Hear Hear Elurin. I agree, if Palem wants this to happen - change 19 of your provs race next age. It's just a freaken word. Create an example for us to follow!
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Hear Hear Elurin. I agree, if Palem wants this to happen - change 19 of your provs race next age. It's just a freaken word. Create an example for us to follow!
I can't speak for all, but the last 3 kingdoms I've played for had no issues with having active players who might have to put a sitter for a war. Which kingdoms where the ones you spoke to? Just being curious.. can't imagine it to be as you say.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheister
I like the initiative to urge people to step up and do pro stuffies and be big, but people have a point that you cant make people do stuffies, unless you arent doing them yourself. Like in RL, if you want people to do something, do it first and people will follow you and they will do the same. Always better to be a leader, than a boss.
For example Floggers KD swept the floor with the top last age with their wararing. Thanks to that, i wanted to be in the same nw size and warar them, just for the challenge! They showed the lead ! so if you want more top wararing KDs, go show the lead and then some others will take that "challenge" and follow you.
But on the other side, if we (sillCats) warar in middle ranks, then the KDs we warar will be better for the experience and making them stronger, thus allowing them to grow into top(ish) KDs faster. right ? Cause i remember when we were still small kitties and warared many pro KDs like Bunnies, Balance and most of all FS, then those hard challenges made us stronger and work towards getting even better. It would have never happened if those KDs would have been in top 10, cause we werent in top 10 when we started.
Again, i like the initiative! a bit wrong person to post it, might have brought better feedback if someone else had posted it, but very good initiative still.
The easiest way to ignore the top 10 and have a good time is to stay small enough that you are not worth their time. If you do not like their style of play, politics, ego, etc. then you are a lunatic to grow. Let them get big and whine that no one wants to play with them. Eventually, they will either stop doing what they are doing because it is boring to do the same thing age after age with the same 5 kingdoms or leave (assuming you do not leave first, which is probably more likley as they seem to have fun by sitting and pumping and dicing so...... clearly they can occupy themselves for hours with just self spells.)
/me shrugs
I didn't read this whole thread, but I remembered one important thing from the first five pages:
Large kingdoms are Top kingdoms and thus are the Best kingdoms?
Did I summarize it well?
In that case. Thanks for the info.
People believe/know that top KDs will still recruit you, even if you said you can't be available 24 hours a day and may or may not leave army home during war? I don't believe that is true.
flogger challenged them before the age even started iirc ;pQuote:
Originally Posted by Sheister
And you're wrong. I'm quite sure we wouldn't back away from a fight and I'm pretty sure Rage wouldn't either. I don't think any of the current top kingdoms would really say no to a fight (iirc most waves resulted in a war this age)
It could be just me, but i find it kinda weak attitude. And even if people stay small, but will be actively playing, then in some time they will personally grow so much that it is not possible for them to not be close to the top. Every people has their inner "growing" time. When people are ready they will make the next step. Its just matter of time and willingness to learn.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheister
By your way of thinking the game would die fast. imo
If you can win hard fought wars, you can also grow/whore or whatever you want to call it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elurin
Not sure if every kingdom you fought last age was more active than yours.. I actually doubt it based on what I saw in priv channels :P
And if I remember correctly, Sillurin said can has! but in the end Pulse maxexplorared anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by prot
Melee Weapons will apparently be trying Growth/Land/Warring at the top next age and if they do not I am leaving. This was the promise made to me so watch this space! Just a case of recruiting 25 provinces again now and explaining to everyone this is our goal!
What is this fact based on? I think you're horribly wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yadda9To5
The activity spikes when there is a fight going on and that is the same for every other kingdom. Top or midsized or ghetto kingdom, once you're in a fight your activity blooms.
If you want to be a warring kingdom, but not want to grow to the size of top 10 you will certainly grow to the top 20-50 range, just by winning wars. I'm pretty sure most of the possible "challengers" of the top 10 who deliberately stay our of reach will be in that range of the charts. So inevitably you will be warring pretty strong kingdoms at some point in the age.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoneyBadger
I think it's a bit arrogant to think the top 10 acres and networth are the best kingdoms on the server and to say the ones in the top 20-50 (cats, pewpew, Fs, divinity, "us") are afraid of them. I'm sure Abs, HoH and kingdoms like them are very good, but I challenge them to do it differently one age and to stay "smaller" and go for war wins instead of growing the fastest. See how good they really are. Search for the cats, divinity, fs, pewpew, so you can challenge them, instead of yelling from a tower that you are the best. With all the respect in the world, I think being #1 nw and size isn't easy and therefore deserves appreciation and respect, but you can't blame others for avoiding the top 10. You are feeding yourself to the lions.
As the top 10 is basically all NAPed with each other, surely any new comer would just be fed upon by all of them as they are the only viable target? An interesting mechanic/idea top kingdoms could introduce is to remove NAPs with each other and hit each other as if they were a new comer?
Nobody will complain if your army is in a few hours when you're not fighting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lestat
Nobody will complain if you can't be active in a conflict and assign a sitter for the time being.
So you're badmouthing the top for telling you to grow and instead you tell them to stay small? Wow.Quote:
Originally Posted by Robar1980
And who is 'us' ?
http://forums.utopia-game.com/showth...6#post15204486Quote:
Originally Posted by prot
This is an Idea in another game which I find would improve Utopia. Please give peoples Idea/Feedbacks!
And you stayed small on purpose then I suppose? Iirc you ooped on <500 or even on 415?Quote:
Originally Posted by TeddybearSTHLM
As much as you like to stay small, we prefer to stay big and fight Absalom, who are a good competition to fight.
Mind you, no disrespect to any other kingdom. There are several good ones who don't back away from a fight but I'm also aware of the fact there is quite a few self-proclaimed warring kingdoms who will only engage wars they are guaranteed to win.
This has been suggested a few times before (not in the exact way you display it but pretty similar) iirc but they're not going to implement it as it gives room for abuse.Quote:
Originally Posted by American Badass
If it came with a cap though I don't see how it could be abused? Albeit some kingdoms could abuse it in certain wars trying to have it so all 24 provs are always accesible but then you could also introduce 2/3 Substitutes MAX per kingdom at one time.
Oh, I don't dispute that it is a very cynical way of looking at the game. But seriously, after my recent experiences trying to compete in the top, I am simply disgusted by them all.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoneyBadger
Yes, we do naturally grow. We always finish between 8 and 15 someplace. By then however the top 5 are SO big that they will never contact us.
No, you are horribly blind. Below is data from a well known targetfinder that logs the activity sign. Basically blue = prov can be online that tick. Of course sitting is hidden.Quote:
Originally Posted by prot
Rage: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35431962/Ut...ivity/rage.png
Sanct: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35431962/Ut.../sanctuary.png
Xmas part (top war kd): https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35431962/Ut...as%20party.png
BoB (top war kd): https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35431962/Ut...tivity/bob.png
ranked 100 kd: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35431962/Ut...tivity/100.png
a ghetto: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/35431962/Ut...e%20ghetto.png
Notice how the lower tier kingdoms just aren't created equal. Besides, like sheister, i've been told more than a few times i'd not be welcome into the top (When i did well in a ghetto, i was asked to join, when i told i slept, i was told told "You're not the kind of player we look for, i think you're better off to stay where you are"). Of course this is anecdotal. But honestly, this pretence that top and activity are unrelated is getting old.
To Palem: Look at it the other way, the game already is top-heavy and you want to create more top. A better way to improve the top is to improve the bottom/get more players that actual play the game. Then lower ranked kds will automatically move up. For the game to succeed, it must be rewarding to casual players as well, and as ages go by, it gets less rewarding each age.
@yadda, how were those graphs generated...i wanna see my kd. because i think those "online" hours are wrong. i think my prov shows online every tick and i dont log in ALOT. I dont even have the full activity for the in game recruitment meter to stay full most of the time.
Its our first age big, no alliance no nothing....geting naped with every top 10 kd is NOT that hard to do. probably spent 30-40 or so hours doing "diplomacy" this age. of those 30-40 i'd say a good 10 were simply because of Slaves, stupid morbo.Quote:
Originally Posted by American Badass
prot, go read the thread silly. http://forums.utopia-game.com/showth...vs-ghetto-cats For one it's obviously trolling by flogger, for another it says to stay as small as possible so don't try to make up another story now. If you truly had wanted to war us, there would've been an answer on my acceptance.
Am I badmouthing?? Where, if I may ask? I respect the top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by prot
And where I'm in doesn't matter, we choose not to tag yet and I choose not to tell.
All I'm saying is that it would be nice to see the top 10 war those kingdoms who are seen by them as afraid, ghetto bashers, etcetera. They won't enter the lions den just because Palem is asking them. It would be suicide. But for Abs to go "underground" for an age and try to find and war the ones I mentioned, now that would be "interesting". And it would be far more interesting than seeing one of the others grow into the top 10 and get hammered because of all the NAPS.
You failed to get my point. When a kingdom engages a conflict, the activity blooms. Regardless if top, mid or bottom, the activity goes up. It's just a natural thing that automatically happens because you have more things to do and probably because it's less boring to be in war as it is to be out of war.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yadda9To5
So my point is still the same; no matter how small/big your kingdom is, when you go to hostile/war, the activity of your kingdom spikes compared to your normal day.
And please, name me the kingdoms you've applied to. I can't remember having denied a player because he might not be active in a conflict if he/she would assign a sitter if that were to be the case. I keep hearing top kingdoms dont recruit me because of those reasons and yet the last 3-4 I've played for welcomed the normal active player and used sitter in times of war if needed.
flogger trolling? Unlikely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elurin
You're calling the top10 arrogant, I consider that badmouthing even if only a very light form.Quote:
Originally Posted by Robar1980
Here's the biggest reason for less 'top' kingdoms and numbers don't lie.
Back around early 2000's you had atleast 100,000 people which gave 4,000 full kingdoms (minimum number of kingdoms possible).
Now there are only 7100 players which gives roughly 284 kingdoms full kingdoms (minimum number of kingdoms possible).
This is a 3,716 kingdom difference between before and now.
My point is if you want more kingdoms to compete at the top then make the game more popular and until then it will stay as it is now.
activity needed? pfft. just slack around!
Sorry, I assumed you knew the thread. In it flogger suggested we both (cats and pulse) meet at 400 acres oop and duke it out.Quote:
Originally Posted by prot
well, I have to agree palem knows how to make community go wild... and despite what I said earlyer, if 2-3 kds decides to grow up there and give it a try and even palem decides to change his status of "observer in top 10" and start fighting aswell, then this thread was not made for nothing.
I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, but its pretty obvious that most of you are missing the point.
SPGC don't want to play in the t5?
Why are people trying to push them into something they don't want to do. Their skill level and activity is irrelevant.
Everyone in this game plays for different reasons. Whether it be fun play or top play or warring who are any of us to critisize them?
Considering SPGC have only lost 1 war in their past 25 maybe you should all try and war them and beat them if you are so worried about beating the best and stop focusing on trying to push them towards a goal that they have no desire of reaching.
btw whats up with the huge amount of 20-22 prov kds starting at #9 an overcrowding prettymuch the entire chart? I seem to remember there was alot mor 25prov kds last age?
I think that is because there are so many 20 province KDs that it is a lot easier to go for more wars if you stay at 20-22 KDs. It is very challenging, especially OOP, to get a war as a 25 province KD. This is just more evidence that KD size should likely be dropped to 20-22.
/me shrugs.
Well, that's just a matter of different opinions then. I can live with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by prot
Where did I say TFC was immune to any of my criticisms? TFC is terrible and shouldn't be anywhere close to the top 10. That's what started this rant in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by Korp
What's shocking is that you've somehow let your idea of fun get warped into this lazy-mode crap where you would rather steamroll a ghetto who hits you 3 times a day rather than someone who could actually challenge and beat you. Turn off easy mode and get better.Quote:
Originally Posted by sheeplovebeer
Stop making excuses for others?Quote:
Originally Posted by prot
Aside from that TFC is getting better every age. Can Beastblood claim the same? There's something your kd can get better at, so go do it instead of wasting time telling me I run a 25 faery kd. I know that already.
Here's an example to follow:Quote:
Originally Posted by Lestat
10 The Faery Circle (x:x) Icia 113,403 acres
Kd that can't attack is beating out 355 other kds (97% of the game). That's a joke.
SPGC have/had certain reasons for staying out of the top, which used to be legit. You needed to be involved with a lot of diplo. Wars weren't so easy to come by. These are no longer legitimate and they COULD be incredibly successful if they would just try. They wouldn't even need to change their playstyle that they enjoy so much. They choose not to try (much like MANY other kds) and they will forever lose because of it. I'm here to tell them to try because the game environment blows.Quote:
Originally Posted by maccar86
Actually you seem to have no clue what our reasons are. As Elurin pointed out we fought better(and harder) wars this age than any of the "top10" kds we fought last age (except BIO). Dunno what you base your argument that wars are harder up top on, cause it can't be experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by Palem
What are your reasons then?
Cause you throw **** all around you but not at your own kd.Quote:
Where did I say TFC was immune to any of my criticisms? TFC is terrible and shouldn't be anywhere close to the top 10. That's what started this rant in the first place.
Its more interesting to stay where the competition is more fierce, being high in the top dont actually make you better at warring just look at your own kd :PQuote:
What are your reasons then?