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What I read is:Quote:
Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam
You abused TB mechanics first and then took a stand against it.
You're responsible for all the top kd bank Naps.
You crosslogged, but took a stand against it.
From an earlier posts: you 2vs1-ed to take a stand against it.
Can you see why people have trouble with this ASF?
[QUOTE=AquaSeaFoam;15128841]Elit, I was asked a question and I answered it. Relax. He wanted to know my reasons and I gave them. You may feel those reasons were not justified, but that doesn't change that those were my reasons.
imbushe,
You're clearly wrong on your first point as prot already demonstrated. A number of people suggested that I be interviewed and prot took the initiative. If you don't like me and don't want to read the interview, don't worry, reading it is completely optional.
On your second point, I coined the term "cow" (short for cash cow) in age 19 after developing a strategy to use large provinces to abuse the tb system. Cow is the preferred term since "bank" is a building. I was the #1 prov that age and my kd had all of the top 3 world provinces (twin cows and one large killer.) The strat benefited from an old tb loophole that allowed provinces to send aid to those under 1/4 of their nw tb free. After my kingdom continued to use improved versions of this strat successfully in subsequent ages (including along with other allies like Pansies), I and others felt that cows were overpowered and I helped petition Mehul to nerf them by removing the tb loophole (which he eventually did). Cows had proved to be so dominant however, that kingdoms continued to use them with great success even without the tb loophole.
I can't remember all the details but I'm pretty sure we used that strategy to some degree in Desire age 18 with AoD as our explorer/bank.
Did i miss the link on the utopia throne page or hasn't it been there?
Just noticed the thread and i've rarely seen an interview worth reading as much as this one.
Loved it.
I always carefully stay out of big sized top kd's ever since i played in one during my 3rd age and got so bored i felt like quitting the game.
Therefor i have no clue about all the big boys names and without this article i would never have found out about ASF even existing, but loved reading this and thank both prot and ASF for their efforts.
flogger, the earlier cows I was referring to were not fed but instead fed smaller provinces all they wanted without ruining their trade balance. The feeding (and in turn gbp abuse for more feeding) came later as cows "caught on" and cow battles for dominant positioning ensued. I very much agree with the rest of what you said.
Lews, indeed Desire and others like Mordor did use large provinces for good effect in previous ages. I'm really not trying to claim otherwise or act like I invented being a big province so sorry if it appears like I was. A better representation might be that I coined the word cow and developed/popularized a strategy utilizing an exploring province to aid the kingdom, buy and slay dragons, etc with large attacker (killer) support (later evolving into allied group support) that from that point on became a key component to the #1 kingdom competition for the majority of ages afterwards. Also, I'm not trying to claim that these cows are good for the game, in fact I believe the opposite and have often suggested a better balance between exploring and attacking so that exploring isn't so overpowered.
Scavenger, I abused the strength of exploring combined with an old intentional feature that allowed you to send tb free aid to provinces under 1/4 your size. Despite being good at this strategy, I felt it was overpowered so suggested the strategy I had used (more than once) with good success be weakened. Top kingdom cow naps are a natural result of multiple kingdoms wanting cows. Un-cf'd cows are a naturally unstable condition and either they will cf, or to quote the Highlander, "In the end, there can be only one." The early age "temporary allying up to establish cow dominance" was largely a response by non Absalom groups wanting to ensure Absalom could not establish such cows and in place, they establish their own. Again, I'm not trying to claim this is good for the game, just the result of the situation.
I didn't ever crosslog in the context that many well known top kingdoms did. In the past, I did use illegal sitting (typically done by a non playing ex-kingdom member) for players who were going on vacations. I'm not trying to claim this was legit to do and am not bragging about having done it in the past, just being honest. Many other kingdoms in the past would do every wave 25 hits, with crosslogging a large percentage of the kingdom very regularly. This was typically done through tools like munk. I was always against such things and my kingdoms did not do it and if a kingdom wanted to join Absalom it was a condition that they got off munk. Again, I'm not trying to claim that I or Absalom were or are perfect, and some kingdoms most likely did crosslog some accounts at various times. I'm just trying to be honest with those flaws and also put them in context. The reality is that Absalom was very clearly against such things and if an Absalom kingdom was resorting to any serious crosslogging, then they were in for some stern talks from Absalom court and at risk of being asked ot leave the alliance. This is in contrast to some other groups who openly helped their alliance mates get set up for max crosslogging on munk and never had provinces miss a wave despite only having 12 players online for most of those waves and terrible activity apart from those waves.
Yes, we 2v1'd and gb'd to take a stand against 2v1'ing and gb'ing. I understand the irony in this, however people are also sent to prison if they illegally imprison someone, and may even be killed if they kill someone. If someone knows they won't get away with 2v1'ing someone because it'll happen back to them, then they are less likely to do it in the first place. Absalom from the start (hense the name if you've ever read the biblical story of Absalom) has valued justice and vengeance against those who wrong us. Some might prefer we change our name to Jesus and adopt a policy of forgiveness and turnig the other cheek, but while that would be nicer, that's just not who we choose to be.
Even if you disagree with my opinions, hopefully you found them interesting, and you can be assured that these are my real opinions based on my experiences.
I didn't even know ASF before this article - but now I know. What a breath of fresh air amidst the fetid miasma now pervading the halls of Utopia - I mean, just compare what he's saying compared to Realest or who's-that-other-guy-interviewed-before-realest? Well done ASF - you may be right or wrong but at least you're sharing something interesting with us - unlike all the ego-swollen people before you.
[I comment based only on what I read in Utopia News interviews - if there are other good folks like ASF not yet interviewed, I would happily retract my comment about the lack of fresh air at the top of Utopia.]
That was the halls of utopia in the past when the big names actually wrote on the forums gave advice and started some decent for/against arguments ....... this game/forum is a piss poor shadow of its former self
This happens in most games.Quote:
Originally Posted by UnBan Hurlin
First they start finding out how to run a game and discuss it in the forum, but at some point people won't share tricks anymore just cuz they are afraid the tricks might be used against them and/or being prevented by the game developers.
Well - that explains the lack of content - and I suppose the vacuum has to be filled with something, e.g. ego? It still remains rather vacuous, doesn't it? ;-)
I am by all means no Absalom fan but one of the reasons that Absalom managed to survive so long is that there was always a worse alliance / set of kingdoms out there.
I don't believe AquaSeaFoam is a hero but I do rather see players like him controlling the top then the massive horde of crosslogging kingdoms that used to run rampant and played the antagonist role vs. Absalom.
At least it is some comfort to be outclassed by a set of kingdoms ruled by a player that is politically talented enough to almost make you believe that they play 100% clean and have outstanding morals than by a set of kingdoms where half of the players can't even spell their own name right.
No one can really deny the impact Absalom and ASF had on this game even if you do not particularly like them.
aremarf: E_Boko and Realest really are not that bad if you have seen the leaders of kingdoms that you had deal with years ago. :D
ASF is definately one of the few players i respect from all my years in this game, granted most is in rage of abs, but even so, he is a person who stands by you in good or bad, and brings the best out in alot of people.
He is also the first person to resort to all other types of solutions when your teamed up on, before even considering calling in anyone for aid.
<3 ASF
That was the halls of utopia in the past when the big names actually wrote on the forums gave advice and started some decent for/against arguments ....... this game/forum is a piss poor shadow of its former self
So true. Never venture here anymore except when bored stupid during a reset.
Looks like that is going to end also
Good interview.
Good interview. I disagree with a few points tho. Why do you think lots of players think top kds are cheaters? Wtf lol. Yes, the utopia experience is not complete unless youve lead a top kd, i agree with that for sure tho. The science bit, unless youre planning on being really big near end game, sustained is good enough all round; last round i had good sciences all round and didnt get learned, particularly because i didnt get to endgame at a big size. You disregard the fact that merchants running active+ will be learn exploited mid to eoa, unless youre in a top 1-2 kd obv. If you say the utopia experience is not complete unless you have lead a top kd, id like to say the utopian experience is not complete unless youve led a mid sized warring kd as well.
AquaSeaFoam sucks.
He doesn't like Cheese and Flogger.
They're the best.
And I always thought of Tredvolt during that RUST vs IRON age as the first giant cow. He got big and then fed his kingdom up.
History is written by the winners who climb over the bodies of the past to tell you "how it really was"
Very nice read
Great interview
Does anyone else always imagin ASF to be and old man with a long white beard?
No not really.
YESQuote:
Originally Posted by itchm
Yes I do
Problem is I've seen his picture. I see him as a hippy in a suit. :P
and then he whips the suit off with the aid of of cleverly hidden velcro strips and struts around the pole.............
An interesting interview(and from a fellow material scientist, yay :P) to read. Even tho there are some points on which I disagree... Historical wise that is.
but first: Kuhan, sorry but with sustained science, you get something nice. However if you want to come out on top EoA you need more than sustained. I'm sure that versus the bottom kds you'll be fine but mid/top range you'll have a hard time. Being able to exploit the combination of bonusses makes science a too strong factor.
Now to ASF, you, or others, might disregard me, seeing as that I'm playing in warcry and we have a name regrettably. Call it funny or not, but Abs did do their share of Xlogging in the early ages, at least till ~ age 30 orso. When I still cared.
I do still remember the early ages in Midevil Mafia Q where we did get gangbanged by Abs as well as other kds. In the past 10-15 ages I can't say anything about it, since I stopped caring about the big picture of Utopia politics, however for the ages that I was active I've seen Abs commit their fair share of cheating. So your alliance has not always been the alliance who was trying to enforce/promote 1 vs 1 fights or honourable play. Massive bottomfeeding and gangbangs included. Regardless of your Point of view ASF, fellow alliancemembers have acted on different levels. It's been often that Abs leadership turned us away saying: we don't meddle in abs kd affairs.. what they do is their responsibility and we only act if they ask us (implying at that time as much as: if they cheat, we dont wanna know, we got nothing to do with it, nor do we care too much)
At the end of the story, it was still a good interview with a lot of good and healthy thougts and opinions. If abs truly stands for that nowadays it would be good.
I totally lol at the fair play parts. ABS was probably 1 of the very 1st major breaker of the old game rules against account trading/collecting and control of kingdom accounts along with forced use of 3rd party software. Not to mention forced killings of players that randomed into their kingdom that did not meet activity requirements. All of which were against the rules. May be legal now but back then it sure wasn't.
one of the first? By time absalom existed this was all very common practice.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fates Warning
lol abs killed me off one age i randomed into one of their ghettoes even when i met all requirements to join. no questions were asked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fates Warning
#over-it
I love how Realest and Godly interviews are now completely buried, but ASF gets back in the spotlight over and over again.
Nice interview
wow this post brings back memories!
i was in and around ABS round 4-10 and a few others. haven't played in 8 years, but still remember nearly all the names dropped in the interview. good times.
thanks for posting
I don't think you got my point. Most kingdoms don't have any desire to come out top EOA.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephi
Your argument only stands for kds playing for #1, which is about 5 kds in the entire server. Mid kingdoms don't need to run anything above sustained all round, especially with the addition of sci bonuses at eow. All you're doing is burning money when you can instead be trying to get wars faster, which is the reason why most kingdoms play this game. Not saying i agree with it, but it is what it is.
Protip: good sciences matter for all kingdoms, not just ones that want to grow.Quote:
Originally Posted by KuhaN
Sciences make provinces stronger and more resilient, and sciences bought earlier in the age are more valuable than those bought later in the age. If you're never planning on any real growth, which most kingdoms aren't, you're much better served, over the course of an age, buying all your sciences as early as possible. The sooner you have those advantages, the more you get to use them, and all else equal, the kingdom with higher science has an advantage.
This is especially true when considering the new war win bonuses, which give you a huge boost in sciences. If you can take that advantage into a war with even preparations otherwise, you're much more likely to win than just going straight after a kingdom. Fighting when you have 20-50% more WPA and TPA, 5-10% more gains, with better econs? Too easy. The only downside in all this is that farming ghettos is now much more lucrative, which makes doing that over sci pumping a viable option :(
If a kingdom has 20-50% more WPA and TPA, 5-10% more gains, and with much better econs, I don't think it's because they pumped sciences at SoA. They're either small as hell, or big as hell late age, or have won much more wars than others.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRock
All mid sized kingdoms with 25 players in them have about the same amount of science on average (fluctuating by kd WWs). I disagree that you could get such advantages early on by pumping sciences, maybe looking at 5-10% more WPA or TPA, 2-4% more gains, and slightly better econs. Overrated imo. Not worth the extra monies. And by mid age like you said it levels out (ignoring WWs).
Goodjob
Good read, respect the man for what he has done, but this book (interview?) belongs on the fiction section of the library.
It would be good reading for a number of small kingdom monarchs. I read everything with a filter, but have nothing but praise for the quality interview. My endeavors have never been leadership, though I've crossed my fingers to no avail on behalf of my superiors in several kingdoms.
I'm blue-collar, and for me reading or listening to balanced intellect is stimulating. Detractors noted, I'm no Kool-Aid drinker. ;-) We all share a joy of playing this game.
Just because of that doesnt mean hes a great player.
Fantastic player, one of the best at spotting a bug and abusing it!
ASF.... good to see you again brother..... Ex
From the wilderness I enjoyed reading that.