Simians diplomacy

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Originally Posted by Elurin

Another option is ofc for the mentioned kd's to actually play the game everyone else do - by not keeping more gc around than they can defend. Keeping 20-30 mil, even with 3 tpa and CS, is a great deal to rob. I do see the frustration this reset in mentality causes as kd's cling to old strats demanding such huge cash reserves to compete. Ofc we're aware the frustration we caused over age by stealing these reserved, and we always knew someone would hit us. To have people actively search out other top kd's to arrange a GB, however, is sillier than we expected but done is done, so lets have fun with it :D

I think flogger points out the key issue here; it's not really that anyone thinks what we did was unfair - beyond the ops into active hostiles which was unintentional and I tried to apologize for. It's rather that if the rest of the server sees how beneficial it is for a kd to rob the top, their wanted privilege of keeping endless gc stores will no longer work. 1 or 2 kd's can be GB'd, not 10 or 100. In the face of this change in balance, where these kd's would actually have to rethink their regular way of winning, the preferred option is ofc to maintain status quo with a show of power. But guys, be honest about it instead of trying to take some morale standpoint here. Anyone who has power fights to preserve it, no tactics (regardless of what you previously thought of them) is too low to be used to ensure that power remains with those who holds it.

That said, silly kitties have never had so active IRC, good fun :)

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You truly are clueless. You can steal as much as you want, gc will still be stocked, because it's how to win the whoring game. Until mechanics change, that's the way it is. Nothing is going to change about how they play, the only thing that will change is you getting your kd wrecked because you can't control your impulses to poke big kds with a stick.

whats up with all these 'umad bro?' posts.

I think the bigger issue is a kd with the warring capability of Cats picking on Vengeance. That has min time and dead cow written all over it.

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Originally Posted by Koodo

Hopefully more mid ranged kingdoms will be aware of how devastating opping and robbing a top kingdom can be. (obviously this thread has grown from a few posts to a whole bunch in one day, most are the top kingdoms complaining ofc.) Also retal against top kingdoms with hits since most are "hollow" provinces with no real meat/all offense (no thiefs, no mages, and no defense). Smack a few around the next time they pay your kingdom a visit.

Keep it fair, and don't opp / interfere with kingdoms in active hostiles, and rob the rest that aren't in hostiles blind. If all ghettos made the top kingdoms more accountable through thier strategies it would only make the game more interesting, making rampant exploring more difficult to do. (which they've tried to fix this age with exploration changes also). Most top kingdoms are all CF'd and can't or won't rob each other, which gives them a false sense of security(no gold is ever truly secure)

Why rob the corner store (ghettos) when you can rob the bank (top kingdoms) ! The game mechanics favour upfeeding against larger opponents and kingdoms.

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You fail to realize that the reason the same kingdom's are in the top age after age is not coincidental - it is our activity and skill level. We all started off with the same resources as the lower level kingdoms.

But you fail to realise that many of us don't want to play the same game as the top 10. Been there, done that, actually. It's not necessarily a difference of skill and activity.
That's the game you like to play and that's cool.

tnx for the support of some people :)

and DHaran isn't this your kd? if so pls dont be silly and accuse us of anything unethical

Average Opponent Relative Size 60%

and @ simians I took your sn and guess what I see, hits on multiple kd's including some anons

April 11 of YR8 An unknown province from Simians WAR (x:xx) captured 94 acres of land from xxxxx
April 24 of YR8 An unknown province from Simians Hostile 818 (x:xx) captured 86 acres of land from xxxx

how silly, according to their kd name durning those hits it looks like they do the same thing they are acusing us off.

Take it as a learning experience SPGC, and figure out the best way to fix it. :)

So much to learn young padawans, so much to learn.

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Originally Posted by Elurin

Another option is ofc for the mentioned kd's to actually play the game everyone else do - by not keeping more gc around than they can defend. Keeping 20-30 mil, even with 3 tpa and CS, is a great deal to rob. I do see the frustration this reset in mentality causes as kd's cling to old strats demanding such huge cash reserves to compete. Ofc we're aware the frustration we caused over age by stealing these reserved, and we always knew someone would hit us. To have people actively search out other top kd's to arrange a GB, however, is sillier than we expected but done is done, so lets have fun with it :D

I think flogger points out the key issue here; it's not really that anyone thinks what we did was unfair - beyond the ops into active hostiles which was unintentional and I tried to apologize for. It's rather that if the rest of the server sees how beneficial it is for a kd to rob the top, their wanted privilege of keeping endless gc stores will no longer work. 1 or 2 kd's can be GB'd, not 10 or 100. In the face of this change in balance, where these kd's would actually have to rethink their regular way of winning, the preferred option is ofc to maintain status quo with a show of power. But guys, be honest about it instead of trying to take some morale standpoint here. Anyone who has power fights to preserve it, no tactics (regardless of what you previously thought of them) is too low to be used to ensure that power remains with those who holds it.

That said, silly kitties have never had so active IRC, good fun :)

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There's nothing unfair with gangbanging someone either. In fact I think the game was a lot more fun at the beginning when everyone was teaming up with everyone. It was a much more fun political game. How many times can one do the same 1 on 1 war before it gets a little boring. Chain, nightstrike, nightmare, it's not that much fun, in general.

People stopped doing it largely because it really ruined other people's fun, and gangbanging doesn't occur now unless someone feels someone went over the line. Hesus got gangbanged once because he made a cow and started razing people. The largest cows can always just sit and raze all of their opposition 1 on 1, but they don't do it because it would upset people too much and cause a gangbang.

The same can be said by sitting behind 20 TPA and robbing without mercy that is said by a cow 1 on 1 razing each kingdom one by one. Both will result in action eventually. You may well state this is the most fun you've had, but when you have to replace players who woulda wished you didn't get their provinces killed I imagine you might reconsider. I've had to replace plenty of players as a result of me leading my kingdom into getting gangbanged. As someone who has gotten himself gangbanged plenty and as much as I know how fun it seems to get your ego involved, usually it almost always ends up being a detriment to your kingdom and some of the people you lead. Its the monarchs job to know when enough is enough because he has the ceasefire button.

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Originally Posted by flogger

The same can be said by sitting behind 20 TPA and robbing without mercy ...

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No need for 20 mod TPA to steal from them. They has 1-2 raw tpa max, no WT, no decent science, no active hostile and a huge gc stock. All other provs in silrange don't has gc or has silly pro thieve def. Wonder who you would pick as steal target...

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Originally Posted by Red

No need for 20 mod TPA to steal from them. They has 1-2 raw tpa max, no WT, no decent science, no active hostile and a huge gc stock. All other provs in silrange don't has gc or has silly pro thieve def. Wonder who you would pick as steal target...

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I wouldn't pick the guy who bounced rage down for 2 months straight last age.

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Originally Posted by flogger

I wouldn't pick the guy who bounced rage down for 2 months straight last age.

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1) that wasn't in the options
2) you don't know that when screening provs... so pointless reply o.O

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Originally Posted by Cieva

tnx for the support of some people :)

and DHaran isn't this your kd? if so pls dont be silly and accuse us of anything unethical

Average Opponent Relative Size 60%

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What's wrong with hitting a button given to us? Try harder.

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Originally Posted by flogger

Its the monarchs job to know when enough is enough because he has the ceasefire button.

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Flogger speaks nothing but truth.

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Originally Posted by DHaran

What's wrong with hitting a button given to us? Try harder.

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exactly our thought when we pushed it ;)

It's understandable that many of you do not get it and assume it is a battle between the moral high ground when really it isn't. Maybe it's best everything is laid out properly so people understand what this is all about.

No one is pissed off about this KD robbing other's gc. The kd getting stolen can only blame themselves for not having the necessary thievery defence to fend off being stolen. That's a fact and I'm sure every one can agree that if you're going to have 20m+ lying around then you better have some tpa to back it up or it'll be stolen. No one is whining about losing the gc here, surely I'm not and nor is my kd. It is expected and we've done the same for many ages. Lest we forget that BiO was just another ghetto warring KD until we decided we'll take an age off this one to dice. Been there done that and the argument I had before is the same one SPGC has right now.

There really is no double standard and those who cry (aka DDodge) about top KD's hitting in to hostile or what not, you'll notice 1 thing if you ever do play in the top (you've been asking to join BiO recently so here's a lesson you need to learn first) is that you'll see far fewer hits and randoms from top KD's as the age progresses. Why? Because smaller kd's and provinces are finally trained up and ready to retal. And usually they retal for much more than they get hit for. Such is the mechanics of this game in which it favors the topfeeders moreso than the bottom feeders. The top KD's only take advantage on a small window during OOP when their province strats are far superior to those from smaller kd's and thus use that timeframe to hit and grow without affording to get retalled and losing more. So to say that top KD's abuse and hit in to hostile and taking advantage of their size is partially true and partially untrue. Half cup fill, half cup empty. I see more randoms coming from smaller kd's in to smaller kd's way more than larger kd's doing full waves on a smaller kd in hostile - in fact, I seldomly or ever seen a larger kd wave a smaller kd while the smaller one is in hostile unless they were instigated.

Now, back to the point of all this, why there seems to be an outrage from every one. The fact lies not in the reality of which this SPGC is robbing from everyone. If they can, why not? It's the fact that they disregard all requests to stop when the kd being robbed is finally in a hostile. My kd never once uttered a word or so much complain about getting their gc robbed during this down time. Share the wealth, we understand the game well enough. It's the fact that when we were actually in a retal war with Fury and had very nicely asked the kd to stop, that they continue to do so without the slightest remorse for their actions.

That sir, is what this is all about. Of course, by Elurin coming on here taunting and bragging about this as well as having his minions continue to taunt about the matter only makes it worse.

So, lets get to the consequences of all this.

It is pointless and futile for a KD like mine to do it '1v1'. First of all, the mechanics of this game favors SPGC if we were to exchange hits. Secondly, I do not have any interest warring a KD of that size because I only get stalled doing so and chances are I lose 4-5 provinces to deep chains for an exchange of getting hardly any acres if at all. It serves me no purpose to fight a kd that size 1v1 because we're on different tiers. In fact, I doubt either kd can even declare on one another due to size. Unfortunately, robbing is not so much affected by the very same game mechanics and whilst a smaller lower tier kd can survive the age without doing much sci pumping and wizzie pump, the same is not so true for a KD in the upper tiers. Such is the path KD's choose to go with, personally, I've been in both and find that the level of competition up top is relatively much higher due to the densely populated choices.

With that said, as aforementioned that it is pointless to take on a kd like that 1v1. Simians would be stupid doing so, and we all know that. It'll just fall right in to the goals of SPGC - the mechanics favor them anyways. The only way for a KD like mine's to strike back is to do it when it hurts the most: during their wars/conflicts. Bouncing is a perfect resort as it then drops the def of all their T/M's significantly and to the point where they can be hit down by other smaller kd's. And then they are as helpless as the very kd being stolen from. Eye for an eye?

This is the game as it is, we can only blame the developers for not having this in foresight. Until the day they fix the game mechanics, top KD's will get harassed much more than the ones in the smaller KD's. Nothing can be done but to fight back where and when it hurts them the most.