, then I am afraid I really have elaborate long in details.




Let's put it this way.

I am an old player who play Utopia since more than 10 years ago. You tell me that I spent 2 weeks to build my prov from oop to 2k and then waste it at the first hour of the war and drop to 300, my sacrifice is needed because other team mates will help me win the war. I have been a monarch to lead a kd before, I know how a kd works to play a war, and the fundamental in it that applies to win a war. Yes I can understand that, because I stick to the game long enough and I am familiar with it.

Okay, now try to imagine this.

A new player, who have never heard of Utopia before, he never come to the forum, have no idea who the heck is Bishop, he don't even know who Mehul is.

He create an account here, landed in a random kd, beginning to explore how to build up his prov, and finally in a few weeks, he manage to grow above 1.5k. This is actually very good for a new player. Then right when a war happens, he has been set as a chain target and whuahla~~~ down to 300 acres in 6h. As a Monarch, you will try to explain to him that this is how wars happen in Utopia. This is called team work.

So what you are doing now is, you are trying to tell him that your prov has been chained, and it is called as team work. How much faith do you have in yourself, that you would believe this new player will understand this?

First ending, this guy accept your advise, and keep on staying in the game to continue figure it out what the heck is happening.

Second ending, this guy is on rage, refuse to accept and believe this should not happen to his prov. So what happens next? Players such as these will be viewed as a player who do not know what team work is. A trouble maker. He will be teased, scolded, and then under the Monarch's order, he will be razed out of the kd. And I assure you after his leaving, he will still be thinking it is Utopia is a crazy game that full of barbarians and dictators. The game has a problem itself but not himself. Can you actually blame him for that?

So can I lay out a few questions? I believe many of you old players wont even think about this.

How much do you expect from a stranger who is new to the game?

First, he just come to the game for 2 weeks. He is a stranger to the game. He don't even know what the monarchy means in a kd. What is the monarchy system? To follow exact orders in war. You expect a new player come here and follow whatever you said, before he even understand what the game is?

There are 90% of the game he hasn't explored yet. He never been a monarch before to lead a war of course he will not understand. The race/personality he chose for the first time probably are inappropriate and sucks like hell. The first time he participated in a war and he would probably got chained to 300 acres.

So second question here, can you tell me now, do you expect this new player even know the proper way how to release his army?

Oh yeah right, I first came to the game and within 2 weeks I already need to learn how to release my army? What are you crazy, or what?

How can a new player such as him understand what team work is in war? Just join the game and follow what others told him, is called team work? He don't even have an clue why chaining can win a war. It will be hard for him to accept that I create an account here and I have to listen to whatever others said in war and if I don't, suddenly the entire kd will raze me out and put harsh words on me before they do, they must be crazy he thinks.

We are old players, do you even understand what I mean by this? We can take a rest and come back to play, and we still can adapt the chain and how warring is. At the beginning, there is no such thing as semi-chain or deep-chain. As ages go by, years passed, chaining strategy is discovered, players in utopia becomes veterans, and hence warring becomes more extreme.

The current warring mechanism only applicable to the old players, it will be very difficult, to suit to the new player who never know Utopia at all.




Compared to the facebook games, which kind of games have a content in it? Utopia has a lot of fun features within, it is a fun game, but a fun game which no new player will ever discover how fun it is.

Why is that? Because you already chase the new players away. You already scared them away, before they even have the chance to stay longer in the game to explore the other features. Is this how a game should be? It shouldn't.

Even if you place your disagreement, you should have your focus of point. My focus of point is to increase the player base in the game. Any games will be a 100%, a 1000% more fun, when there are huge player base in it. You settle this problem first, the rest will be easier. Do you share the same focus point as mine?

[XCross]

"Immediately upon entering End of War Cease-Fire any provinces affected by plague will have it removed instantly.
Additionally, upon entering End of War Cease-Fire, the losing kingdom will receive 50% of their land as free building credits, while the winning kingdom will receive 150% of their land as free building credits. We would like to stimulate the ability for both kingdoms to recover from war such that both the losing kingdom has a better chance at coming out of war recovered and ready to fight again and more importantly, the winning kingdom has an opportunity to defend their land better upon exiting war."

Loving this change.

[Elldallan]

Destroying a player's effort in building something in a war or a battle, and needing them to rebuild again, is a game feature that is outdated a long time ago. Open up your eyes and look around the world, is there any new games that arise in the recent years have something like that?

Removing entirely the chaining system in a sudden would be risky, a step by a step should be taken to test the response and best if it can be directly tested at the incoming Gen server. The last thing of course I would not want to see is turning Utopia into a Crash of Titan-like, its uniques in race when combo with personalities must be maintained, yet personally i would not agree a direct involvement such as to increase the gangbang protection once a prov been chained.

What I wish to see is the changes of the game mechanism, to increase more options and methods to play the war, this mean, still you can offer the players in war and they can still deep chain a prov but it will comes with great disadvantage and may result in losing the entire war by doing that.

Deep chaining is currently the only really feasible way to disable a province. The reason that deep chaining is so used is because it's simply too dificult to kill off offence.
If it was made easier to kill off the offence of attackers then the need to chain as deeply would decrease or go away. So either change overpopulation mechanics to include troops out on attack or come up with some other way to touch troops out on attack that doesn't depend on ambushes.


I do think that the game needs to have some destructive elements. I don't want a game where every war is an endless slugfest where there is no noticeable change until the game decides for you by some completely arbitrary metric that you have won/lost the wars. Wars should have clear winners and loosers where both sides clearly sense who has won/lost. That being said, recovering troops is a whole lot easier than recovering acres and troops so if we could decrease the need for deep chaining by enabling proper disabling of provinces at larger sizes that would be good.