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Thanks for the respect, but even though half of spectre is an old kd, there was a lot to smooth out this age and after the stuff with Pyro it wasnt time for another tough day :)
Next age things might be more promising (for one not having the pyro conflict P:)
To play the middle, I think NDB are angry because the Spectre wave devalued their choice to war Jerks.
In my travels I've been in 3 wars with NDB; all losses.
A bit off topic, but I haven't told this one yet -
I count one in which I was being sat because that's on me. I wanted a nub to get a feel for running the biggest province in a kingdom. In the meantime my rpg group was starting a new game I wanted to attend. I told the nub to play it like it was his. He proceeded to rebuild and raze what he thought was superior. Anywho, HRS; that was palems non-faery kingdom, was us and FREE waved. The decision was made to run from FREE so HRS(her royal swiftness) waved NDB. I had known NDB were practiced at certain tactics as we discussed options in irc. My sitter decided to double massacre a big halfer and in the ensuing wave we gave the button.
It's kind of funny getting the play-by-play from an exited nub in irc while my province was crushed from 4500 acres to 380 and learned to the stone age. His province was relatively intact.
For some reason he had an invitation to another kingdom sent to my province. I noticed it when I logged in. Seeing how everything was smashed I figured I'd take a leap. For fun I didn't even look at who the invite was from. I landed in Monsters and started a province named Chimera Occult because I always use the occult designation for cleric and chimera was thematically appropriate. So that guy named Chimera is'nt me in there, but he barrowed the coolest name. They hated me because I couldn't use their com system. I left them plenty of credits to recruit in my departure. I then moved to Thundercats as my outro that age.
The next war I met NDB was while I was with The Wishmasters. I informed The Wishmasters of the ferocity of NDB but I still got scolded after the war by Wands because I may not have been animated enough in my warning. Obviously things didn't go smoothly and we were pulverized.
Finally we have the Jerks war. I was curious to see if NDB were as formidable since they just reconstituted this age. Again, I informed the kingdom of my experiences. I can't speak for everyone, but initially the Spectre massacres(2) weren't too debilitating to me. It was when I started putting on acres that my wpa deficits forced methodical tactics. The core suffered immense damage. Just to remind; I randomed into Jerks with a build I wanted to experiment with in a more chaotic environment. I'm an elf cleric. The beauty is to be running a durable attacker with good op defense.
- Forward to Spectre.
After the loss to NDB my province gained acres but you know how slow generating wpa is. So when we engaged Spectre I was running 30% guilds in war. I suspected solid ops/sabotage from Spectre so I accelerated building WT on new acres. Most training was elites and thieves. I suspected our dragon was a troll attempt as we were in no position to fund. I was also willing to tank the Sapphire since slaying was prohibitively costly and our ability to op was wiped out.
The reason I'm giving personal accounts is because I'm not privy to all the goings on. I'm not sure why certain elves didn't build WT.
None the less, I think NDB vs Spectre is good warring. I'm frankly a fan of this nondiplomatic approach. I won't cheer it on as every kingdom has it's agenda. I have great respect for NDB as they never blinked in any of the 3 wars I've seen them. It's ok to blink, lol. They pushed the button on HRS like buying a Coke at a vending machine.
Well damn, strato. You should write a book on us. Would love to war spectre but it's going to have to wait till next age, a bigger green just waved us. I think we're going to have some fun with them.Quote:
Originally Posted by StratOcastle
I fail to understand, since when choosing your fights in an intelligent manner has become something bad and to condemn? I was under the impression Utopia was about who is better at schemes, strategizing, more cunning, higher skilled and better at speculating and more patient in waiting. Also, social skills, diplo skills are a huge part of the game if not the biggest, as clearly shown each eoa when stuff begins to escalate. Sure, we can debate if all the above is good or bad for the game, but that doesn`t change the reality. This IS the game and WAS the game ever since I first played from the very first ages. You can adapt to it, you can master it, or you can come on the forums and rant nonsensical stuff about X, Y, Z.
Reading some of the Spectre`s critics` post, I am lead to think that they are playing a different game. You have the extremes.
1) The kindergarten emo flower power puppies ... Anything is a double hostile. Everything is persecution. The whole world is against them. Survival of the fittest is offensive !!! Some decades ago, 18-20 years old men were marching into war. Nowadays, 18-20 years old men are gluten-free and cry that "words hurt!".
2) The wannabe smart "playaz". They think of themselves as being smart and game. Most of them have very high opinions about themselves, even if they`re dumb as a rock and even a dead camel in the desert`s brain is sharper than theirs. They want wars when they have the edge. They want to "trick" the opponent, play him. And if the enemy declines, they go all rampage and trashtalk the enemy.
As for Jerks and Spectre. They have fixed their disputes. Thumbs up for Jerks for having the cojones.
As for Spectre. Spectre started as 22, a Kd with a full new management, growing in time to 25. However, as it wasn`t something particularly planned, the Kd setup had some minor lacks so to speak and planned around those lacks: waving, warring etc.
Ending up with an addition to the already mentioned bigger Kds. Before you call Spectre cowards, you might want to know two facts.
1) Spectre warred SS. It was a loss, however, they pulled off quite a proper executed end war scheme, ending up with a handful of extra acres and honor before Wding.
2) Spectre waved FS 1/4 into the age. FS had a different warring target in the "person" of a 1-2 mils lower nw Kd than both Spectre and FS. You can understand however what 1-2 mils nw means 1/4 from start of age.
Happy Holidays!
Spectre (steward) declined my first invite to war (I often open with, "do you like to party?") due to the long weekend being a low activity time for them. The second time I got no reply at all. The third time will be my generals making the request :p... well.. maybe when I'm not a TM, so next age?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tash
It is starting to seem as if everyone wants to war Spectre now...
I've found virtue in the way the last few wars have materialized for Jerks. This is a personal opinion, not that of Jerks.
I'm not saying we should throw diplo out - It's a resource. What I am saying is, the button sure cuts a lot of fat out of the negotiations. We went to a few of these wars and lost, but that's on us. We won one and got a couple recruits from the affair.
I liked Spectres war tactics because they reminded me of a war fought a number of ages ago. It could've been coincidental, but I was intrigued to see some nw attention. As mentioned before, we (Jerks) had a good initial push. Spectre began to gut our mid-nw early on and it was clear on the kingdom page. Not province by province, but a kingdom push. Very nice.
@ all. As a tier group of formidable war kingdoms I'd like to urge you to learn or teach (if you know) homes pump and soldier trading. It's not that it's a need, but to exercise the knowledge when you face certain kingdoms. Or, understand the strategies used against you. A number of these things require tedious activity, but it's good to know in emergencies.
Another would be acre digestion. I began paying attention to virtually secure acres when I noted AMAs top feeder strat. What this involves is strategically moving acres to hardened provinces. Unlike the faery bottom feed dealio, the common race combo is elf/halfer in a central nw guard position. - I'd never urge kingdoms to build similar strats because I believe in the individual character of kingdoms. I think the common player should familiarize themselves with kingdom alignments to draw inspiration for their own ideas.
Keep having fun.
What war Strato?
I could've sworn it was Misfit Toys, but i'm not good at remembering the nuances of which toy kingdom it was. I was with Plaidovia running a dwarf cleric.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kandy
I can't recall their top makeup, but I remember we had more top provinces. I was impressed because Plaidovia was both bigger and more active, but these guys used intelligent tactics.
One similarity that I thought was pure coincidence was the dwarf contingent. The other kingdom had a dwarf merchant camper at the sub top nw juncture much like Goldfinger. He wasn't attacking but was online quite a bit. Hmm, maybe I should array this kingdom to offer a better picture:
1- top provinces:
* mix of t/ms and turtles
2- sub top:
was the dwarf merchant camper, an obviously experienced avian warrior, and an inexperienced avian tac
3- center nw:
was a wide gap because our Plaidovian core took immediate control.
4- bottom nw:
The enemy had an orc camper who was on constantly. I wondered if they took sitting shifts with this guy, lol.
Anyways, the dwarf merchant would sit and absorb ms; or had them MVd. He didn't move till the avians had created a gap over our center nw attackers. Then, whenever one of our bigs sent out he would snap into action and feed them through the avians plus a smattering of semi-actives. The small orc then made his move to render our bigs to trigger overpopulation.
I noticed this and when my next turn came I held my army. I'm very active so I played the waiting game. Eventually there must've been some schedule so the dwarf deployed on my cleric with my armies home. My tactic was to force them to use less taps and thus release as few dspecs as possible. I'm a GS guy btw. I weathered that situation with 2 trads/2 ambushes but still fell below the nw belt established by the avians. Since I play gap I made several efforts to break through and cut off their chain, but the avian warrior mirrored my every move. I tried to circumvent the warrior and stack acres off the fat avian tac. As dwarf with free build this was futile because the avian attack times outran my build strat. I was thwarted and lost every exchange.
In essence the enemy used about 5 provinces to control the war by intuitive nw leverage. This is one example of why I'm firmly a team guy over traditional pure chaining waves. They reliably fed all our bigs down to finally secure a victory. You could argue Plaidovia should've switched tactics, but I've been in some formidable war kingdoms that simply run the same way. Yeah, more organized, but still they swear by a system I've seen defeated first hand.
* You'll notice no mention of ops because the enemy kingdom lacked activity in this regard. Plaidovia being a tagged war kingdom already had our t/ms in lower nw position from previous wars. The diplo environment was difficult in attempting to explore t/ms up, so you understand some of Plaidovias alignment.
I am the steward during peace times. The second time you wrote us, I was travelling with a lot on my schedule. I have seen your message and wanted to reply whenever I would get a moment to breath. But as it always happens, when one thing got done, another one popped, so eventually I just forgot. Mea culpa. That does not mean however a lack of respect towards you and it doesn`t change the fact that, unless we contacted you for war, the answer remains the same as when we first talked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tash
As for a third time, being your generals making the request. That doesn`t raise any feeling for me:) Each of us does what he/she has got to do. One attacks, the other one responds by whether fighting back, or if the situation is not favorable, wait for a better moment to fight back. As long as I got a say in Spectre, little as it is, we will not march into nonsensical, kamikaze wars just to prove a point. And if you however see me going in one of these wars ... then you at least know some funky sh!t`s about to happen. In the limits of 1 vs 1 honorable combat, of course. We`re noobs liking this 1 vs 1 thing, unlike the honor crown who`s a kingdom of 130+ people so to speak:)
Just a quick not from one of the "generals". Much respect for Spectre for posting their views. I personally do appreciate it. But playing the card that it was an unfavourable war for you isnt accurate. You would have been clear favourites. You were bigger than us in every way.
As tash stated though, we currently have a slight tiff with Green, which is a hell of a lot of fun, so if fate brings us to each other again next age, and we are both in a position to war, I would love the chance.
This is what utopia should be! Solid kingdoms, with honourable ethics, battling it out for supremacy!
Size isnt all that matters. and as said our main reason for turning it down was the pyro conflict which we had before and which made us decide to look for an somewhat easier war. That said after all the hassle and everything, hipmunks being one of the kds turning it down we did conclude that we shouldve taken the fight, but well at that time of your offer we didnt knew that all other kds would turn us down for weeks.
Favorable. Unfavorable. It is a matter of being subjective. When I look at an enemy Kd, I put myself in their shoes, take what they have and sketch a strategy against us. According to the results, I vote for the war, or vote against it. A counter for us was really really easy. Maybe too easy, so people just say "nah, can`t be that easy, now can it?". And yes, we were bigger as a Kd, but the "big" wasn`t on the right provinces.Quote:
Originally Posted by ThRaZe
As for next age, we both are looking for as much quality as this game has still left to offer so if in the future we`ll meet, may the best man win:)
The war was actually kinda close?
Where does revrev play?
Not in Spectre tetley.. we would like to know where he plays as well :)
It'd be funny if he were in our kingdom.
"Come on, guys!?"
"dude..dude"
I'd like to take this opportunity to object the topic of this thread.
I also have to agree that Jerks deserve a lot of credits for pushing the button. We did not see it coming. Of course, we were still in a very good position to win the war, being bigger than them.
In regards to wars being turned down: it happens all the time....doesn't sound like a big deal to me. I mean, war offers are turned down more often than they are accepted. They're also often made with the view of having a certain advantage against the kd you're offering a war. And often the target kd has 'better things to do'. Heck, we were about to war FS (not really knowing it was FS at the time) when they suddenly had better things to do. Good for us probably, I already suspected we were going to lose that one :D
It all depends. If a kingdom gets to set conditions then they are angling for favor. I was thinking of a war age not long ago when I was with a casual war kingdom. The previous age we were waved by FREE and I was impressed with their incredible offense and mass wave. So I was keeping an on them when I saw:
FREE defeated Stronghold in a long war. I was contacting a core avian throughout for updates.
Into The Blue(BoB) defeated FREE.
ED defeated Into The Blue(BoB).
Rusty defeated ED.
This may've also been the last war age for Pyro, but I may have my ages mixed up.
Pyro and Roughknecks fight a war that never ends, EoA.
You may know the field of war kingdoms better than I do. I never had to track the competition. I think the margin for error was fairly low during that era.