Age 66 potental changes

I think the value of the dwarf warrior is understated as people focus on human warriors. Yes, free sci w/FoK is nice and +44% automatic OME in war is awesome...but a dwarf warrior can easily match a lot of OME using TG (easier than other races with the increase BE).

Ultimately the human can stay ahead on OME also focusing on TG (though much more % land for TG than dwarves need to achieve respective bonuses), but the dwarf doesn't suffer -20% gains...they only have to worry about a little food, which can easily be donated. Dwarf also gets PF, while human doesn't, so KD that has dwarf warriors doesn't have to be concerned with having clerics for casting PF.

I vote we do everything copious said :) was a quick glance since I'm at work, but looked like everything was made strong, so it would come down to how well you can optimize vs making a KD composition of the 2 most OP races

Avian is a great race though its bonuses against good kds are actually massive disadvantages. They can do really well in the right hands. But the good kds will pick them apart quite easily. That's my only real issue. WH is pretty lame but it has always been. Dorf Leets are not worth that kind of nw.

also agree with everything copious said. +1

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Originally Posted by ThRaZe

also agree with everything copious said. +1

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I would say some good suggestions there, but numbers need more work on them

I would suggest based on prop changes:

Elf
+ 30% Spell Success (WPA)
+1 defensive specialist strength
-25% defensive combat losses

Spellbook: Nightmares, Pitfalls, Invisibility
Elite: 5/4, 700gc, 6NW


Halfling
+40% Thievery Operation Success (TPA) from 50%
-50% thief cost
+10% population
+1 offensive specialist strength

Cannot use hospitals

Spellbook: Aggression, Mages Fury
Soldiers 2:2 Elite: 4/4, 350gc, 5.25NW


Orc
+30% Attack Gains
Free draft
+25% Enemy casualties when attacking

-10% science effectiveness, back to -10% from 20%

Spellbook: Reflect Magic, Clear Sight
Elite: 7/1, 750gc, 6NW


The Tactician
-20% Attack Time from -15%
Accurate Espionage
Access to Clear Sight
Starts with +800 soldiers and +800 specialist credits

The Cleric
-20% Your Military Casualties (on attack or defense) - from -30%
Immune to The Plague
Access to Pitfalls
Starts with +800 soldiers and +800 specialist credits


The War Hero

+100% Honor Effects
-50% Military training time
Converts some Specialists into Elites on successful land attacks
Immune to Dragon effects
Access to War Spoils
Starts with 400 elites


edit:

would also suggest ruby dragon bumped from -8% ME to -10% ME

copious's suggestion was 100% terrible. I don't normally say things like this but

1 - they are extremely unbalanced
2 - they are way too drastic after the proposed changes have already been released
3 - they are probably intentionally troll and y'all are friends/kd mates asked/dared to say you like them OR you really do like them and don't see 1 and 2

so I'm saying they are terrible because they appear to be intentionally terrible

likewise, noobium -- usually you have some great ideas, but that was pretty sub-par for what you normally post. Dwarves with +30% BE and Faery with +25% BE on capacity buildings except homes and -5% pop?? wtf how on earth do you think that's balanced...lol, I sorta stopped reading after that.

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Originally Posted by nameisis

I would suggest based on prop changes:

Elf
+ 30% Spell Success (WPA)
+1 defensive specialist strength
-25% defensive combat losses

Spellbook: Nightmares, Pitfalls, Invisibility
Elite: 5/4, 700gc, 6NW


Halfling
+40% Thievery Operation Success (TPA) from 50%
-50% thief cost
+10% population
+1 offensive specialist strength

Cannot use hospitals

Spellbook: Aggression, Mages Fury
Soldiers 2:2 Elite: 4/4, 350gc, 5.25NW


Orc
+30% Attack Gains
Free draft
+25% Enemy casualties when attacking

-10% science effectiveness, back to -10% from 20%

Spellbook: Reflect Magic, Clear Sight
Elite: 7/1, 750gc, 6NW


The Tactician
-20% Attack Time from -15%
Accurate Espionage
Access to Clear Sight
Starts with +800 soldiers and +800 specialist credits

The Cleric
-20% Your Military Casualties (on attack or defense) - from -30%
Immune to The Plague
Access to Pitfalls
Starts with +800 soldiers and +800 specialist credits


The War Hero

+100% Honor Effects
-50% Military training time
Converts some Specialists into Elites on successful land attacks
Immune to Dragon effects
Access to War Spoils
Starts with 400 elites


edit:

would also suggest ruby dragon bumped from -8% ME to -10% ME

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I could see those...I personally would rather have the changes as they are proposed...but good suggestions nevertheless
Specifically -- Orc are too strong. Remove CS please and/or keep their -20% science effectiveness. I'm saying this while being pretty sure I'm playing Orc.
The Cleric suggestion I like -- but if that's the case, I would highly suggest dropping Undead losses to -50% or possibly even lower.

I DO, however, VERY much agree that Ruby Dragon needs a buff. Hopefully not too late to change it...but Ruby Dragon is way underpowered compared to the other ones.

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Originally Posted by smercjd

I could see those...I personally would rather have the changes as they are proposed...but good suggestions nevertheless
Specifically -- Orc are too strong. Remove CS please and/or keep their -20% science effectiveness. I'm saying this while being pretty sure I'm playing Orc.
The Cleric suggestion I like -- but if that's the case, I would highly suggest dropping Undead losses to -50% or possibly even lower.

I DO, however, VERY much agree that Ruby Dragon needs a buff. Hopefully not too late to change it...but Ruby Dragon is way underpowered compared to the other ones.

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I don't agree are too strong, they have their good sides and bad sides. CS and RM look good on paper, but they are too easily vortexed if you are being put as target. Now with -20% sci anyone could vortex, plus big losses on pop,TM def and income, BE is too much for already most fragile race.

Cleric has two big bonuses losses and immunity to plague. Lowering losses to -20% or -30%, doesn't need to make UD changes to UD off losses. Plague immunity already makes UD inferior when warring against cleric. And cleric is why Ork looked so good this age.

These are my finalized views for the changes based on the proposed changes.

Green = Changed/Added
Red = Removed

Avian
-30% Attack Time
+50% Birth Rate
Ambush Immunity
-30% Training Time
-30% Construction Time
+ 1 General

Cannot use Stables

Elite: 6/1, 500gc, 5.25 nw
Spellbook: Fanaticism, Greater Protection

Dwarf
+35% Building Efficiency
Free Building Construction and Can Use Credits To Raze Buildings

Can’t use Accelerated Construction
+ 100% food consumption

Spellbook: Fools Gold, Mystic Aura, Pitfalls
Elite: 6/2, 700gc, 6NW


Elf
+ 30% Spell Success (WPA)
+1 defensive specialist strength
Self-Spells use 2% Mana (Instead of 3%. Yes, including ToG if they go Merchant)

Spellbook: Nightmares, Pitfalls, Invisibility, Chastity
Elite: 5/4, 800gc, 5.75NW

Faery
+ 25% Combat Instant Spell Damage
+ 25% Sabotage Operation Damage
+ 25% Spell Duration
+1 mana per tick in war
+1 stealth per tick

Spellbook: All racial spells
Elite: 4/5, 900gc, 6.5NW

Halfling
+50% Thievery Operation Success (TPA)
-50% thief cost
+20% population
+1 offensive specialist strength

Cannot use hospitals

Spellbook: Aggression, Mages Fury, Vermin
Soldiers 2:2 Elite: 4/4, 300gc, 5NW

Human
+ 20% Offensive Military Efficiency
Every 3 acres generates 1 book of science

- 20% battle gains

Spellbook: Fountain of Knowledge, Quick Feet
Elite: 6/3, 750, 5.75NW


Orc
+30% Attack Gains
Free draft
+25% Enemy casualties when attacking

-20% science effectiveness

Spellbook: Reflect Magic, Clear Sight
Elite: 7/1, 700gc, 6.25NW


Undead
-50% Offensive losses on attacks you make
Spreads and is Immune to The Plague
No Food Required

Basic Thievery (Intel operations only)

Spellbook: Town Watch, Animate Dead
Elite: 7/2, 800gc, 6.5NW


Personality

The Merchant
Gain 50% more Specialist and Building Credits
Immune to Income Penalties
Access to Tree of Gold
Starts with +1600 specialist credits


The Sage
+40% Science Effectiveness
Access to Amnesia
Starts with 40000 science books


The Rogue
+1 Stealth recovery per tick
+ 100% land effect from Thieves Dens
Access to all thievery operations, including 3 unique to rogues: Greater Arson, Assassinate Wizards and Propaganda
+75% Thievery Science Effectiveness
Access to Invisibility
Starts with +400 thieves


The Mystic
All Guilds are twice as effective
+1 mana per tick
+50% Magic Science Effectiveness
Access to Meteor Showers, Nightmares, Chastity, Mage's Fury
Starts with +200 Wizards


The Warrior
+20% Offensive Military Efficiency in War
Enhanced Conquest range
Access to Bloodlust
Starts with +800 soldiers and +800 specialist credits


The Tactician
-15% Attack Time
Accurate Espionage
Access to Clear Sight
Starts with +800 soldiers and +800 specialist credits


The Cleric
-50% Defensive Military Casualties
Immune to The Plague
Access to Pitfalls
Starts with +800 soldiers and +800 specialist credits


The War Hero
+100% Honor Effects
+1 Offensive Specialist Strength
Converts some Specialists into Elites on successful land attacks
Immune to Dragon effects
Access to War Spoils
Starts with 400 elites

Ruby Dragon: -12% ME

Explanation for War Hero -- I think it solves a lot of problems. Gives them that extra umph. Allows TM races to hybrid better. And the +1 O-Spec Strength goes hand-in-hand with the conversion...it just makes sense. If none of the other things stick...I'd REALLY like to see this change the most.

So you make undead even ****tier... meanwhile dwarf is still a top pick.
Cleric is still really good with 40%, no need to buff it back. I like your War Hero tho.

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Originally Posted by Avenger

Cleric is still really good with 40%, no need to buff it back.

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The currently suggested cleric would have only 30% tho. Still good?

I'd keep it at 40%.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Avenger

I'd keep it at 40%.

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smercjd is suggesting only def losses not both. But -40% as in this age is too much